Raptor831

For teaching the space race, you might consider Bob Fitch's Project Alexandria. Playlist link: It's a pretty in-depth series covering major launches of the space race. It's done in a customized Realism Overhaul setup, so not sure if you want to show that route; but he's pretty engaging and anyone so inclined to attend a rocket club would probably love the videos. He's not finished with the series, but he's up to first orbits (up to 1962).

Sorry all, hadn't pushed a release with the new ModuleRCSFX in there. Stockalike is updated now to include ModuleRCSFX v4.1. Anyone with a previous version can update. If you're having trouble with the RCS, make sure you've got the latest versions of everything first.

I am actually in process of doing just that. I saw like the third "bug report" dealing with that on the RF thread. EDIT: MRCSFX is updated on the release to 4.1.

Depends on how Paul Kingtiger proceeds with the 64K version. If 64K keeps the same sizes mostly and I enjoy playing it, I'll stick with that and leave this alone. It was essentially a better packaged version of this anyway. If not, I'll make something that I do like and share it here. (Note: I haven't looked at 64K in a while, so it may have been updated recently and I've missed it.) That sounds kinda snotty, but it's not intended to be! Most of my "mods" were just stuff that I was building to make me happy with my game, and I figured other people might enjoy it.

Sorry guys. Been a bit busy with RL, plus have been playing some different games in my free time. @TomTheHand: Duly noted. Don't play with those myself. Can you tell me if the RD-0124 is working? Seems like there might be a few glitches with those engines... @jstnj: The intention is to bring the mass ratios in-line with what stock was. As of now, it might be harder than stock, after they rebalanced everything. Not sure exactly; NathanKell might know more precisely. Alternative, if you want, keep the useRealisticMass = true and use KIDS to adjust the Isp down to achieve the same thing. You can tweak that to get whatever feel you're after. @NathanKell: Costs for TL upgrades? For configs? I'll take those. It appears I am late to the party as well, judging by the fact that RF 10.3.1 is out. For anyone doing career installs with Stockalike, post your thoughts here on the costs/science needed for unlocking. I can certainly add that to my (ever growing) list of features here, if there's a need for variation.

What he said.

Well, what do you want to accomplish? Once you have a config in the webapp, you can copy the right-hand column and paste that into a .cfg file and Module Manager will alter the engine to work with Real Fuels as you defined. (Which it looks like you have set up already) There's not really anything else to do for a standard RF install. I've hopefully set up the webapp to give you cues as to what is reasonable, so you come out with properly balanced engines. But, if there was a certain mod you wanted to integrate (or if you're writing one), post about it here and we shall see. Can't guarantee anything, but I'd be happy to look into it.

Someone, I promise, will adapt this for stock system. If not me, someone else will take the time. ModuleManager is a beautiful thing.

C# is actually similar to Java. You have to be a bit more explicit in C#, but really after looking at some code you'll feel ok if you're already familiar with Java. At least that was my experience.

Ok, I see what's up. The numbers you place in the top of the config for Isp do not get multiplied. Those engines are modeled to use the full flow staged combustion cycle, which boosts Isp compared to the same engine without (oversimplification, but hey). The Isps that get used in-game are defined within the RF settings files. The ones at the top of the config are more for your information and as a backup in case something goofs. So, it's working "correctly". Also, the only stat I ever brought over from a stock/mod engine was the initial thrust value. Everything else was modified to fit a real-world scale, based on that thrust value. Mass is reduced to match a certain TWR, Isp gets changed to match an engine of similar use case (Launch, Orbital, Upper Stage, etc.), and fuels are changed to real ones. If you try and use stock Isp values and stock mass values, it'll get all kinds of odd with regards to balance. I'd do the useRealisticMass = false (which you can change in the RealFuels settings config file) if you want to play on stock-sized Kerbin. If you want to mess with that engine, you can go here: http://ksp.joshuawagneronline.com/engine/spacey-k1-kiwi-engine/ There's nothing truly complicated (at least I thought I explained everything ok on page!), so you can just mess with numbers and settings to see the changed results on the right. If you'd like, I can try to write a quick guide if it's not clear from the app.

Err, well, what you're doing should work. But again, the actual Isp numbers outside of ModuleEnginesConfig are thrown out once in-game. What are the new values you're using?

The engines will be OP compared to stock, because the thrust is much higher than stock values (in addition to the weight difference). The multipliers are the most important number though. The initial Isp values don't mean anything once the RF modules do their thing. If you want, you can mess around with the webapp (http://bit.ly/rfstockalike). Find your engine and then adjust as needed.

