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chaos_forge

Now that nuclear engines use only LF, should we have a greater variety of LF-only tanks?

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In I think it was WinterOwl's preview video, we saw that nuclear engines will use only LF now. However, there are very few LF-only tanks in the game, and for example there are no 2.5-meter LF-only tanks. As far as I can see, this problem could be solved one of two ways:

1) add more variety of LF-only tanks

2) Include a tweakable to switch tanks between LF only, Ox only, and LF+Ox, much like Porkjet's nuclear engines mod does.

What are people's thoughts about this?

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A long time ago, they hinted that option #2 was going to be one of the uses of tweakables. And no, I don't think that we need the ability to arbitrarily change them (so no big orange xenon tanks, for example), but having nuclear engines that only use LF and no big LF tanks is going to make me either mod in large LF tanks nor not bother with more ambitious missions, leading me to move on to something else sooner.

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I don't really mind this at all. Real nuclear engines are meant to use hydrogen as a propellant which is not very dense at all. Therefore you'll need larger fuel tanks to carry the same amount of fuel.

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bring on the light-weight fragile gold foil tanks! they hold more and weigh less, but don't get them hot and don't bump in to anything.

perfect for interplanetary transfer vehicles!

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We should be able to choose the type of fuel we put in the tanks. Not only the quantity.

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I agree on this, and I'm excited to SSTO with LF only. Jet to space, then kick on the nuke for thrusting.

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The Fuelswitch system in Atomic Age allows tanks to switch between LFO, LF, and O. That should be done. Has the Isp of the NERVA been increased so that the mass ratios of the emptied tanks aren't crap?

Alternatively, we might should be given a way to fine-tune the ratio of LF to O.

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Are the new wet wings LF only?

i think at least the mk2 & 3 parts should come in jet fuel options. That said it would be better if we got to decide for all tanks within reason.

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....Solution:

Take a 2.5 meter size tank and empty it of oxidizer.

The problem with this is that it will make the ratio of wet to dry mass of your tanks even worse, which defeats the purpose of having efficient engines.

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The Fuelswitch system in Atomic Age allows tanks to switch between LFO, LF, and O. That should be done. Has the Isp of the NERVA been increased so that the mass ratios of the emptied tanks aren't crap?

Increasing the ISP of the NERVA to account for the StupidTanksâ„¢ would be an exercise in how not to fix a problem. I hope they rebalanced the tanks and implemented FuelSwitch.

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The problem with this is that it will make the ratio of wet to dry mass of your tanks even worse, which defeats the purpose of having efficient engines.

IRL, liquid hydrogen (used by NERVAs) has very low density, which is why the Delta IV rockets are much bigger than Atlas Vs but still have the same lifting capacity. A low density tank actually makes it more realistic.

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I've noticed that they've also removed the gimbal, made its atmo ISP even worse, and made it a lot heavier. Honestly I think that chemical engines are preferable to use now unless you enjoy 1 hour burns with 1 LV-N

Edit: Yep just done some tests with using the new LV-N stats (modded the config) against the LV-T45. For my style of building and desired TWRs, the LV-T45 is much better. It was a near thing before but now no contest.

If you are happy to have a very low TWR and not carry much then the LV-N is better.

Edited by Frozen_Heart

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IRL, liquid hydrogen (used by NERVAs) has very low density, which is why the Delta IV rockets are much bigger than Atlas Vs but still have the same lifting capacity. A low density tank actually makes it more realistic.

It's not realistic, because we still have high density LF tanks, and even big LF-only tanks due to the MK3 parts. What we don't have is a variety of high-density LF tanks. So what'll end up happening is you'll be forced to use spaceplane parts if you want to have an LV-N rocket with a halfway decent payload fraction. This is inconsistent, not realistic.

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If you are happy to have a very low TWR and not carry much then the LV-N is better.

Define "very" low TWR.

I'm a bit surprised that squad opened this can of worms; I'm not surprised that having done so, they forgot to put on the lid again. Of course people would ask for fuel-only tanks! And there's no decent way to provide them. I've been dabbling with Real Fuels lately; the need to select which fuel goes where is one major problem with that mod. The UI just isn't up to the task.

The last time this topic came up, someone suggested color-coding the tanks. While not a panacea, this would certainly help.

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Honestly I think that chemical engines are preferable to use now unless you enjoy 1 hour burns with 1 LV-N

Hmmm. The other engine's ISPs have been reduced quite a bit. Can't say that I approve, the whole scheme seems a bit arbitrary; the aerospike has taken an especially bad hit. Anyhoo, the next best engine now has an ISP of 350. The "Nerv" ain't dead yet, despite it's higher weight.

Seriously Squad, why did you call it the "LV-N 'Nerv' Atomic Rocket Motor"? What's wrong with Nerva?

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[h=1]Nuclear Engine for Rocket Vehicle Application (NERVA).[/h]

nerv works, though I prefer Nerva

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Seriously Squad, why did you call it the "LV-N 'Nerv' Atomic Rocket Motor"? What's wrong with Nerva?

Probably because the public thinks you've got a lot of 'Nerv' launching nuclear engines into space.

Me? I'll use jet tanks until they implement some form of FSFuelSwitch (which is what PorkJet's nuke mod uses).

Well, that, or maybe special fuel only tanks that are light, weak, and filled to the brim with fuel (maybe look like round8?)

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Seriously Squad, why did you call it the "LV-N 'Nerv' Atomic Rocket Motor"? What's wrong with Nerva?

Maybe it's a reference to Evangelion?

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Probably because the namesake of NERVA is a human, a Roman emperor.
Maybe it's a reference to Evangelion?

You could both be right. Maybe.

Two things;

1) Does anyone know if the Procedural Parts mod still works in 1.0?

2) Does anyone think it would be better to use separate LF and OXidizer tanks in 'atomic-age'-style designs? Haven't tried it yet, just an informal survey question.

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