allista

[1.3] Throttle Controlled Avionics

1645 posts in this topic

MJ docking, rendezvous, etc are nearly perfect. The only thing, in my experience, the MJ is rather unhelpful is spaceplane landings, landings in atmosphere and landing of odd contraptions with multiple engines.

Since I can't fly too well and KSP joystick implementation is awful, spaceplanes have been out of my reach in KSP. I just came across this mod today as I was desperately trying to land something with wings and I realized that VTOL would be the only thing that would work for me. Horizontal landings result in crash every single time. Its odd, because I can land planes in X-plane with only moderate difficulties but in KSP plane handling is awful.

I can power-descent a rocket and bring it to a hover-like state relatively easy. What I need is a way to control a large, horizontally laid-out vessel (vertical rocket is not optimal), with multiple engines and hover it to enable precision-landing next to land bases.

So, I'm off to install this mod and start messing with it.

My goal is to build a ship, not necessarily and airplane with lift surfaces, but think along the lines of Serenity (Firefly), with a large cargo bay in it's "belly"  that can land and take off vertically, hover if needed and convert to normal spacecraft. I already hacked together some engines and fuel systems for this. I have the thrust and the fuel I need, now I need a way to control such a beast!

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Phew.... very frustrating few hours. I feel, this mod is too complex for controlling a VTOL. Too many features, too many things that can wrong if you forget something. Why does it change gimbal % on main rear firing engines if they're disabled? Why does it always set thrust limiter to nearly zero on all RCS thrusters? It makes transition between flight modes a frustrating a nerve wrecking experience. A simple VTOL stabilizer without all the extra features would be awesome.

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I have a question relating to Modules and docking to a space station.

When I dock a ship to my station, I seem to lose most of my installed modules.  This makes my shiny new vtol science lander virtually useless - no more vtol assist, no more landing assist, no more nothing but basic engine balancing.

Any ideas what can be causing this?  Am I doing something wrong?  Does docking perhaps set my ship's installed modules list to that of the station, which has very little installed?  And is there any way to re-install modules on a ship?  Whew...that's a lot of questions.

Any help appreciated!

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i second Phillip Ian problem

i edited my save to add all mudols to as mach ships as i had the pasiance to do

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Is anyone else having the issue where TCA reverts back to the launcher from Blizzy's toolbar every time the game starts? I can switch it back, but I don't know why the setting doesn't persist. Log and save game available.

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2 hours ago, eightiesboi said:

Is anyone else having the issue where TCA reverts back to the launcher from Blizzy's toolbar every time the game starts? I can switch it back, but I don't know why the setting doesn't persist. Log and save game available.

Yes. It doesn't save that setting.

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Posted (edited)

Deleted - Misread the previous comment

Edited by eightiesboi

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Slowly, very slowly, wrapping my head around this mod. Taking off, switching modes and letting MechJeb take over the ascent vertically is easy. Stabilizing the craft and switching modes on landing is harder. I can't do this manually so I'm digging into the landing autopilot and it looks good so far. Steep learning curve.

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Allista, it seems there is an unexpected issue with Thud engines.

 

When a Thud is mounted non-radially TAC does not allow controlling the engine manually, the limit is  always reset to zero. I cannot move a slider in Manual Control mode, it's locked at 0%.

 

Used the same approach with rear mounted engines, but Thud rotated 90 degrees does not work this way. Are the radial engines handled differently? Or there is another problem? 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

On 14.4.2017 at 11:56 PM, Kerbital said:

Phew.... very frustrating few hours. I feel, this mod is too complex for controlling a VTOL. Too many features, too many things that can wrong if you forget something. Why does it change gimbal % on main rear firing engines if they're disabled? Why does it always set thrust limiter to nearly zero on all RCS thrusters? It makes transition between flight modes a frustrating a nerve wrecking experience. A simple VTOL stabilizer without all the extra features would be awesome.

Agree. I used the first versions of this mod and it was pretty simple and straight forward and worked. Now the new version is an overly complicated "clusterf*ck" of buttons and panels and doesn't even seem to work anymore.

Like I want to HOVER a quadcopter. I set "Enabled", click on "Hover" and nothing happens. I click on "AutoThrottle" and it goes to full throttle. Now I can set "Alt. (m)". I set it to 1000.0 click on "Set" nothing happens. I click on "Hover" again, nothing happens. But now I got a trackbar to set "V.Spd." I put it to 0.0m/s and it goes full throttle again all the way up to 8km. Rince and repeat.

Just frustrating.

Edited by nuclearping

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17 hours ago, nuclearping said:

Agree. I used the first versions of this mod and it was pretty simple and straight forward and worked. Now the new version is an overly complicated "clusterf*ck" of buttons and panels and doesn't even seem to work anymore.

Like I want to HOVER a quadcopter. I set "Enabled", click on "Hover" and nothing happens. I click on "AutoThrottle" and it goes to full throttle. Now I can set "Alt. (m)". I set it to 1000.0 click on "Set" nothing happens. I click on "Hover" again, nothing happens. But now I got a trackbar to set "V.Spd." I put it to 0.0m/s and it goes full throttle again all the way up to 8km. Rince and repeat.

