Maxxim

Frustrated Capturing RoveMaxXL3 With Klaw Impossible??

17 posts in this topic

KlawTestingRovemaxXL3  testing on ground..

KlawTestingRovemaxXL3-pt2 testing in space..

One of the largest parts in stock game - no mods used, plain vanilla..  cant be captured?  Next version of Kerbal to include a fix? Magnets? rope? Tie-Downs?

1. See images

2. Spend hours testing Klaw at varying angles, heights, positions..

3. Failed mission to capture orbiting RovemaxXL3

4. Reload, Rinse, Repeat.  Bugged?

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I am not exactly sure, so correct me if I'm wrong.

But Gears or rover wheels of any kind have no surface attachment possibilities.
They are essentially slippery surfaces without a attachment surface for any klaw to attach to.
It doesn't matter whether you aim your claw at the rubber tires or the wheel casing for that matter as they're essentially a one part object..

If there was a secondary part attached to the XL3 like a probe core or fuselage you'd be able to dock the claw with that.
If it is just a floating XL3 then you got a problem I think. You may be able to guide it into a Mk3 Cargo bay ramp in case your objective is to get it back down.

What catastrophy has caused a single seperated XL3 rover wheel to float through space by the way?

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Common thing, yes, these wheels cannot be klawed, probably due to how wheels work.

But you technically could chomp it inside cargo bay and pray that it will survive.

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Assuming this is a mission you have 2 options

KIS/KAS are going to give you multiple options to attach something to the wheel or use a magnet, or attach it to something else

Use the alt-f12 menu to set the contract to completed - there is no shame in using it to complete impossible contracts

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Posted (edited)

Hi All...

I appreciate the help and feedback, each of your replies are correct, but I knew this was a bug.  

Hoping someone will submit my info.  And due to the following reasons, I wont be using mods for now..

I am in career mode with stock game, no mods, no plugins, no changes to KSP 1.22.

I am actually at the end of the career mode with only one node that is not researched, I think, maybe two items..  I have been playing over 1-2 years, slowly, month after month, saving as I go.  I still have parts which no longer look proper because they are landed on the Mun as a base back before KSP 1.0 (thuds floating next to base, because girders changed?)  But this is old news..  Now on to the bug..

The wiki page says you can use the Klaw on ANYTHING - except planets.  This means ALL parts, and asteroids (and Kerbals which I did once).

http://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/wiki/Advanced_Grabbing_Unit

The Advanced Grabbing Unit (AGU), or The Klaw, is a medium-sized docking device which can couple to any surface without the requirement of another docking device on the target to mate with. This is a virtual necessity for redirecting asteroids, though the AGU can be used to grab onto much more than just asteroids. In fact, it can grab just about anything, even Kerbals.

The wiki is bugged too in this case

This item is orbiting the moon with one more part I still need to investigate.  (its a floating question?) So you can see in the images my ship was designed to klaw two items, not just one.  The mission(s) were given/chosen by the game administration to grab two parts, same orbit, coincidentally..  so if the game gives you a part to recover, and expects you to obtain it, but doesnt give you a method..  well, then we have a bug. (FYI - after klawing the first item, I would need to use a trick to adjust the thrust on one side of my ship until I klaw the second item and regain balance in mass..)

 

The other part of the problem is this..  if I am in career mode and possibly have not yet developed the cargo bays, what could I have done other than refuse the mission?   Questions to consider.

1. Do missions to capture these large parts only happen if the game detects you have the necessary cargo bays unlocked?

2. Does KSP expect you to use cargo bays for these?  

3. Will cargo bays explode when the part bounces around inside during flight / reentry?

4. Does anyone have access to submit this as a bug report?

My day job is a software quality assurance tester with programming background since 1985..  Im an adult student/ always learning, but I have been through a few orbits in my time already :)

An example of my Mun Mining mission video is here..  might give you an idea of my skill in game..

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/77528-post-your-cinematics-here-cinematic-enthusiasts/&do=findComment&comment=3006473

 

Edited by Maxxim
typo- added info

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The trouble is the contact mechanism just looks for a part to lob into orbit, likewise with rescue contacts it just selects a command pod. In some ways this is good as it allows parts from mods to be eligible but the system runs into trouble with a few things. In my recent new career I kept getting contracts to run a test on a rover wheel which didn't have the run test option available.....

Perhaps there can be an addition to the parts CFG to exclude it from contracts?  Now I'm one of those whose PC skills are on a level with my ability to win Miss World so I don't know if this would work so wiser heads please step up.

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2 hours ago, Maxxim said:

The wiki page says you can use the Klaw on ANYTHING - except planets.  This means ALL parts, and asteroids (and Kerbals which I did once).

http://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/wiki/Advanced_Grabbing_Unit

 

 

Yes, but that page was added in version .23 when the claw was added.  Or so says the wiki.  If I have learned anything with the wiki, it is not always up to date.  And with the recent changes to wheel mechanics, the line about grabbing anything might have slipped through the cracks.    If it's in the wiki, there's a good chance chance it's true, plus a non zero chance it's inaccurate, all at the same time.

