[1.1.2] Kerbal Inventory System (KIS) 1.2.12

[KospY]

I still think there could be a role for the carriable containers. As it is, kerbals can carry a lot of stuff, yet that stuff doesn't seem to take up much space.

You could probably get away with kerbals only having 1/3 of the storage volume, and adding a slightly shrunk version of the old carryable containers to use as backpack.

Carryable containers were fun, it would be a pity to do away with them completely.

Besides the "realistic/weird" problem of carrying containers on back, there is also a gameplay problem. KSP is all about building vehicules. It seem logical to use rover for moving containers for me (and it give purpose to them) and you can also use KAS magnet to lift them. With bigger containers incoming, that will be the only viable solution anyway.

In fact thinking about how to move containers is part of the game for me

For container manipulation in space, it's always possible to use some kind of "space motorbike" :

You can even build it from containers parts.

Also, the eva tether will be another solution to move containers around later.

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Any ideas why some parts are ok to place on the munar ground (and be there after the next reload WITHOUT weird jumps or explosions) and others do strange things after a reload or explode right away?

Just the thought of getting this mod krakenfree would be fantastic

It's a KSP engine problem here, nothing I can do for that... I'm hoping squad will fix the ground collision in the future (especially for small parts).

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Oh, debug menu is in the rightclick context from inventory, nifty.

Having a bug with the debug menu , with my own mod part not the kis parts.

http://i.imgur.com/PnzeaNP.jpg

To this i get a lot if nullref errors in the logfile. The debug works fine with the rest of the parts

ed

http://i.imgur.com/NNTvExvm.png

http://i.imgur.com/RYr0sNom.png

Known bug, will be fixed for the next update.

[Svm420]

Does what KIS tell me my Kerbal weight have an actual effect? I use kerbalmass mod to lighten my kerbals so they can float with betterbouyance. I have my wieght set to 0.04t. IS there anyway to change it for KIS if it is affecting anything. Thanks!

Quoting myself in the hope feedback isn't being missed. Really like the mod, but this is a major issue for me. I don't want fat kerbals despite what maybe real I want my kerbals to float not sink. And I now know that it does hinder gameplay and overwrite what kerbalmass does.

[KospY]

I can confirm this issue. Removing objects from the containers adds the mass rather than subtracting it. Maybe an error in the code? Adding mass when it should be subtracted?

I don't have this issue, what did you do exactly ? Does it happen in the editor or in flight ?

[smjjames]

Can you attach multiple tethers to one kerbonaut (though I imagine removing them might be a bit tricky so you don't remove the wrong one)? Also, can you 'chain link' multiple containers or other objects together like a train? What about determing the max-min lenth of individual tethers?

Just some ideas/thoughts.

[KospY]

I haven't found in the wiki how to make a part attachable on static (ground). Has it been implemented yet?

No, attaching part on static need a dedicated module on the part (so after save/load it anchor again on ground automatically). That was not a problem on KAS because grabmodule was added to stock parts.

However, I want to avoid "patching" every part of the game for mod compatibility and simplicity. Only some dedicated part will be attachable on static (like the pylon on KAS).

For KIS, we are working on a new part for this. Old pylons will also be KIS compatible when KAS will be updated.

Edited March 24, 2015 by KospY

[Yemo]

In addition to Svm420:

When KerbalMass is installed and the mass of a Kerbal is changed in the settings file of Kerbal Mass (eg from the default 0.09something to 0.04, so Kerbals still float with BetterBuoyancy), the change does not work if KIS is installed.

You can test it by having KerbalEngineer and EVA eg on the launch pad.

Without KIS and the change to 0.04 kerbal mass, it shows 0.04 as the vessel mass on EVA.

With KIS and the change, it shows the stock mass of 0.09something and thus the Kerbal plays fish with BetterBuoyancy.

Edited March 21, 2015 by Yemo

[smjjames]

When KerbalMass is installed and the mass of a Kerbal is changed in the settings file of Kerbal Mass (eg from the default 0.09something to 0.04, so Kerbals still float with BetterBuoyancy), the change does not work if KIS is installed.

You can test it by having KerbalEngineer and EVA eg on the launch pad.

Without KIS and the change to 0.04 kerbal mass, it shows 0.04 as the vessel mass on EVA.

With KIS and the change, it shows the stock mass of 0.09something and thus the Kerbal plays fish with BetterBuoyancy.

KospY was actually replying to this:

I can confirm this issue. Removing objects from the containers adds the mass rather than subtracting it. Maybe an error in the code? Adding mass when it should be subtracted?

Although, is KerbalMass also causing the issue that CommanderSmith also confirmed?

[Yemo]

KospY was actually replying to this:

Although, is KerbalMass also causing the issue that CommanderSmith also confirmed?

Whoops, I somehow got confused and didnt read/click properly, edited my post.