@Frimi_2: This is probably due to the fact that Real Fuels now uses a "solver" module instead of a config-driven one. In short, it "solves" the problems of Isp, thrust, etc. on the fly based on atmospheric pressure, fuels, and Isp multipliers. At least that's how I understand it. If I'm incorrect, NK, please feel free to step in. Going forward the engines will pretty much be based on role and not any actual values in the system. The old way of taking the un-modded thrust and building the engine around that can't really be done any more, since stock changed all their thrust values to match the new aero system. Which is good, but it sticks me with a bit of a problem. I'm still building this mod essentially to fit well in 6.4x scale using RF defaults. This should also work for stock size if you set useRealisticMass = false.

ModuleRCSFX is updated to 4.1 in the repo. I haven't made a new "release" yet since there are other fixes that need to be made (like the Flea) before then. But, everything in the "master" branch on GitHub should be as up to date as can be.

The intention was that you'd use that flag if you were on stock-sized Kerbin. 64% scaled Kerbin is about right for the realistic mass. The "Stockalike" refers more to the fact that you're using stock engine (models) and not an F-1, J-2, RD-180, or Merlin 1D. They've been re-tooled to be realistic in mass, thrust, and Isp. Before KSP 1.0, it was a much bigger difference between stock and the Real* mods. Now, it has at least a passable atmospheric model and properly working Isp/thrust. So, using a realistically massed engine just makes is crazy easy. Bumping the mass back up to "stock" levels will make it so you need stock-like rockets to get around. But the masses will be scaled properly, and Isp/thrust rules still apply as they do in RF. (So, the LV-N is really heavy.) In that sense, you can still have a stock-type experience with stock scale. But, honestly, you would probably be better served to use the 6.4x scaled stuff when it comes out for Kopernicus (what RSS will be using for planet scaling/editing), as it'll fit much nicer.

useRealisticMass is a flag for RF that tells it to use a realistic mass for engines and fuel tanks. If you flip it to false, it will add mass to the fuel tanks and engines so that they resemble stock mass ratios. On a stock-sized Kerbin, it'll force you to use stock-like rockets again, and not tiny rockets that get you to Moho.

@westamastaflash: I haven't seen the cfg file for that engine, but we'd be restricted to however they set it up. In particular, the transforms on the model. I'll have to look into it though. @Canis Dirus Leidy: Yeah, haven't added the new solid booster yet. Was trying to hold off because the new RF/CRP has multiple solid propellants, and I wanted to figure those out and get everything all at once. @NathanKell: I'll update the repo. Thanks for the heads up! @Nerd1000: I haven't noticed any trouble with that engine. That said, Stockalike doesn't mess with the jets too much. You'd be better off using AJE for that. Which brings me to a question: what other mods that touch the jets do you have installed? And, can you make this happen with a Stock + RF + Stockalike only install?

If you want a bit more of a challenge, set useRealisticMass = false in the RealFuelsSettings.cfg. That will restore stock mass values to the engines and tanks. Which makes everything a lot harder on stock-sized Kerbin. And thank you for your thoughts!

No, it doesn't work with 1.0.2. Or, the things it relies on do not work in 1.0.2. Regolith got rolled into stock (more or less), and RF isn't updated officially yet for 1.0.2. That said, I probably won't update it. Two reasons: 1) Karbonite/Regolith changed quite a bit, so there would be a goodly amount of time needed to update, and 2) regex is starting a RealISRU mod to do essentially what this mod did (or at least attempted). The new mod will be part of the RO suite, but I'll be sure there are at least a stock-ish set to be used.

@Northstar1989: Originally when I made the decision of NP's personality, they didn't have all of those versions of the J-2, they just had the 1.25m K-2X. They also had a bunch of Energia-inspired parts. And since I already had a few NASA personalities, it made sense to pick Roscosmos. RAM is pretty much set at 3-3.5 GB max anyway. I can't get KSP to use more than 3 GB. I have no less than 5 parts mods (KW, NP, SpaceY, FASA, some NearFuture) with hopes to add B9, AIES, and maybe RLA. The trick is only keeping the parts you use. For example, FASA is like 200+ MB on disk, but I only have about 35 MB installed. And I abuse ATM and use quarter-size graphics. With Procedural Parts installed, you can get away with almost no fuel tanks from mods. NovaPunch M50 looks like it was missed. I'll look into that when I look at getting some methalox configs for the NP J-2 clones. But I'm not going to stray too far from my chosen personalities. And like I mentioned before, you can add to the Stockalike configs with a config of your own, making any changes you want for your own install. Clone the engine in question and apply the mixtures you want. Or re-write the config for the engines in question with the changes you want. That's the beauty of configs and open licensing. I will open the floor here to say that if anyone has thoughts on engine mixtures for particular engines or thoughts on my "personalities", please let me know. This "mod" is first and foremost a mod for myself, because I like to play like this. However, I do understand that other people use it, so I'm willing to open discussion about changes.