Just frustrating.

Agreed. All I really want is VTOL balancing, and in a couple hours of effort I haven't been able to figure out how to make that work. Way too much going on at once and way too little documentation.

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Does this use gimballing to control the thrust vector as well, or does it only use thrust limiting?

I.e. Can it control a vehicle with just a single off-centre engine if it has high enough gimballing?

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Does this use gimballing to control the thrust vector as well, or does it only use thrust limiting?

I.e. Can it control a vehicle with just a single off-centre engine if it has high enough gimballing?

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hello folks

This is a great mod but, is there anyway to code this type of ability in a program for KOS. Cuz i need it to stabilize my lander wich is guided by my KOS program.

thanks in advance :)

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Hello,

I'm unable to use the mod - it starts with a blank screen (in the gui). This gui is present on the main screen of kerbal, and in game as well. On a part (lander can for example), it does say it's tca enabled, and I see some relevant entries in the tech tree (career mode), but I believe I need the UI to work to be able to use the mod.

According to previous posts with this issue, it has something to do with AT Utils. The logs seem to confirm this:

(Filename: C:/buildslave/unity/build/artifacts/generated/common/runtime/UnityEngineDebugBindings.gen.cpp Line: 42)

MissingMethodException: Method not found: 'AT_Utils.AddonWindowBase<ThrottleControlledAvionics.TCAMacroEditor>.Show'.

 
(Filename:  Line: -1)

MissingMethodException: Method not found: 'AT_Utils.AddonWindowBase<ThrottleControlledAvionics.TCAManual>.get_window_enabled'.

I am on AT Utils version 1.4.1 (it was installed automatically by CKAN). I have TCA version 3.3.1

Here is a list of other mods installed in case it helps:

[  
  "KerbalEngineerRedux",
  "CactEyeCommunity",
  "DMagicOrbitalScience",
  "KEI",
  "ScienceRelay",
  "SolarScience",
  "StageRecovery",
  "SurfaceExperimentPack",
  "xScience",
  "ContractsWindowPlus",
  "CapCom",
  "UniversalStorage",
  "SCANsat",
  "CommunityTechTree",
  "HideEmptyTechNodes",
  "KAS",
  "ModuleManager",
  "KIS",
  "ProgressParser",
  "ContractParser",
  "CommunityResourcePack",
  "NearFutureConstruction",
  "NearFutureElectrical",
  "NearFuturePropulsion",
  "NearFutureSolar",
  "NearFutureSpacecraft",
  "StationPartsExpansion",
  "B9PartSwitch",
  "NearFutureElectrical-Core",
  "NearFutureSolar-Core",
  "NearFutureProps",
  "CryoEngines",
  "CryoTanks",
  "DeployableEngines",
  "SpaceY-Lifters",
  "IndicatorLights",
  "ModularRocketSystem",
  "UKS",
  "USI-EXP",
  "USI-LS",
  "FirespitterCore",
  "USITools",
  "USI-Core",
  "GroundConstruction",
  "AT-Utils",
  "ConfigurableContainers-Core",
  "Konstruction",
  "CommunityCategoryKit",
  "USI-FTT",
  "DistantObject",
  "DistantObject-default",
  "BetterTimeWarpCont",
  "EnvironmentalVisualEnhancements",
  "PlanetShine",
  "SVE-HighResolution",
  "SVE-Sunflare",
  "TextureReplacer",
  "PlanetShine-Config-Default",
  "Scatterer",
  "SVE-Scatterer-Config",
  "ManeuverNodeEvolved",
  "B9-PWings-Fork",
  "SpaceY-Expanded",
  "InterstellarFuelSwitch-Core",
  "ColorCodedCans",
  "ColorfulFuelLines",
  "FuelTanksPlus",
  "ContractConfigurator-KerbinSpaceStation",
  "ContractConfigurator",
  "ContractConfigurator-KerbalAcademy",
  "Chatterer",
  "WaypointManager",
  "ContractConfigurator-CleverSats",
  "ABCORS",
  "AlternateResourcePanel",
  "TriggerAu-Flags",
  "ReentryParticleEffect",
  "ExperimentTracker",
  "FlightPlan",
  "Astrogator",
  "Graphotron",
  "HotSpot",
  "KerbalJointReinforcement",
  "MusicMuteContinued",
  "WheelsCollection",
  "MechJeb2",
  "CoherentContracts",
  "ContractConfigurator-Tourism",
  "EditorExtensionsRedux",
  "Hangar",
  "ThrottleControlledAvionics",
  "ConfigurableContainers",
  "KSP-AVC"
]

 

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On 4/27/2017 at 5:30 PM, baldamundo said:

Does this use gimballing to control the thrust vector as well, or does it only use thrust limiting?

I.e. Can it control a vehicle with just a single off-centre engine if it has high enough gimballing?

I'm pretty sure it is using both based on some VTOL disasters I've had.  To be fair, I had failed to do basic CG to thrust vector alignment on the craft while editing, resulting in some hilarious spinning craft as it couldn't both gain altitude and control attitude.  

