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[KSP 1.12.1+] Galileo's Planet Pack [v1.6.6] [23 Sept 2021]


Galileo

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On 25/03/2017 at 5:56 AM, OhioBob said:

4500 m/s definitely sound low for a 3.2x scale, I think its more like 5000-5500 m/s with the current KSP version.

Here's my rationale for suggesting a 2.5x system...

My goal is to find a scale that plays a lot like real life, but using stock parts.  In real life, using conventional rockets, the general rule it that it takes two stages to achieve orbit, and three stages to escape.  So that's the main driver behind my decision making.  At 1x scale it's possible to reach orbit on only one stage, so that's out.  At 2x the Δv requirement is large enough that SSTO is pretty much off the table, but it's still possible to pack enough Δv into two stages to reach escape velocity.  That then brings us to 2.5x.  At this scale we've pretty much reached the point where it takes three stages to go interplanetary.  So the goal has been achieved at 2.5x.  3.2x achieves the goal as well, but I'm not sure it adds anything new to the experience.  3.2x is just a more difficult version of 2.5x, and I don't see a reason to make things more difficult than they need to be.  I believe that at 2.5x rockets will have a lifelike design and look to them, but because of the lower Δv requirements versus 3.2x (about 13% less), a player will be able to do more and achieve more.

That's my 2₵, for what it's worth.

Interesting read :) I bailed on 3.2x because I'm ultimately a spaceplane guy, and I could only get to orbit if I left the atmosphere at 70km. Soon as the official config appeared and made it 90, my best stock-parts plane failed to reach orbit. Quite sure I could make an SSTO for 2.5x though, unless you're taking the atmos up to 2.5x70km?

Whether that SSTO is useful is another question though, since the destination is surely going to require more than one nerva per 30 ton spaceplane :) 

One day I may look at modding jets and rapiers for a larger scale system, see if I can give them a better top speed and service ceiling so that they still deliver a good portion of orbital velocity and altitude. I reckon if rapiers worked up to 35km in a 90km atmosphere, I could have made it work :P 

23 hours ago, eberkain said:

I'm beginning to think that 10x is just not a good idea.

Honestly, at 10x, any kind of contract that makes you launch a plane is a bad call. Remember you're going to have to travel 10x the distance at conventional speeds... It will be a long, long flight. I was pretty bored of winging it in just 3.2x!

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45 minutes ago, eddiew said:

Interesting read :) I bailed on 3.2x because I'm ultimately a spaceplane guy, and I could only get to orbit if I left the atmosphere at 70km. Soon as the official config appeared and made it 90, my best stock-parts plane failed to reach orbit. Quite sure I could make an SSTO for 2.5x though, unless you're taking the atmos up to 2.5x70km?

At 2.5x we're factoring the atmosphere heights by 1.3.  So Gael's atmosphere becomes 91 km.

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43 minutes ago, OhioBob said:

At 2.5x we're factoring the atmosphere heights by 1.3.  So Gael's atmosphere becomes 91 km.

My 3.2x @ 70km design might well manage that... is it going to be an official scaling config? Might be inclined to test it out if so, just for curiosity :) 

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4 minutes ago, eddiew said:

... is it going to be an official scaling config? Might be inclined to test it out if so, just for curiosity :) 

Yes.  The next GPP release will include configs for 2.5x, 3.2x, 6.4x and 10x.

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So I screw around with the Whiplash to make the JX-55 "Hellfire" SCRamjet Engine. Ramjet thrust curve to Mach 3, about level to Mach 5, then scramjet mode with thrust peaking at Mach 10, a slow decline to Mach 15 and then a linear decline to zero at Mach 25. Make it a bit heavier, somewhat worse TWR but a little more overall thrust, and I'm golden (supposedly). Mess with the atmosphere curve to flatten it out and give better performance at very high altitudes, as SCRamjets are supposed to work at 40-50km altitude (otherwise good luck getting to Mach 10+ without becoming a semi-controlled meteor). Seems like this might work. 

Then, realize that air intakes stop working at Mach 5-8, and curse SQUAD and all of its minions. I guess this part needs its own air intake...

 

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5 hours ago, eddiew said:

Interesting read :) I bailed on 3.2x because I'm ultimately a spaceplane guy, and I could only get to orbit if I left the atmosphere at 70km. Soon as the official config appeared and made it 90, my best stock-parts plane failed to reach orbit. Quite sure I could make an SSTO for 2.5x though, unless you're taking the atmos up to 2.5x70km?

Whether that SSTO is useful is another question though, since the destination is surely going to require more than one nerva per 30 ton spaceplane :) 

One day I may look at modding jets and rapiers for a larger scale system, see if I can give them a better top speed and service ceiling so that they still deliver a good portion of orbital velocity and altitude. I reckon if rapiers worked up to 35km in a 90km atmosphere, I could have made it work :P 

Honestly, at 10x, any kind of contract that makes you launch a plane is a bad call. Remember you're going to have to travel 10x the distance at conventional speeds... It will be a long, long flight. I was pretty bored of winging it in just 3.2x!

