KSP without mods

[chimpbone]

Being forced to play the broken console 1.1.0 with no mods really shows how bad the actual game is. It has become obvious to me that Squad has used the PC modding community as a pool of free workers. I have never seen a game that so heavily relied on mods to function well. Looking at a list of mods for this game blows my mind. There are currently way more modders working on this game than actual staff, and it seems that is how it always has been. 

Want the game to look nice? Well you need mods. Want winches? Mods. Computer controlled flight? Mods. Different launch sites? Mods. Earth instead of Kerbin? Mods. More parts? Mods. More realism? Mods. Want more mods? Mods. 

Everything I want out of this game is available in the form of mods on PC, which I have no access to. Perhaps all this modding is preventing Squad from ever putting anything in their actual game. I think they saw the modders and thought, "Hey, we don't need to actually develop this game ourselves. They are doing it for free." 

Well, Kudos to the modding community for making such an amazing game, but too bad I will probably never get to play that great game. I wish Squad had cared half as much about their game as the modding community seems to. For those of us who are stuck with the vanilla KSP, version 1.1.0 at that, we are left with a wholly different experience with KSP. 

What I have noticed from a lot of different comments is that the people on PC like to play this game differently. Mods make that an option. On console with vanilla KSP, we are stuck playing the game one way, which isn't that fun, and it gets old quick. 

Oh well. If I end up getting a nicer PC in a couple months, I will certainly be checking out KSP again, along with some of the awesome looking mods out there on offer. But KSP on console is just lazy and bad. 

[DuoDex]

KSP on console does not support mods. This is how it was from the beginning, how it is now, and how it will be in the future.

There were no plans to support mods, nor was there any announcement from Squad implying that mod support would be available on console. If you look on the forums, you can find several different threads discussing mods on console. All of them say that there are no mods, so thinking that buying KSP on console entitles you to mods seems a bit misinformed to me.

Saying that KSP is "lazy and bad" on console because there are no mods makes no sense; while there are reasons to think KSP on console is bad, mod support is not one of them. Vanilla KSP is what's on console. If you want mods, you want the PC version.

[chimpbone]

1 hour ago, DuoDex said:

KSP on console does not support mods. This is how it was from the beginning, how it is now, and how it will be in the future.

There were no plans to support mods, nor was there any announcement from Squad implying that mod support would be available on console. If you look on the forums, you can find several different threads discussing mods on console. All of them say that there are no mods, so thinking that buying KSP on console entitles you to mods seems a bit misinformed to me.

Saying that KSP is "lazy and bad" on console because there are no mods makes no sense; while there are reasons to think KSP on console is bad, mod support is not one of them. Vanilla KSP is what's on console. If you want mods, you want the PC version.

I understand that mods are not coming to console. That wasn't my point. My point was that mods made the game good, while the vanilla game, especially the current broken console version 1.1.0, isn't that good or polished. 

It's deceiving because what you see isn't what you get what KSP on console. How were we to know that the game was so heavily modded and that it relied on those mods for a majority of the PC player base to enjoy it? I did not know that before I bought the game. What I knew was that the game got really good reviews and that people said that "Squad really listened to the community."

Mods not being a part of KSP only happened when KSP came to console, so it was never really an issue before. 

My point was that if all the sudden PC players were stuck with vanilla KSP v1.1.0, would they enjoy the game and keep playing? The point was that a lot of the mods should probably be in the actual game but because of Squad's decisions to have mods essentially develop their game for them but without getting paid, the actual base game is really lacking. None of us console players knew any of this before we bought the game. 

Don't you think that for the most of the KSP community, their continued enjoyment of KSP has a little to do with mods?

KSP without access to mods simply isn't the same game, and certainly doesn't deserve the same price tag. Mods get more attention from Squad than console KSP because they know how much value that mods add to their game. KSP on console, without access to mods, feels very light on content, and is lacking any such value.

