[1.12.x] USI Life Support

[Kurtvw]

6 minutes ago, Tabris said:

did you turn on the  hab?

Ok, @Tabris, you probably just kicked me in the skull in the precisely correct fashion.

While I'm pretty familiar with the USI stuff, this was my first few flights with LifeSupport.    Based on the way I read the instructions, I thought that the presence of the hab was all that was necessary.  But, I just now reinstalled and threw it on the pad, and hey, I'm stupid, there is a button to start the hab.

OK, erase the last day, I'm a freakin' moron.

Thanks for all you do @RoverDude, I'll get back to playing with this and probably enjoy it a lot more now that I'm among the enlightened.   Sorry for the bad report. 

[Box of Stardust]

So, I'm doing some funky inter-mod compatibility with USI here; not sure if this question is more suited here or MKS (but maybe sorta both). I really like most of the life support and colony aspects of USI, but I felt like it was missing climate and atmosphere management.

What's the best way to get USI parts to generate Oxygen? Is there a config or something I can grab to add that capability to parts?

[RoverDude]

What are you specifically looking to do?

[lugge]

So, I just did my first flight to Minmus since installing USI-LS.
OK, I tried, but Jeb starved right before arriving at Minmus.

His vessel consists of a MK1 pod.
According to documentation on github, this should provide him with 1 month worth of habitation, right?

But readout says 7 days.
After crossreading through this thread I learned I have to activate habitation, however, I cannot find this option.

Plain KSP installation with USI-LS 7.0 (without CKAN).

[RoverDude]

Right click on the part in question.  Also, some documentation may be out of date - go with what you see in the VAB.

[Box of Stardust]

I'm working off of Kerbalism's configurable settings, through which I've turned off/removed most of its own features, keeping only its atmosphere and climate management. (I like the mod's robust background processing and status UI.)

So pretty much, I'm looking for a way to add CarbonDioxide as inputs for greenhouses and potentially other habitation parts to output Oxygen, to integrate atmosphere management with USI in a reasonable way. I read that there was TAC-LS support in USI, which also uses those resources, but I'm not sure what support for TAC-LS entailed and if there was a framework in place to handle O2 and CO2 already, or if I have to write out something myself, in which case I'd like to know if there's any processes within USI that would most logically have the atmosphere regen linked to. In the end, I want to be able to achieve closed-loop atmo management, working alongside part functions within USI-LS and ISRU stuff that would be happening within MKS.

[lugge]

15 minutes ago, RoverDude said:

Right click on the part in question.  Also, some documentation may be out of date - go with what you see in the VAB.

Nope, not working. MK1 pod does not offer any habitation features.

https://imgur.com/a/92vQZ

 

So, is my assumption correct that a MK1 pod provides 30 days of habitation, thus, is sufficient for going to Minmus?

It seems my MK1 pod does not provide anything.

The 7 day is default even for vessels without any pod.

Edited February 20, 2018 by lugge

[RoverDude]

Kerbalism messes with core stock mechanics that I leverage in USI-LS and MKS, so to be honest, I would not mix them because results can be very sketchy

 

1 minute ago, lugge said:

Nope, not working. MK1 pod does not offer any habitation features.

Album 92vQZ will appear when post is submitted

 

So, is my assumption correct that a MK1 pod provides 30 days of habitation, thus, is sufficient for going to Minmus?

It seems my MK1 pod does not provide anything.

The 7 day is default even for vessels without any pod.

A Mk1 pod does not provide 30 days of hab... that's very much out of date.  It is not sufficient (by design) for Minmus.

[Box of Stardust]

Hm, which core stock mechanics? Is it simply the background processing? I haven't noticed any major issues yet, though I haven't gotten that far either. I also configured out most of the complex processes it modifies, so it should be just a background processor with added atmo management.

[RoverDude]

1 minute ago, Box of Stardust said:

Hm, which core stock mechanics? Is it simply the background processing? I haven't noticed any major issues yet, though I haven't gotten that far either. I also configured out most of the complex processes it modifies, so it should be just a background processor with added atmo management.

That background processing explicitly overrides every single converter that uses stock resource modules, replacing it with a more naive version that does not include functionality.  So stuff gets funky.  So no support provided whatsoever for installs with Kerbalism present (and tbh I really need to flag it as incompatible on CKAN).

[Box of Stardust]

Oh, I'm aware that it's not supported and don't expect it to be. I'm just looking for helpful pointers towards which I could link the functionality I want, if there's no framework that I can work off of to begin with.

That said, the converter overrides were defined in Kerbalism's configs, which I've removed, so I have reason to believe USI's converter functionality shouldn't be affected. I could test these later just in case.

[strudo76]

6 hours ago, lugge said:

Nope, not working. MK1 pod does not offer any habitation features.

https://imgur.com/a/92vQZ

 

So, is my assumption correct that a MK1 pod provides 30 days of habitation, thus, is sufficient for going to Minmus?

It seems my MK1 pod does not provide anything.

The 7 day is default even for vessels without any pod.

Nope. The Mk1 Pod only provides 7 days, and has no habitation function that can be activated. For early Minmus missions, you can stack two Mk1 pods together, which should provide enough time to get there and back I believe pods provide 7 days per seat.

[overkill13]

Is the inline recycler's mass supposed to be more than twice that of an inline greenhouse?  I've been trying to build ships for tourist trips to minmus (6-8 passenger), but it seems more practical to just throw on a greenhouse and go rather than use the recycler.

[tsaven]

4 hours ago, overkill13 said:

Is the inline recycler's mass supposed to be more than twice that of an inline greenhouse?  I've been trying to build ships for tourist trips to minmus (6-8 passenger), but it seems more practical to just throw on a greenhouse and go rather than use the recycler.