Yup, got me there. I updated the Stockalike repo with the latest ModuleRCSFX. It'll get rolled in with the next release.

First off, hope you feel better soon. Being sick is never fun. There's a lot of changes coming with Real Fuels, starting with v10. So, my priority is there, to make sure this mass of .cfg files works with RF down the road. That said, I'll point this out again. I know I've mentioned this before, but it's been a while back in this thread. Every part mod I add (i.e. NovaPunch, KW Rocketry, FASA, SpaceY, AIES, Home Grown Rockets, etc) I "assign" a personality. Usually this is based on the type of parts they have, or maybe just the flavor I'm feeling from them. For example, FASA and Stock have a NASA personality. KW and AIES have an ESA personality. KOSMOS and NovaPunch have a Roscosmos personality. HGR has a Chinese personality. SpaceY has the (wait for it...) SpaceX personality. Each personality has certain fuels it likes and uses most often, and even then they have different mixture ratios. So, NP uses lots of hypergolic fuels. SpaceY favors kerolox, hydrolox, and methalox. FASA uses a mix, but tends to favor the *lox. KW is fairly balanced. My assumption is that most RFStockalike players have at least 2 or 3 personalities in their game, so it should balance out. If you only have KW, you'll be a bit bored with the choices probably, true, but most part mods don't break the bank with RAM, and can be easily pruned. Originally I did this because almost every part mod has a J-2 or J-2X clone. I didn't want to sift through every single mod to find the J-2 clone and make it a hydrolox/methalox/kerolox engine. It's much easier to say "You're a ESA-type" and choose fuels from there. I've branched from that slightly, as the case arises. SXT is a good example, because there are clones of both Saturn V engines and N1 engines. But on the whole, I like the idea of these "personalities" because they force decisions on the player. You choose a certain personality for this rocket, so it uses all hypergolics. Swap out for a different mod's engine, and now you have to swap your fuels to kerolox for the first stage. Different mass ratio, different TWR, different style. All of that is my idea of a good game (or mod in this case). But I'm not the everyman, I know that. Which is why I wanted to give everyone the tools to tweak these as they like. The webapp is exactly this. You should be able to find any engine you want to tweak, and to make those tweaks using the same tools I do. You want methalox in all engines? You can make those changes (relatively) easily. And, if you really want to, you can take the Stockalike configs and make an entirely different engine set. The license is open for that purpose. And, there's a feature in the webapp that'll let you clone out an existing engine to tweak. So, you can make a copy of a NP engine and make an entirely new engine out of that doesn't conflict with any other engine, but will use the same model/effects. Even so, I'll see about adding methalox to the K-2X line for NovaPunch. It at least makes sense there. May not be soon, since I want to try and make this as "future-proof" as possible as RF updates. One thing on the table is different engine cycles being modeled directly in RF, and not being inferred through configs. Which is very relevant to methalox engines similar to the Raptor. I would like to use methalox a bit more in Stockalike. However, it most certainly is a first-line mixture. It's just used mostly in the NASA and SpaceX "personalities". It's just I don't have many places to use it that make sense given the framework I've set up. Anyway, I've written far too much. Hope that makes sense.

Oh, yeah, forgot that too. In any case, let me know if you'd like some more help on that end.

You need to add the atomic weight (g/mol) for each resource in addition to the density for the spreadsheet to work. Sorry, didn't ever specify that anywhere... Should be the 3rd column of the "Sheet 1" tab. I just hit up Wikipedia for numbers there.

This is why CRP was made, so that every mod that wanted to could use a base set of resources that don't conflict. USI, Universal Storage, KSPI-E, and EPL all use CRP, if I am remembering correctly. If that's the case, everyone's "Oxygen" is the same exact resource, so there's no stomping on anything. You can have resources defined and not uses without ill effect, so if you find random ones it's not too bad of an issue. Just more an annoyance, I guess.