As somebody who has access to mods, I am not sure why you are trying to argue, and calling me entitled and misinformed because I was making an observation. It doesn't sound like you are stuck with a broken console v1.1.0 with no access to mods.

And KSP isn't just "lazy and bad" because there are no mods. I never said that. There are plenty of reasons that KSP on consoles is lazy and bad, and Flying Tiger is at the top of that list. I really think you missed the whole point of my post. 

Edited October 20, 2016 by chimpbone

[stibbons]

2 hours ago, chimpbone said:

It's deceiving because what you see isn't what you get what KSP on console. How were we to know that the game was so heavily modded and that it relied on those mods for a majority of the PC player base to enjoy it? I did not know that before I bought the game. What I knew was that the game got really good reviews and that people said that "Squad really listened to the community."

Please give me one source that deceived you by misrepresenting the game in the way you describe.

[DD_bwest]

Vanilla KSP is fine,   but the console version still needs updating for the bugs lol  the only thing i think it "needs"  is information readouts, like i use mechjebs custom info windows.  even just basic info would be nice, i dont need the extra fancy stuff.   thats actually the only mod i have right now, but ive played it heavily modded including a couple RSS careers.

well that and Mouse + keyboard support lol (and fixing the broken trophy, i want my platinum lol)

i dont know anyone who actually thought mods would come to console.  thats a headache for large AAA games.

(im a double dipper, PC and PS4)

[chimpbone]

1 hour ago, DD_bwest said:

Vanilla KSP is fine,   but the console version still needs updating for the bugs lol  the only thing i think it "needs"  is information readouts, like i use mechjebs custom info windows.  even just basic info would be nice, i dont need the extra fancy stuff.   thats actually the only mod i have right now, but ive played it heavily modded including a couple RSS careers.

well that and Mouse + keyboard support lol (and fixing the broken trophy, i want my platinum lol)

i dont know anyone who actually thought mods would come to console.  thats a headache for large AAA games.

(im a double dipper, PC and PS4)

Thanks for the reply. Information readouts should be a standard. It would make getting into a target orbit a lot easier on console. It might even make things like IVA missions possible. Not sure why I have to switch to the map to get all that info. In my opinion, there are a lot of things that probably should have made it into the base game before they were calling it "finished." I think that vanilla KSP probably could have been and should have been a lot better. 

I think the vanilla game can look good at times, but overall it looks quite bad compared to modern games, and especially compared to what it can look like with some visual mods. Planet textures are horrible, especially when orbiting. The graphics are generally outdated. It also doesn't run well on console, so it's not like they traded performance for better graphics or anything. 

You seem to be the only one I have seen on here who actually owns the game on both console and PC. What do you think is the benefit, if any, of playing this game on console, without access to mods, it's game breaking bugs, and with no mouse and keyboard support?

 

[DD_bwest]

console has the same advantages any console game has and pc has the same it always has.

ps4 lets you play on yor tv rather than monitor.  some people prefer controllers.  you can sit on a couch vs computer chair.  trophies are nice.  share buttom for people without capture cards.

my main reason for double dip was so my kids could play, since i don't like them touching my computer lol that and i wanted to support a game i love.  and grab the trophies lol pretty sure the platinum will be a rare one. and id have it if it wasnt broken lol

[chimpbone]

5 hours ago, DD_bwest said:

console has the same advantages any console game has and pc has the same it always has.

ps4 lets you play on yor tv rather than monitor.  some people prefer controllers.  you can sit on a couch vs computer chair.  trophies are nice.  share buttom for people without capture cards.

my main reason for double dip was so my kids could play, since i don't like them touching my computer lol that and i wanted to support a game i love.  and grab the trophies lol pretty sure the platinum will be a rare one. and id have it if it wasnt broken lol

PC's can run on big monitors, and use controllers. I don't know why somebody would want to play this game from the couch as the text is way too small. I don't personally care about trophies or achievements. PC's also have the ability to capture pictures or videos. 