[XtensionCord]

I was about to try out KAS when I saw that this got released. This is… impressive. What’s the recommended setup for learning the system now? KAS, KIS or both KAS and KIS?

[JeffreyCor]

Has anyone else encountered a problem where vessels saved with items in the KIS slots will not load properly? I am only having this with vessels that have parts in slots and both VAB and SPH encounter this. I have found this is not connected to the issue with Near Future Solar. If this has not been encountered before or known I will reproduce to provide a log of the instance.

[BoomShroom]

I've been having an issue when I revert flights with KIS parts (including seat inventories) the editor get borked. I also can't load ships while inside the editor, I have to select them using the launching window. These are only inconveniences but still rather annoying.

[JeffreyCor]

Okey dokey, I reproduced so I could get a log and included screen shots to illustrate the issue.

Built ship and added part to KIT inventory

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5i04qb7ut0n3mnw/screenshot3.png?dl=0

Saved and loaded after adding part, this is result

https://www.dropbox.com/s/zi9sdrjj9voyh64/screenshot4.png?dl=0

Log to hopefully indicate what is going on

https://www.dropbox.com/s/tk8zfv36u927ygr/output_log.txt?dl=0

[futrtrubl]

I was about to try out KAS when I saw that this got released. This is… impressive. What’s the recommended setup for learning the system now? KAS, KIS or both KAS and KIS?

They complement each other. But read the first post to know how they do so.

[CommanderSmith]

I don't have this issue, what did you do exactly ? Does it happen in the editor or in flight ?

I have seen it occur in the editor. I have been unable to test it again due to time limitations, but, at the next opportunity, I will look again. It may just be a mod conflict. KerbalMass is not to blame (as I don't have it)

[XtensionCord]

Both of them it is! I wasn't quite sure where KIS ended and KAS began, but there doesn't seem to be any detriment to using both of them. Thanks.

[JeffreyCor]

Have a suggestion regarding the restriction of using the wrench and screwdriver. instead of looking for the engineer trait perhaps instead look for the repair skill. Some mods which change names or reorganize jobs can get very confusing if the check is for a trait which doesn't show up (under a different name / combined with another, etc) which looking for RepairSkill, which is the still for stock Engineer, would possess.

[ExplorerKlatt]

I have seen it occur in the editor. I have been unable to test it again due to time limitations, but, at the next opportunity, I will look again. It may just be a mod conflict. KerbalMass is not to blame (as I don't have it)

I tested this on a stock install with just KIS installed. I was actually testing for the stackable parts because on my modded install the stackable parts don't work.

I did determine that it works with stock but haven't tested for which mod is causing the stackables to not work.

Below is an album showing the inventory adding mass when adding parts and increasing number in a stack, it also adds mass when subtracting from the stack. It doesn't add or subtract mass when removing parts from inventory.

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Output Log

Edit: After further testing, I have noticed that any mod which adds part modules to stackable parts breaks the stackable settings causing to flag most if not all parts as non-stackable.

Edited March 22, 2015 by ExplorerKlatt

[KospY]

I tested this on a stock install with just KIS installed. I was actually testing for the stackable parts because on my modded install the stackable parts don't work.

I did determine that it works with stock but haven't tested for which mod is causing the stackables to not work.

Below is an album showing the inventory adding mass when adding parts and increasing number in a stack, it also adds mass when subtracting from the stack. It doesn't add or subtract mass when removing parts from inventory.

http://imgur.com/a/07eGe

Output Log

Edit: After further testing, I have noticed that any mod which adds part modules to stackable parts breaks the stackable settings causing to flag most if not all parts as non-stackable.

I found the problem, it only happen on new containers added on the ship. Saving/loading the ship fix the issue.

Thanks you for your help !

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Cheers buddy,

I remapped the KAS key to P instead of G and this has solved all problems. However I have identified something new:

I have orbital material science mod or some such, it often gives me two part contracts:

1. Run experiment X in orbit.

2. Recover Experiment X at Kerbin.

So Get my rocket into orbit, out goes the engineer and places experiment X (POSA I / PPMD) it does its thing and runs the experiment. When complete and finalized, engineer goes out and recoveres the experiment and store it in his inventory. The ship lands on Kerbin, and I recover. I get the science from the experiment, condition 1 of the contract is completed, but not condition 2. It is as if placing it into the inventory hides the part from the contract gods.

It is a trivial matter as I force complete in the debug menu. Just wondering if anyone else experiences this problem and has a fix?

Cheers

Added to issues list on Github, I will take a look

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I'm not sure if my usage is unusual, but: most of my KAS-attaching/detaching/moving happens in space, hardly ever on the ground. So some things in the user guide (pdf) have me concerned:

Specifically, it says I can drag and drop parts to the ground ("any surface"), but what is the equivalent in space? Can I still set parts adrift, e.g. to start a new construction? And regarding detaching/re-attaching containers, can they also be moved directly between (a) different mounts part on the same ship, and ( between different ships, without the need to put them on the ground first?

