About the Tech tree

[Necandi Brasil]

Hey guys!

So it's been announced today that the next big hit will be the tech tree... What are you guys expecting about this ?

[Whirligig Girl]

Career mode confirmed for 0.22

[gmpd2000]

Career mode confirmed for 0.22

Wait!

0.22= 2+2=4

Its the next update,soooo...

4-1=3

HALF LIFE 3 CONFIRMED!

Outside of the jokes, I think it would be great, and maybe career mode in 0.22.

Edited August 8, 2013 by gmpd2000
wrong version!

[Ralathon]

If there's a tech tree that probably means some early implementation of Career mode is in too (Else it wouldn't make much sense to have a tech tree).

Anyway, quite a few ways this could be implemented and no info to say for sure. But I hope it works based on achievements + money. So you must do a return mission for the mun before you can start researching NERVA. But it'll still cost you a lot of money, meaning that you get stuck with the dilemma: "Do I spend my budget researching efficient nukes for long term, or do I go to Duna with current tech?".

Exited in any case, interested to see what they come up with.

[regex]

What are you guys expecting about this ?

A tech tree. With nodes. Descriptions show when you click on nodes and show parts that can be unlocked. Tons of waiting for research to be done.

[Tommygun]

As long as we don't have to spam the surface of Kerbin with research labs......

[Necandi Brasil]

Aren't we too low on part counts to make a really cool Tech tree? Or maybe the tech tree will also work to improve Weight, ISP or even impact?

[chaos_forge]

I'm wondering if the tech tree will come with a bunch of new parts for each of the tech levels, or if it'll just affect how the current parts are unlocked . . .

[Blue]

When I think of Tech tree, I think of Civilization V.

While the tech tree in that game is much more strategic and also made for tailoring the development of your game entity to a specific path towards victory, it had it right in that it was relatively difficult to screw it up. Sure there were ways of making your tech gain great advantages in one way or another, no path through it was really a way of preventing progress. Analogy; regardless of which basket had eggs in it or how many, it was still possible to succeed. Such is not the case in less well-constructed trees of gameplay.

But one thing I remember is a very notable detail: the industrial era in the tech tree is a pinch point of only three technologies (to the left of the middle in this image) and how a given Civilization approached those three technologies (Biology, Steam Power and Dynamite) made all the difference in the world of how quickly and easily they would progress to further goals only a few turns down the line.

Making such career lynch-pin tech tree decisions would make it much more interesting if cleverly employed, as long as it did not become too involved.

I can imagine a few different technologies that could be on the tree:

Solid Fuels

Monopropellant Liquid

Bipropellant Liquid

Tripropellant Liquid

Hypergols

Open Cycle Combustion

Closed Cycle Combustion

Turbopump Assembly (Level 1, 2, 3?)

Nuclear Thermodynamics

Edited August 6, 2013 by Blue
removing slash to make image work

[HarvesteR]

Aren't we too low on part counts to make a really cool Tech tree? Or maybe the tech tree will also work to improve Weight, ISP or even impact?

We currently have over 160 stock parts in the game. It's definitely enough to have a tech tree.

That said, yes, we are still missing a few parts to fill some particular niche here and there. The Tech Tree is actually helping out a lot in finding where those 'gaps' are, so we'll know a lot better over the coming weeks which parts we need to work on next.

Also, don't expect whatever we release on the next update to be a final, unchangeable version of the tree. As with everything else we do, this is only a first implementation, so it's very likely it'll be revised again and again until we're completely happy with it.

That's about as much as I feel ok with discussing at the moment, it's still very early to get into detail on it.

Cheers

[RocketPilot573]

So... How long will it take to research Struts?

[Tommygun]

Well if the tech tree unlocks new better parts, I think there could be a problem with older less efficient and unwanted parts cluttering up the parts screen.

Unless they disappear on their own it might make more sense to just tweak their properties and make them lighter or more efficient etc.