Not wanting your kids to be on your nice PC seems like the most valid reason to me. Haha. And you want them to still be able to check out KSP and learn about physics and science. That's cool. I completely understand that. 

I personally don't see any advantages to KSP on console, although I see lots of advantages to owning KSP on PC. 

[klesh]

19 hours ago, chimpbone said:

 I don't know why somebody would want to play this game from the couch as the text is way too small.

 

On PC at your couch, you'd be using version 1.2, which has vectored text and is much easier on the eyes at distance.  

[swjr-swis]

On 10/19/2016 at 7:05 PM, chimpbone said:

Want winches? Mods. Computer controlled flight? Mods. Different launch sites? Mods. Earth instead of Kerbin? Mods. More parts? Mods. More realism? Mods. Want more mods? Mods.

"Blah, if I want to play a different game than KSP, I have to overload it with mods to make it be different. How rude."

Elementary, my dear Watson.

Oh, but you chose a platform that does not allow modding to begin with. Hmm. Well, who exactly is to blame about that, I wonder...?

[chimpbone]

1 minute ago, swjr-swis said:

"Blah, if I want to play a different game than KSP, I have to overload it with mods to make it be different. How rude."

Elementary, my dear Watson.

Oh, but you chose a platform that does not allow modding to begin with. Hmm. Well, who exactly is to blame about that, I wonder...?

Does trying to put down other people make you feel smart and better about yourself? Cool dude. You obviously can't read because I wasn't complaining about mods not being on console wise guy. 

[swjr-swis]

Just now, chimpbone said:

You obviously can't read because I wasn't complaining about mods not being on console wise guy. 

Interesting. Let's see what the OP actually says:

On 10/19/2016 at 7:05 PM, chimpbone said:

Being forced to play the broken console 1.1.0 with no mods really shows how bad the actual game is.

On 10/19/2016 at 7:05 PM, chimpbone said:

Everything I want out of this game is available in the form of mods on PC, which I have no access to

On 10/19/2016 at 7:05 PM, chimpbone said:

Mods make that an option. On console with vanilla KSP, we are stuck playing the game one way

I wonder how I got that crazy idea...

[chimpbone]

Just now, swjr-swis said:

Interesting. Let's see what the OP actually says:

I wonder how I got that crazy idea...

The point was actually that a lot of the mods should be in the base game, not that mods should be on console. Thanks. 

[swjr-swis]

2 minutes ago, chimpbone said:

The point was actually that a lot of the mods should be in the base game, not that mods should be on console. Thanks.

Which goes back to the first part of what I said: you obviously want a different game than KSP. The beauty of KSP though, is that in stock, they have made it possible to mod the game to cater for all kinds of different things people want out of the game, not just your particular set of differences.

"Want the game to look nice? We made it possible to load a mod for that. Want winches? Mods. Computer controlled flight? Mods. Different launch sites? Mods. Earth instead of Kerbin? Mods. More parts? Mods. More realism? Mods. Want more mods? Mods. Want 1001 other things that you did not mention? Mods. We made it possible, in the stock game. We even created an API, documented it, and let you talk to the devs on how to do all these things. I know, most game companies don't do this, but we did anyway. You're welcome."

[chimpbone]

1 minute ago, swjr-swis said:

Which goes back to the first part of what I said: you obviously want a different game than KSP. The beauty of KSP though, is that in stock, they have made it possible to mod the game to cater for all kinds of different things people want out of the game, not just your particular set of differences.

"Want the game to look nice? We made it possible to load a mod for that. Want winches? Mods. Computer controlled flight? Mods. Different launch sites? Mods. Earth instead of Kerbin? Mods. More parts? Mods. More realism? Mods. Want more mods? Mods. Want 1001 other things that you did not mention? Mods. We made it possible, in the stock game. We even created an API, documented it, and let you talk to the devs on how to do all these things. I know, most game companies don't do this, but we did anyway. You're welcome."