Just drop the part on your kerbal in space

Edited March 22, 2015 by KospY

[Crusher48]

Idea: because weight is lower on planets with lower gravity, let kerbals on those planets move bigger parts around into position. In addition, maybe using a KAS winch on a part makes it easier to move because the kerbals only have to do the attaching and not the moving of the part?

[KospY]

Can you attach multiple tethers to one kerbonaut (though I imagine removing them might be a bit tricky so you don't remove the wrong one)? Also, can you 'chain link' multiple containers or other objects together like a train? What about determing the max-min lenth of individual tethers?

Just some ideas/thoughts.

If you have multiple tether in your inventory I think it's possible to attach multiple tethers to one kerbonaut.

About 'chain link' part together that will another item I think. Eva tether is just for attaching things to eva.

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Does what KIS tell me my Kerbal weight have an actual effect? I use kerbalmass mod to lighten my kerbals so they can float with betterbouyance. I have my wieght set to 0.04t. IS there anyway to change it for KIS if it is affecting anything. Thanks!

As KIS and Kerbalmass changing the same part variable (part.mass), it seem difficult to resolve this kind of conflict.

However, the default kerbal mass is hardcoded in KIS, so I can add a parameter in settings.cfg, so you will be able to change the kerbal mass to what you want.

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Idea: because weight is lower on planets with lower gravity, let kerbals on those planets move bigger parts around into position.

We thought about that, but what rule to apply when moving part in space ?

[d4rksh4de]

We thought about that, but what rule to apply when moving part in space ?

Use more RCS when moving bigger parts, like I could go EVA and move a space shuttle in space if I have enough RCS?

[Kiwa]

Use more RCS when moving bigger parts, like I could go EVA and move a space shuttle in space if I have enough RCS?

With KAS, this happened automatically for any carried parts, since their mass would be added to the Kerbals EVA mass. But isn't RCS usage only an indirect effect? In space, the things that matter are momentum/impulse/time - time not being taken into account by either KAS nor KIS, but the effects of momentum/impulse were always a limit on how big (heavy) parts one could move with KAS. Light parts just work, medium parts can be done (up to maybe half a ton if one is careful or "cheats" by preserving momentum/not changing direction after picking up the part), but for anything heavier than that I found it easier to just "attach" the not-yet-detatched part in steps towards the target position than actually picking them up. So 1t is already pretty heavy as far as I am concerned.

The other limitation in space is the biological limits of the body - bringing things into the exact right position is still very much limited by the amount of controlled force you can apply and the ability of your body to tolerate said force without taking damage. The regular EVA suit doesn't help with that, and the limit would probably be less than factor 5 above what one can move in the natural gravity environment the body is used to. Now, if that kerbal had not just a wrench, but also an exoskeleton...

It would also be interesting to see whether it could be allowed to connect (attach/weld) parts together which are already in the correct position (like +/- 10cm, +/- 10 deg). In that case one could argue the remaining position adjustments are taken care of by properly placed anchors/threads/screws. Let's say I wanted to connect two asteroids using girders (because claws are a buggy nuisance) - it isn't really that difficult to bring the parts into position using tugs, but right now probably neither KAS nor KIS can be convinced to let me put the screws in place. (Current workaround: KAS-grabable standard docking ports. Trusses with two winches should work even without MM, but .. part count.)

Hopefully next week I'll have time to actually play around with KIS and look into the container-conversion-problem.

[Svm420]

As KIS and Kerbalmass changing the same part variable (part.mass), it seem difficult to resolve this kind of conflict.

However, the default kerbal mass is hardcoded in KIS, so I can add a parameter in settings.cfg, so you will be able to change the kerbal mass to what you want.

Please do that is all I need. I just want to be a able to manually set it to what i want. Thank you for 2 of the best mods around!

[Enceos]

Okey dokey, I reproduced so I could get a log and included screen shots to illustrate the issue.

Built ship and added part to KIT inventory

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5i04qb7ut0n3mnw/screenshot3.png?dl=0

Saved and loaded after adding part, this is result

https://www.dropbox.com/s/zi9sdrjj9voyh64/screenshot4.png?dl=0

Log to hopefully indicate what is going on

https://www.dropbox.com/s/tk8zfv36u927ygr/output_log.txt?dl=0

After juggling with mods I found that RCS Build Aid is the culprit of such behavior in the VAB. I think it's a mod compatibility issue. Try removing RCS Build Aid from your install.

[KroShan]

I think i found a new BUG

There is no personal inventory in the "Mobile Processing Lab MPL-LG-2". All items in the inventory are deleted (the inventory is empty) when i enter the lab and go EVA again. Same is true if i transfer a Kerbal from a capsule to the Lab.

btw. grabbing with auto rotation on works fine here. I tried both, grabbing is only broken after visiting the map view.

I had already much fun with trying KIS/KAS - the idea with the handbook is great!

Thanks