I'm assuming too that things like manned flight will be higher up on the tech tree.

[Necandi Brasil]

Btw ... It may sound cliche but I'm really excited about the next update!

Thank you devs!

[Apollo1391]

I'm kind of nervous about this I hope when they add it it's not mandatory because there are some persistent files I have that revolve around nervas

[HarvesteR]

I'm kind of nervous about this I hope when they add it it's not mandatory because there are some persistent files I have that revolve around nervas

No need to worry about that. R&D is probably only going to be available in Career Mode.

For Sandbox saves, it wouldn't make much sense to have R&D anyway. The R&D Facility will be at the space center but it won't open the R&D screen.

This is the best solution IMO. It leaves existing saves unmodified, and means everyone will get a clean start with R&D.

Cheers

[Captain Sierra]

So this will be the first hints of career mode that we will see? We can actually have career mode saves now? Can't wait! This will definitely bring a bunch of new dynamics to the game. I know it's ear'y to ask but when should we be expecting .22? I was thinking sometime around early to mid September.

[Bigcheecho]

So this will be the first hints of career mode that we will see? We can actually have career mode saves now? Can't wait! This will definitely bring a bunch of new dynamics to the game. I know it's ear'y to ask but when should we be expecting .22? I was thinking sometime around early to mid September.

Never ask when the next update is coming out. Rumor has it that whenever someone asks when the next update is coming out, it gets delayed by a day.

[FITorion]

Aren't we too low on part counts to make a really cool Tech tree? Or maybe the tech tree will also work to improve Weight, ISP or even impact?

For new players we have too many parts. New players look at what we have and are overwhelmed. We really could do with a much reduced initial part count and have new parts introduced as research is done.

The above is orientated to Career mode. Sandbox will always have all the parts.

A tech tree and unlocking parts does not make any sense in sandbox. They could not play test a tech tree in sandbox... They would need to implement some sort of minimal career mode in order to be able to fully test it. And if you're going to do that you're also going to need the missions set up at least minimally. They can always expand the Tech tree and Missions later.

[Themohawkninja]

No need to worry about that. R&D is probably only going to be available in Career Mode.

For Sandbox saves, it wouldn't make much sense to have R&D anyway. The R&D Facility will be at the space center but it won't open the R&D screen.

This is the best solution IMO. It leaves existing saves unmodified, and means everyone will get a clean start with R&D.

Cheers

So, we will be able to actually access the career mode button?

[Tommygun]

It would be nice if R&D where a toggle-able feature even in sandbox mode.

[air805ronin]

No need to worry about that. R&D is probably only going to be available in Career Mode.

For Sandbox saves, it wouldn't make much sense to have R&D anyway. The R&D Facility will be at the space center but it won't open the R&D screen.

This is the best solution IMO. It leaves existing saves unmodified, and means everyone will get a clean start with R&D.

Cheers

I'm particularly excited about this. I can't wait to see how you balance it and how it affects progression in the career mode.

I'm also interested to see how much I can do in career mode without doing any unlocks.

[Eric S]

I'm also interested to see how much I can do in career mode without doing any unlocks.

I'm quite certain that there will be challenges posted along the lines of "starting in career mode with nothing unlocked..."

[PwnedDuck]

Maybe, in addition to adding parts, R&D could upgrade them e.g. "Research new blutonium isotope discovered on Tylo to increase NERVA ISP to 950"

[Themohawkninja]

Maybe, in addition to adding parts, R&D could upgrade them e.g. "Research new blutonium isotope discovered on Tylo to increase NERVA ISP to 950"

That would be overpowered if you ask me.

[karolus10]

I would like to suggest, to keep lower tech parts similar in style and technological era ,so Early game parts would be at least remotely (or equally) useful in late game (older not always are worse) and let combine different tech level parts smoothly - no early junk+duct taped parts and futuristic at the end making them aesthetically awkward to use together.

Edited August 7, 2013 by karolus10