Honestly, I'm started to get a little tired of my current 3.2x save.  Karbonite and Karborundum are wonderful, but it ultimately takes some of the challenge out of the game, especially when combined with KRnD.  Right now I'm sending Karborundum-powered probes to all the outer planets, using massive burns (such as 20 km/s) so they'll reach those planets years (and in some cases, decades) ahead of their more sedate nuclear-powered brethren.

That said, I have a crazy idea based on watching RocketPC gaming's stream yesterday... 11x.  He was noting how 10x isn't quite as large as true earth equatorial radius, being some 400 km smaller.  I'm thinking keep the Karbonite, using SMURFF at full lever, and ditching RnD.  Would probably start it up when the new version of GPP comes out, or I may take a little break to get my mojo back first.  I think TAC-LS isn't my favorite thing, so I may use this as an opportunity to jump back to USI-LS, so I have a reason to go down to planets and moons again.  It's also been a long time since I've tried Kerbalism, so I may give that a go now that it has a better habitation mechanic.

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@Norcalplanner yep, you're making things too easy mixing KRnD and Karborundum. :P Kerbalism tempts me too. I just flew something for the first time through a Van Allen Kerman's belt and wanted to have someone EVA with some refrigerated snacks.

8 minutes ago, Norcalplanner said:

Would probably start it up when the new version of GPP comes out, or I may take a little break to get my mojo back first

Why not both? it's going to be a little while. You've indeed been to Ciro, planted flags on a handful of bodies and sent probes everywhere already in 10x...and burned your own bank a few times just to keep things a little hard. Lol. No one's going to stop you from trying 11x. You're pioneering and pioneers should be encouraged.

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15 minutes ago, JadeOfMaar said:

@Norcalplanner yep, you're making things too easy mixing KRnD and Karborundum. :P Kerbalism tempts me too. I just flew something for the first time through a Van Allen Kerman's belt and wanted to have someone EVA with some refrigerated snacks.

Why not both? it's going to be a little while. You've indeed been to Ciro, planted flags on a handful of bodies and sent probes everywhere already in 10x...and burned your own bank a few times just to keep things a little hard. Lol. No one's going to stop you from trying 11x. You're pioneering and pioneers should be encouraged.

I feel like I need to at least finish what my basic goals are for this career before starting something new - which means I need to get working surface bases on Iota, Ceti, Tellumo, and one other body.  I also have plans for a Kerballed Icarus mission, but I really think I need to bring the crew back from Niven first.

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25 minutes ago, JadeOfMaar said:

You've indeed been to Ciro, planted flags on a handful of bodies and sent probes everywhere already in 10x...and burned your own bank a few times just to keep things a little hard.

...and here I am just struggling to reach Gael's small moons or lob anything over 10 tonnes. :P

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And just for the record, I've only ever done 1x and 3.2x in GPP.  I've done RSS at 10x in previous versions of KSP, and was able to get a full lunar orbital station / surface base / refueling infrastructure going. Going to 6.4x with 0.6 SMURFF lever might be a solution as well.  I think I'm just getting a hankering to build some big things with NecroBones' Real Scale Boosters again.

Edited by Norcalplanner
typos
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2 minutes ago, JadeOfMaar said:

No, no. The official GPP Kerbalism setup isn't available yet. :D  But there's a good appetizer floating around in this thread.

well, I have found it,then I just wait for the official renewal.thanks for your contribution:kiss:

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2 hours ago, Norcalplanner said:

That said, I have a crazy idea based on watching RocketPC gaming's stream yesterday... 11x.  He was noting how 10x isn't quite as large as true earth equatorial radius, being some 400 km smaller.

Probably the best match would be 10.6257x.  That would give Gael and Earth the exact same gravitational parameter.

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Once, I messed up the config files and somehow ended up with both a 6.4x mod and a 10x mod active at the same time. They somehow stacked, so I had a RSS game at 64x scale. I had to give it up since I was in a RP-0 career with low science sliders - good luck getting ~20 km/s of delta-V from early AJ-10s and 248s ISP methalox engines!

20 Km/s would not be that unrealistic with KRnD plus high science sliders, but anything beyond perhaps orbiting Iota/Ceti would be out of reach. You MIGHT be able to do Niven, Tellumo and Gratian using aerocapture, IF you could survive 30km/s re-entry speeds! 

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On 3/25/2017 at 5:18 AM, OhioBob said:

 

@Sigma88, if you're out there, please refresh my memory (I asked you once before but I've forgotten the answer).  How are flyingAltitudeThreshold, spaceAltitudeThreshold, and timewarpAltitudeLimits changed when a planet and its atmosphere are resized?

sorry I forgot to answer this

 

SD uses both the resize and rescale parameter to change the Space Threshold

to be more specific:

 

SD multiplies by the rescale factor the distance from the threshold to the center of the planet

 

for stock kerbin:

radius = 600'000

threshold = 250'000

 

with resize = 2 and rescale = 4:

(250'000+600'000)*4 - (600'000*2) = 2'200'000

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