G'th

To be frank I'd say that it'd probably be more of a benefit to just send probes into interstellar space rather than aiming for any particular star. As has been said, getting to any other star would take centuries, even with ideal propulsion. But, just getting out of the solar system wouldn't take that long, particularly if you dedicated a launch to that end (Instead of having probes end up leaving the system after sling shotting around the planets). There's still quite a bit to learn about interstellar space from what I understand that would likely be more immediately valuable (and thus worth the cost of launching a probe) than anything we send to another star. Granted, a probe aimed at specific star would still be able to provide the same benefits, but if you aim it at something, then you're inevitably going to end up putting more resources into it so that it gets there as fast as possible. A probe just for interstellar space won't have that.

Used the new Saturn V parts to launch a shuttle. Pretty fun actually.

Here is my attempt. Although I technically failed (as I missed the runway at KSC completely), I'm still going to count it as a success for the purposes of the the challenger's example. That and I'm tired and really don't feel like dealing with KSO's issues when it comes to FAR and DREC. Perhaps during my weekend I'll make another attempt. Here's my score: Payload: 2tons = 2pts Replicas are for Chumps: 25pts FAR - 50pts DREC - 25pts Final Score: 102pts

I've decided to the remake my Saturn-Shuttle concept from a couple months ago, that unfortunately no one ever took me up on. Admittedly, I never did submit my own try at the concept, but now I have! That's right, I've created a functional example of NASA's Saturn-Shuttle concept. As its name implies, the Saturn-Shuttle would utilize the Saturn V S-IC first stage as the booster for the shuttle program, with the EFT and Orbiter mating sitting on top in place of S-II second stage. The S-IC would've been modified to use large delta wings (compared to the relatively tiny fins it uses in its normal launches) which would have allowed the stage to fly back to Kennedy Space Center to be refurbished for another flight (with its F-1 engines alone being replaced). Utilizing the Saturn V for the Shuttle program would have meant that the International Space Station could have been lifted into orbit in a relative handful of launches, and indeed, may well have meant we could have sent men farther into space than we ever did during the program, as interplanetary vessels would have been trivial to construct in orbit with the power of the Saturn V behind them. It also likely would have meant that Challenger may well have never been lost. Here's a picture of an official NASA model of the Saturn-Shuttle, to give you guys an idea of what this looks like: _______________________________ RULES, SCORING, and SHENANIGANS! _______________________________ The rules are quite simple. No cheat mods or game cheats are to be used. The entire craft MUST to be a Saturn V analogue with an attached EFT + Orbiter analogue. For 100% stock versions, I will allow non-exact replicas to be used as stock parts don't provide much options towards this challenge. (SLS parts for instance are acceptable in place of an F-1 type engine configuration) The Orbiter itself MUST be able to land back at either KSC or the Old Airfield. Landing at KSC2 is also acceptable, despite the lack of proper runway. The landing of the S-IC stage is completely optional, as doing so will require certain mods or a modified flight plan (IE, carrying the S-IC stage into orbit and then deorbiting). The reusability of the system isn't really the point of this challenge, as I've found that actually creating the darn thing at all would be more of a challenge than making a S-IC stage that can fly back to KSC. Most mods may be used. The only unacceptable mods, for the purpose of keeping this challenge firmly within the realm of what NASA could actually do at the time, will be any mods like KSP Interstellar, Near Future Propulsion, etc etc. If it wasn't something that could be in production in the 1970's, it isn't acceptable. Your entry will require either a full video from launch to landing, or a series of screenshots from launch to landing. Here are some recommended mods to use towards this challenge (I'll post links after I post my challenge attempt). Some of these mods will have extra points attached for their use (or non-use): Space Shuttle Engines KW Rocketry FASA Kerbin Shuttle Orbiter Component Space Shuttle B9 Aerospace Spaceplane Plus OLDD Saturn V _________________________ Scoring will follow a basic "Most points win" formula. Points are awarded based on meeting any combination of the below criteria, assuming the base requirements are met. REQUIRED: Saturn V Analogue Orbiter + EFT Analogue Orbiter must make it into at least a stable 75kmx75km orbit, because duh. Orbiter Capable of landing at any of the three mentioned locations. PAYLOAD: You are awarded 1pt per ton placed in orbit. A payload is not required, however EXTRAS: The Masochist: I had a hard enough time designing mine, even with mods. Going 100% stock earns you - 250pts. Replicas are for Champs: Use a combination of CSS and FASA to create the Saturn Shuttle (This was what I originally tried, but it would never work for me) - 100pts Replicas are for Chumps: Use a combination of KW Rocketry and Kerbin Shuttle Orbiter - 25pts Clean, mean, and Modern: Use a non-prebuilt spaceplane design of your choosing. - 25pts SpaceX is the Bee's Knees: Create a reusable S-IC stage. It must be able to fly back to KSC ONLY. - 150pts SpaceX is seriously the Best: Create a way to completely reuse the entire craft, bringing the External Fuel Tank back down to be reused along with the rest of the craft - 200pts Constructive Rocketry: Utilizing multiple launches, create a space station or interplanetary ship using the Saturn-Shuttle - 50pts Who Needs Space Stations: Utilizing the S-S, launch a scientific mission into LKO, ala Spacelab. - 25pts Where Kerbals have Gone Before: Utilizing the S-S, launch a mission to either moon of Kerbin - 50pts (BONUS: Land Orbiter on the surface of either moon - add 75pts) Kalileo: Utilizing the S-S, launch an interplanetary probe to Jool ala Galileo - 50pts (BONUS: Utilizing another S-S, return the probe from LKO (after Jool return) to KSC - add 50pts) Pfft, Tourists: Launch a minimum of 10 Kerbals using the S-S - 25pts (BONUS: Add 1pt per kerbal after the minimum 10) SSME's are for wimps: Do not use the Space Shuttle Engines mod - 50pts SCIENCE!: Add 1pt per 1pt of science gained in one mission utilizing the Saturn-Shuttle Realism is the best!: Add extra points for any of the mods below! FAR - 50pts NEAR - 25pts Deadly Reentry Continued - 25pts Real Solar System - 250pts Engine Igniter - 25pts Real Fuels - 25pts Career Mode Multiplier: Creating your Saturn-Shuttle while under the constraints of .24 Career mode will enable to take this modifier. Multiply your final total score 1.05. Career Mode Party Points: For each contract completed by your Saturn-Shuttle in one mission, add 10pts The Lame Participation Trophy: Provide a series of failure pictures, the funnier the better! - 5pts HALL OF FAME: 1. Pörs - 173 points 2. G'th - 102 points. 3.