 

This is KSP, you know. 

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So, it seems we need less wiki mistakes, and more accurate mission creation notes/descriptions/hints/ gameplay in the game?

When you play like I did in the mission planner role, and get multiple missions going at once, you pack your bags and set off into the blackness of space, dropping things off, picking things up, all along the way, and get about to the end of the trip, ready to grab and return to Kerbin, bringing the knowledge with you that you have seen thousands of other players before you reach the target objects, take them home and cash in rewards, the last thing you expect is to find extremely small samples of google info telling you it cant be done, on the contrary, telling you that "anything" you want to grab will grab, and now the money is invested, the items you prepared are used up, and you may only come home with half or none of your fully investigated objects dues to a typo in the game guide wannabe (of sorts?).

 

It's not like I really want to reload my previous save file and ignore that mission.  My only hope is KSP notices this thread, and maybe someday a patch will let me on another combined mission where I will be able to bring a large enough cargo bay that wont experience an unplanned disassembly, or awkward moment of spiraling out of control due to lack of lock down straps or couplers.

Dream of a time when the Klaw can actually hook parts with its teeth, rather than with its dentures missing.

 

Grrr..

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It used to grab onto practically anything, but there was a good chance that the Universe would implode on itself.    So they decided not being able to grab some things might be a good idea. 

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Posted (edited)

To show appreciation for those who suggested using the cargo bay, I am showing here just how useless that solution actually turned out to be in reality.

Now to add insult to injury and financial damages to my Kerbal Space Administration..  a new launch had to be made under emergency funding in order to make the attempt to Kompensate for KSP physics that are inKompetent (haha get it?)..  so anyway check this image and tell me whats wrong?

Cargo bay With Part Inside

So if you were distracted by the title of the photo link, you will completely miss the fact that the mission list in the upper right corner of the screen DOES NOT CREDIT ME with obtaining the part inside the cargo bay (which is clipping the graphics and is having a hard time staying inside during certain maneuvers.)

 

Should I waste my time flying all the way home?  I wont likely make it as I have had several explosions already, and the contract isnt recognized..  so what to do?

Edited by Maxxim
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Thanks for showing it just won't work.

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bigger problem...time warp (they're counted as two separate ships)

so you would get to fly it back in real time

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Actually, I should give more detail to what I meant about "certain maneuvers"..  and what I can now say is that time warping is causing an issue with the part that is floating inside the cargo bay..  

I slow down the time warp to normal speed, and the game re-adjusts its tracking mechanism to begin watching over each unit..  the first unit is the ship which the cargo bay is built with, and the second unit is the floating part inside suddenly becomes non-solid - or in other words the two units do not have collider meshes and do not collide with each other - which causes the effect of one solid passing through the other - or in other words, you will see the wheel float right out of the cargo bay with the cargo bay doors shut / closed.  So I cannot use time warp.

So now I am faced with the problem of watching time pass normally until I can get from the Mun and back to atmosphere of Kerbin and see what happens next, in order to avoid severe clipping and the loss of the wheel.

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You can use physics warp up to 4x by holding meta (shift/alt depending on OS) as you time accelerate.

You could alternatively not worry too much, and timewarp faster, then re-capture the part before reentry.

Does the contract tick off 'obtaining the part' when you switch to the part using '[' and ']' ?

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At this point, I'd probably just Alt+F12 the contract complete. You've done enough to earn it, and it's really a problem with the game. :)

Alternatively, if you really want to do this, you could use the method described by @suicidejunkie. When you timewarp, wait for the wheel to float entirely out of the cargo bay, so as to not induce any clipping-induced explosions. If you let it get a fair distance away before you drop out, you'll be able to get a fair ways through timewarping. Then, stop warping, and fly over to the wheel and capture it again - rinse, repeat until you reach Kerbin atmos. Of course, make sure it's in your cargo bay at that point. :)

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My sympathies, I've got the same problem, only worse! Got a contract to retrieve an XL-3 from the surface of Minmus. I've tried (in test conditions) to pick it up with the Klaw to no avail. Seems the Klaw just doesn't consider it to be a part.

 

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On 3.4.2017 at 11:58 AM, tomf said:

Assuming this is a mission you have 2 options

KIS/KAS are going to give you multiple options to attach something to the wheel or use a magnet, or attach it to something else

Use the alt-f12 menu to set the contract to completed - there is no shame in using it to complete impossible contracts

This an kerbal on Eva can attach thing to the wheel, probably even an small docking port or attaching the wheel directly on the craft. 
Problem is that like me you probably done an unmanned mission, not an mission with an engineer and a drill. 
Leaving two option, an manned mission with an ship who can retrieve the wheel or alt-f12. 

I almost always use manned missions for surface retrieval. 

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