A Recyler and a Greenhouse do very different things, so you can't compare them on a direct mass basis.

But if you think about it, a recycler is going to be mostly packed full of machinery, air filters and water purifiers and things like that, so it'll be dense and heavy.  While a greenhouse is mostly empty space for growing plants in and converting mulch to supplies, so while it won't be as heavy it will take up a lot more space.

[overkill13]

6 hours ago, tsaven said:

A Recyler and a Greenhouse do very different things, so you can't compare them on a direct mass basis.

I kinda can, really.  The greenhouse can provide 88% of the supplies consumed by three kerbals, uses 1/7th of the electricity and can continue running while no kerbals are present, all with half the mass including fertilizer, and is subject to an efficiency boost if a biologist is present (do farmers affect greenhouses?).  Add the fertilizer consumption and three kerbals are left consuming 1.08 units of resources per hour, an overall reduction in 80% of the resources consumed, slightly better than the recycler itself.  While the greenhouse is twice the length, it reduces the space needed for storage containers and mass is the real consideration when building a space ship.

[Errol]

I noticed this line in the settings file:

	VetNames = Jebediah,Valentina,Bill,Bob

And am wondering if that means that this feature conflicts with this mod:

Which has a setting that allows you to "remove existing honours" which basically means that the four normal vets start out with white space suits, and have to earn it. Basically I am wondering if this mod exclusively looks at the above list for vets, or if it checks the badass flag for each kerbal? Earn your stripes also allows any kerbal to earn an orange suit, as the name suggests, which would mean that there could be kerbals not in that list that should be treated as vets by USI-LS. 

Edited February 24, 2018 by Errol

[overkill13]

57 minutes ago, Errol said:

And am wondering if that means that this feature conflicts with this mod:

Technically, yes.  USI will not recognize that Bill, Bob, Jeb or Val have had their vet status removed, nor will it recognize new vets as they earn their orange suits.  All of that is a moot point though since the basic settings don't differentiate between rookies and veterans.  All supply, EC, EVA and homesickness values, between vets and non-vets, in that settings file, are the same.  If you are willing to change the vet effect values, then you could probably just edit the VetNames to suit your save.  A hassle sure, but until RoverDude sees fit to add compatibility, that would solve your issue.

It might be advisable to remove this line from the original post "Orange suited Kerbals (Jeb, Bill, Bob, and Val) are immune to the ill effects of life support. They will still consume supplies if given, but do not leave the job, because they are just that awesome. This always gives a player (especially a new one) an 'out' to test out a manned mission before actually committing your other kerbals, etc. to a horrible fate of snack deprivation."  The settings file tells a different story.

[Errol]

@overkill13 Thanks, fair enough. I have changed many of my other settings to be more difficult than default, and dont mind manually adding vets to this list as they earn their stripes. Just thought I'd double check first though.

[RoverDude]

6 hours ago, overkill13 said:

I kinda can, really.  The greenhouse can provide 88% of the supplies consumed by three kerbals, uses 1/7th of the electricity and can continue running while no kerbals are present, all with half the mass including fertilizer, and is subject to an efficiency boost if a biologist is present (do farmers affect greenhouses?).  Add the fertilizer consumption and three kerbals are left consuming 1.08 units of resources per hour, an overall reduction in 80% of the resources consumed, slightly better than the recycler itself.  While the greenhouse is twice the length, it reduces the space needed for storage containers and mass is the real consideration when building a space ship.

Except that a recycler massively multiplies the effectiveness of a greenhouse because it reduces overall consumption, and requires no additional non-renewable resources.  Greenhouses are more empty space, recyclers are mostly equipment.  All of these things are carefully balanced and by design.

[reaction_wheel]

Question: Does the time that a Kerbal spend in a DeepFreeze cryopod count towards that kerbonaut's "home" counter?

Or is the home counter only updated when the Kerbal is actively part of a vessel's crew?

If the answer is "time spent frozen still counts as time away from home", perhaps this is a feature request for the USI-LS mod.

I feel like I might be able to figure this out by poking at the save files, but I was wondering if anyone had a straightforward answer.

Thanks @RoverDude for such a great mod, and thanks to anyone who can provide some insight.

[RoverDude]

To be honest, no idea on that one.  Though I have toyed with the idea of integrating a similar mechanic into USI-LS, just a bit busy with Making History at the moment

[DStaal]

I'm pretty sure (but not quite 100%) that time in a cryopod doesn't count toward their home counter.  As far as anything but DeepFreeze is concerned, the Kerbals don't exist while they are frozen.

[RoverDude]

New Release is up.  NOTE:  This is the final 1.3.1 release (pending any major issues).  

0.7.1 - 2017.03.06
------------------
Depencency Updates
USI-LS containers now support USI warehouse logistics
Fixed a bug that caused inconsistencies in habitation bonus as vessels would enter or leave shared life support range of other vessels.

[Bit Fiddler]

I was coming here to comment on the Veteran status as well.  It seems to me Vet status is tracked in Vanilla KSP.  it would be nice if this mod just used the vanilla KSP vet status as well, so other mods that modify and/or read this value all play together?  Specifically that "Earn your stripes" mod is what I was looing at as well, as it adds a great deal to the RP aspect of KSP.  I have it set to strip all vet status and make every Kerbal earn this status with in game actions.  Therefore, it would be nice if USI-LS just read this value there, so I do not have to remember to modify the list as Kerbals rank up to Vet.

 

[jack gamer]

You are just awesome and great at making these