Mods were a way for them to develop the game as cheap as possible. It shows in the "finished" product. You are just trying to argue and you don't even understand my point, and I certainly do not want to deal with condescending people on the internet like you. Go bug someone else. 

What was your point in responding to this post even? You trying to help me out here or just put me down buddy? 

So yeah, I wanted KSP to be better, look better, run better. Not a different game like you say. You seem to have a problem with that though. Just go away please. I am not going to respond to you anymore. Stop pestering me.

[Ten Key]

On 10/19/2016 at 11:05 AM, chimpbone said:

I have never seen a game that so heavily relied on mods to function well. Looking at a list of mods for this game blows my mind. There are currently way more modders working on this game than actual staff, and it seems that is how it always has been. 

For the record, my Morrowind install is sitting right around eight gigs of data, the vast majority of which are mod files. The game came out 14 years ago and people are still making mods for it. It really doesn't even look like the same game any more. . .

Spoiler

Games with good modding support tend to attract a modding community, and when that happens it doesn't take long for the modders to vastly outnumber the developers. There's nothing sinister going on-- it's just math.

And for what it's worth, stock KSP used to look like this. . .

Spoiler

 

The stock game has come a long way, even without mods. 

[stibbons]

8 hours ago, chimpbone said:

So yeah, I wanted KSP to be better, look better, run better. Not a different game like you say.

These two sentences are at complete odds unless you bought a game without looking at it first.

And you still haven't cited any attempt at deception.

[chimpbone]

6 hours ago, Ten Key said:

For the record, my Morrowind install is sitting right around eight gigs of data, the vast majority of which are mod files. The game came out 14 years ago and people are still making mods for it. It really doesn't even look like the same game any more. . .

  Reveal hidden contents

Games with good modding support tend to attract a modding community, and when that happens it doesn't take long for the modders to vastly outnumber the developers. There's nothing sinister going on-- it's just math.

And for what it's worth, stock KSP used to look like this. . .

  Reveal hidden contents

 

The stock game has come a long way, even without mods. 

I never said it was sinister. I was saying that it was a cheap, lazy way to develop a game, and that it shows in the "finished" product. I am not impressed is what I am saying. Good idea for a game, but a bad game and an even worse port to console. 

14 minutes ago, stibbons said:

These two sentences are at complete odds unless you bought a game without looking at it first.

And you still haven't cited any attempt at deception.

Those sentences are not at odds. I still am not sure why you want a citation. If you are just here to argue or to try and put me down, just go away please. 

 

 

 

Edited October 22, 2016 by chimpbone

[stibbons]

1 minute ago, chimpbone said:

I never said the word deception

 

On 20/10/2016 at 1:25 PM, chimpbone said:

It's deceiving

You need to stop mistaking being proven wrong for being put down.

Edited October 22, 2016 by stibbons

[chimpbone]

32 minutes ago, stibbons said:

 

You need to stop mistaking being proven wrong for being put down.

 

You didn't prove me wrong, you just wanted to be condescending, rude, and point out that I said the word "deceiving"?

I said the word deceiving, not deception. Those are different words, since you like being petty so much. Guess you don't like being proven wrong, huh? This is where I stop responding to your posts. There is a reason I didn't respond to your first one.  

Edited October 22, 2016 by chimpbone

[Firemetal]

I know console players are mad but this is ridiculous.

What if Squad made KSP vanilla only? No mods? What if no one made mods? All I want is DV readout, TWR readout and something similar to KAC. However I could very well calculate my own DV and TWR and I can live without KAC.

I have heard the console version is buggy. However Squad are not just going to let it drop. They are going to patch it and they'd be horrible devs if they didn't. Squad are great. They are going to fix it.

If you can't play without mods, don't play console.

Fire 

[chimpbone]

1 hour ago, Firemetal said:

I know console players are mad but this is ridiculous.

What if Squad made KSP vanilla only? No mods? What if no one made mods? All I want is DV readout, TWR readout and something similar to KAC. However I could very well calculate my own DV and TWR and I can live without KAC.