I can spot FASA in there (or Danny's Saturn V mod, can't tell the difference at that res).

IF you're getting upset over random idiots on the internet, no matter what it is you're doing or what they're saying, then that's just sad. Its been common knowledge for years, hell, decades now that the internet is full of terrible people. Its one thing if people are directly harassing you, like going after your personal email or Facebook or what have you, but getting upset over comments on a mod is useless. As someone who has been in several modding scenes (among other similar scenes), I can honestly say that the comments section is not a place to take seriously.

Aerobraking helps. The basic idea is to dip your Duna periapsis low into its atmosphere (though not too low) so that when you fly through it, it slows you down enough to establish orbit. It may not be perfectly circular or anything like that, but it'll save you a decent amount of fuel.

A lot of sci-fi universes usually go by the rule that the dominant species of the solar system does effectively have jurisdiction over that system. I would imagine this would be how it would play out in real life, at least between peaceful species anyway. Any warmongering species probably wouldn't care unless they couldn't take the system.

Space exploration is cheap. NASA's budget was awful even when the Shuttle (IE, the thing that ended up costing a massive amount more than it was supposed to) was still active, and it still did a lot for progress, both in the construction of the ISS (which has provided a metric **** ton of research on a metric **** ton of areas) and its general job. Whether it was Spacelab or any of the various scientific satellites it deployed. And besides, its an easy way to provide jobs for people, and not just for those in manufacturing. Everyone gets a bump up with a well funded space program. As someone who lives and works right around KSC, I can definitely tell you how badly the ending the shuttle program hit this area. I shudder to think what it'll be like if NASA continues to have its budget cut. That being said though, education and scientific research (be it medical, astronomic, etc etc) in general is under-funded in the US, its not just the space program that doesn't get nearly the amount of funding it deserves. While xcorps has a point, the fact of the matter is the space program deserves no less funding. Civilization in general won't be able to progress much farther without it. Politics. NASA is too heavily controlled by Congress and the President in particular (Granted, they also have issues deciding what they want to do on their own anyway). The Shuttle in particular (and the space station for that matter) was something that NASA might not have bothered with had Nixon not decided it for them.