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Posted (edited)

On 4/27/2017 at 5:30 PM, baldamundo said:

Does this use gimballing to control the thrust vector as well, or does it only use thrust limiting?

I.e. Can it control a vehicle with just a single off-centre engine if it has high enough gimballing?

Yes, it uses gimbal control and that is one of the frustrating parts: once disabled for normal flight the gimbals are not reset to 100, but stay at some fractions value and you have to to manually click and reset each engine,

It also does this to RCS thrusters too. So since there is no quick action to reset RCS thrusters, it's annoying to manually reset thrusters as well.

Confusing panels indeed, stuff I'll never use.I need like 10% of that mod. If Allista could strip it dwn to simly VTOL control without all the extras. I'll buy him a good lunch:)

I'd love a lite version that simply give me VTOL leveling and I do the control and landing.

Assigning engines to groups for seperate thrust and control is also a huge hit and miss.

Click through windows are another deal breaker. So many times I created a accidental waypoint because I forgot to click cancel.

Here is what I would love to see: ONE Window with [VTOL LEVELING ON] [VTOL LEVELING OFF]  buttons.  All this does is keeping the craft level using only selected engines. Then I can control the thrust using main engines and/or RCS. There could be few handy and helpful options such as [Kill Horizontal velocity] and [come to a hover-stop] that would ease the transition from horizontal flight to VTOL mode. Al the navigation and fluff can be removed in the Lite VTOL Version .

@allista would you be open to creating a light version of the mod for VTOL control only? Remove all the navigation stuff, orbital stuff, etc. MechJeb already covers that well.

Here is how I see it. Ship ready to fly, Toggle VTOL Levelling On, Apply manual thrust and take of vertically by yourself. Once I'm at desired Altitude I kill the vert thrust, Disable VTOL assist and switch the engines. As the plane drifts, I pull up, enable main engines and RCS and let MechJeb take the ship to the orbit.

Please reset all thrust limiters and gimbals to 100% when VTOL assistance is turned of.

At the destination  planet I deorbit manually or let MechJeb take the ship down. Once at few km I bring the ship to stall and enable landing assistance: it brings the ship to stop and hovers. From here I control the movement of the ship with main engines and RCS and the mod just keep my vertical enegines balanced.I want to be ato use my main engines and RCS to bring the ship manually to the landing spot and land it myself.

 

Edited by Kerbital
massive spelling errors, was sleepy when typing that, sorry
2 people like this

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Posted (edited)

You should mention that the version on Github is 3.4.0, but the version on Spacedock is 3.4.1

Edit:

Honestly, whut?

I read the manual, tried to setup a vessel in VAB and wanted to launch it.

First I did the mistake and thought this is kinda replacement for MechJeb - nope.

Second as soon as the launchpad was loaded, the engines were running - all of them, incl. the ones in upper stages...

Again ... whut?

Edited by Gordon Dry

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Ok, so I built a simple VTOL craft with 4 liquid engines and I would like to be able to control it like a quadcopter drone... more specifically, control it like a DJI Phantom drone.

When I let off the controls I want the VTOL craft to automatically kill it's horizontal and vertical velocities.  

Will TCA do what I want it to do or is there another mod I can download to make this happen? Any suggestions?

Thanks

Jb3R72J.png

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Posted (edited)

@Voodoo8648

 

Yes TCA will do this.  there are some buttons you need to select on the setup for your craft that tell it to "hover" or "follow terrain" I think the two buttons are named.  the first "hover'  tells it to maintain that altitude ASL.  and  the follow terrain thing tells it to maintain the set altitude AGL. then for horizontal velocity you use the "stop" button I think it is called.  this tells it to kill translation.   or there is "anchor" which tells it to maintain a specific GPS ref.

 

@Gordon Dry

it is due to your craft setup.  if you tell the avionics to be "on at launch" all of this will activate as soon as it loads in.  and the engines in the various stages you will need to assign to different engine groups.  as it does not understand "stages" it just goes by what engines you have grouped and activated.

Edited by Bit Fiddler
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12 hours ago, Bit Fiddler said:

@Voodoo8648

 

Yes TCA will do this.  there are some buttons you need to select on the setup for your craft that tell it to "hover" or "follow terrain" I think the two buttons are named.  the first "hover'  tells it to maintain that altitude ASL.  and  the follow terrain thing tells it to maintain the set altitude AGL. then for horizontal velocity you use the "stop" button I think it is called.  this tells it to kill translation.   or there is "anchor" which tells it to maintain a specific GPS ref.

 

THAT WORKED!! Works perfect!!

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Posted (edited)

Any Idea which technologies on the tech tree unlocks the "Stop" and "Hover" and "Follow Terrain" buttons???

 

EDIT: Never mind... I think it's Altitude Control and HSC.... but correct me if I'm wrong

Edited by Voodoo8648

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do not know this...  I have only messed with TCA in sandbox to test it out.  have never made anything with it in a career game.

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Can't wait for the 1.3 release

3 people like this

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