I have heard the console version is buggy. However Squad are not just going to let it drop. They are going to patch it and they'd be horrible devs if they didn't. Squad are great. They are going to fix it.

If you can't play without mods, don't play console.

Fire 

Not quite sure why you decided to respond here. Didn't get enough of harassing console players in the devnotes thread? You saw people trying to put me down in here and you thought you would join them? Classic. What's with so many people being so condescending and patronizing on here? 

If the point of you posting was to annoy me and confuse me, you have succeeded. Putting you on the list of people to not respond to. That list is getting quite long now. 

I realize that you think that I was saying that there shouldn't be mods in KSP, probably from the title. Maybe read the post next time to understand the context before you respond to what you think I said. 

 

Edited October 22, 2016 by chimpbone

[Firemetal]

11 minutes ago, chimpbone said:

Not quite sure why you decided to respond here. Didn't get enough of harassing console players in the devnotes thread? You saw people trying to put me down in here and you thought you would join them? Classic. What's with so many people being so condescending and patronizing on here? 

If the point of you posting was to annoy me and confuse me, you have succeeded. Putting you on the list of people to not respond to. That list is getting quite long now. 

 

Harassing? .-. Mate... I'm not sure you know the meaning of "harassing". I was defending the KSP devs and KSP itself. You're treating KSP as if it is a 2 star game that needs mods made by the community to actually be something fun. Mods are nice to have around but its wrong to get to the point where you're actually insulting the game and the people who made the game because you cannot use community-made add-ons. That's all. I'm sorry if I offended you.

Fire

[chimpbone]

18 minutes ago, Firemetal said:

Harassing? .-. Mate... I'm not sure you know the meaning of "harassing". I was defending the KSP devs and KSP itself. You're treating KSP as if it is a 2 star game that needs mods made by the community to actually be something fun. Mods are nice to have around but its wrong to get to the point where you're actually insulting the game and the people who made the game because you cannot use community-made add-ons. That's all. I'm sorry if I offended you.

Fire

KSP is a "two star game" to me, and I can see pretty clearly that it relies on mods from the community for continued enjoyment for the majority of users. I own the game on console, so I have had a wholly different experience with KSP and Squad than those on PC, especially those that bought the game in early access. Squad has even acknowledged that they messed up with the console version and would have to prove themselves to us, which they have yet to do.

So, on the one hand, I get why some of you guys are trying to defend Squad and KSP, because you have had a different, positive experience with the game and with Squad devs. 

But I am going to base my opinion of this game and of Squad on my own experience with the game and on my own experience getting ignored by the Squad devs. 

You see, I don't go around to threads that are talking about how great KSP is and tell them how ridiculous they are because I have had a different experience than them. 

Anyway, I feel like you are kind of being genuine when you say sorry if you've offended me, so I am going to stop. I am sorry if I come across so hostile, because I'm not. I'm just constantly finding myself on the defensive in this forum. It's nothing personal. 

 

. 

 

[claptonrulez]

On 10/19/2016 at 7:59 PM, DuoDex said:

KSP on console does not support mods. This is how it was from the beginning, how it is now, and how it will be in the future.

There were no plans to support mods, nor was there any announcement from Squad implying that mod support would be available on console. If you look on the forums, you can find several different threads discussing mods on console. All of them say that there are no mods, so thinking that buying KSP on console entitles you to mods seems a bit misinformed to me.

Saying that KSP is "lazy and bad" on console because there are no mods makes no sense; while there are reasons to think KSP on console is bad, mod support is not one of them. Vanilla KSP is what's on console. If you want mods, you want the PC version.

Not true.... 

Kirk Anthony Peters Will Mods eventually be available on console? Or will certain mods be incorporated into the game?

Like · Reply · August 6 at 12:51am

Flying Tiger Entertainment Video Game Company Hey Kirk, it's still being looked into by Squad.

Like · Reply · August 6 at 2:54pm

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