It depends on a lot of things. Mine almost never crashes despite running over 50 mods including the "Melt Your computer" graphics mods. And even those crashes are fairly predictable as I'm also using a couple of mods that haven't been updated yet and are known to be wacky with x64.

.24.2 eh? Getting a little ahead of ourselves are we?

A purely rational standpoint isn't very fun. Its not like you can "win" at KSP so metagaming (IE, going utilitarian to the point of being completely beyond the threshold of boring) is really pointless. From a purely rational standpoint, these things were a complete waste of time before contracts and still are now. A purely rational standpoint is the difference between spam in a can and an astronaut. Which would you rather be? Whats more fun? A simple <10 part probe you play with for all of 5 minutes or an interesting space station you can spend hours building and playing with? Yes, a simple probe can accomplish the same goals, but that doesn't discount the fact that something like a space station now has more of a point. Is there a reason to specifically build them? No, but I haven't been arguing against that, I've been arguing against the idea that stations still don't have a point, when in fact, they do. (Just because a small 3 part rocket can make a Mun landing doesn't mean a full Apollo-Saturn V replica isn't also acceptable, after all)

Except it isn't. Before .24 all three of them didn't do anything past the initial science they provided. Rovers were the only ones that had an extended lifetime if you used them to traverse biomes. After .24, all three have a point past that initial point beyond just the pure vanity of constructing such things. A station in orbit or a base on the surface don't become pointless structures once you transmit that one-time science, as now science is reoccurring via contracts. Rovers are the same way, except they're mobile so if you're on Mun or Minmus (or even Kerbin) you can go to a different biome to fulfill the contract while at the same time getting more science out of it. In essence, bases, stations, and rovers are now a source of income. Sure, you can just stick a <10 part probe wherever, but you may as well not even bother with the game at that point. KSP, after all, has always been about absurd contraptions, and going purely utilitarian really isn't in the spirit of the game.

Thats terribly unimaginative.

You haven't finished KSP until you've colonized a planet with at least 1000 Kerbals.

Oh snap could the release be imminent? Eeee now I'm all excite.

Yeah, its not much, but its definitely a good way to introduce more purpose to such things. Rovers in particular will be very useful once biomes get added to the other planets, as far off and hard to reach places (like Moho or Eeloo) can have a rover landed on its surface to collect biome science. What I really hope for is contracts to construct a procedural space station/base. Either by providing new subassemblies that you have to launch into the target location, or by requiring that certain modules you can design yourself meet certain requirements. Perhaps even both. Throw in the current Transmit contract with some other neato things to do and you'll have something really cool.

You realize that you've put over 1000 hours into the game and have only been to Duna once.

According to sum, it should be sometime this weekend. TACLS support will be late, but the normal update should be out. That is, if he loves us

Well the thing about the 2g thing is that killing Kerbals is the only real way to limit that. In reality, you just plain wouldn't be able to use these structures as seats for the kerbals at launch, simply because they really are not meant for that purpose. You're missing the properly secured and placed seats (You can't launch sitting sideways or whatever other way. The force of the rocket would rip you out of your seat, and even if you don't die, its just not safe period).

Welp, where do you guys think the Mun or Bust rocket is on the Mun? I've tried to figure out but its hard to tell. * Obviously it there probably isn't an actual rocket stuck into the Mun surface somewhere, but the actual location if it exists would be neat to see.

I'd also like to say that using this on 64bit is just fine. If anything, its actually working better now than it was back in 23.5, even with FAR installed.

Right now I"m setting up a space station in LKO in preparation for my new mission to Duna. Seeing as my first attempt at going interplanetary in .23.5 didn't go so well, I'm going to try it once again for .24.

Hahahahahaha. Gotta admit, was not expecting that.

Ah, seems that may be right. I'm not running B9.