Is the LV-N broken?

[Argon]

So the 1.0 LV-N seems to be broken to me, as well as unrealistic. This new update introduces added realism to the game, another result is the LV-N cooking off at half throttle, this is both obnoxious and unrealistic. A real nuclear rocket is cooled by the flow of unreacted propellant, if anything the LV-N would overheat more readily at a tenth throttle than at full.

What do all of you think?

-Argon

[Temeter]

Look at the forum before creating another thread, we already got one about nukes overheating:

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/117205-PSA-Nuclear-engine-overheating

That behaviour is indeed and fixable by your ship design.

[Argon]

^I did look, and the other thread contained no poll.

[Temeter]

Your poll is biased and therefor useless.

[Jarin]

Talk about biased poll wording. We need a better method of dealing with heat, but there's nothing inherently wrong with the idea.

[Frozen_Heart]

A poll is a good idea but your is heavily biased. Change the wording.

We need radiators to deal with heat.

[Temeter]

The post is also misinformed. For more constructive advice, heat is being distributed and radiated realistically now, so take those debug heat tools (satuaration and context menu) and looks at your ship. I need two tries to build a basically heutneutral (+bad and inefficient) ship, which brings 27ton over 3600dv without overheating.

[Hanuman]

Sure there's something wrong with it. Unless you want to be required to use LV-N's with wings stuck all over them, which seems to kind of go against the spirit of the game. If there were supposed to be a requirement, it'd be built into the model of the engine itself. There's nothing wrong with it overheating as is at full throttle, but half?

[Temeter]

Sure there's something wrong with it. Unless you want to be required to use LV-N's with wings stuck all over them, which seems to kind of go against the spirit of the game. If there were supposed to be a requirement, it'd be built into the model of the engine itself. There's nothing wrong with it overheating as is at full throttle, but half?

Noooooooope, that's not how it works. The design of your ship decides how heat builds up and is radiated. It's completely different from pre-1.0 versions. Throttle isn't nearly as much as a deciding factor as it was earlier. And no, you don't need wings or other extra parts for radiation.

Short version: You want to spread heat through your whole ship so every part can do it's job at radiating heat. Nuclear T/W above 0.4 might be unsustainable now.

Edited April 30, 2015 by Temeter

[Argon]

My wording, despite being biased does reflect the problem, the once steadfast nuke now overheats at half throttle unless a massive unaerodynamic array of wings is stuck to it, if squad wanted to make a dedicated heatsink part I would be fine, however they did not. The new nuclear engine can't be used in small aerodynamic craft anymore. The result of this is two separate SSTO designs that rely on the LV-N for vacuum op which can manage orbit running pinned, but not at 1/3 throttle(tested with cheats).

-Argon

[Enorats]

This entire heat system needs to go back to the drawing board. It can be almost entirely ignored if you're using rockets, but for planes it's making the game almost unplayable. Provided I manage to make it out of the atmosphere at a decent speed/ap my nukes don't have enough power to get me into orbit anymore because they can't be run for more than a few seconds without blowing themselves up from heat. I have to run them at a fraction of their normal thrust, or shut them off repeatedly every few seconds. Either way, they're nearly useless now. I used to use spaceplanes almost exclusively.. but now I'm not even bothering to spend a dime on them because they can't do anything that rockets can't do far better and easier.

[NFUN]

My wording, despite being biased does reflect the problem, the once steadfast nuke now overheats at half throttle unless a massive unaerodynamic array of wings is stuck to it, if squad wanted to make a dedicated heatsink part I would be fine, however they did not. The new nuclear engine can't be used in small aerodynamic craft anymore. The result of this is two separate SSTO designs that rely on the LV-N for vacuum op which can manage orbit running pinned, but not at 1/3 throttle(tested with cheats).

-Argon

Part of it is balancing. SQUAD probably doesn't want people using the Nerva for everything like they used to, so they make it for difficult for them to be used on small light ships. You can argue that it goes against basic KSP philosophy to 'encourage' design like that, but the engine used to be abused quite a bit.

[Temeter]

So much complaining by people who obviously don't understand the system...

[Argon]

Part of it is balancing. SQUAD probably doesn't want people using the Nerva for everything like they used to, so they make it for difficult for them to be used on small light ships. You can argue that it goes against basic KSP philosophy to 'encourage' design like that, but the engine used to be abused quite a bit.

Perhaps if they didn't want everyone to use the nuke they shouldn't have nerfed the ISP of every single LFO chemical engine.

-Argon

[regex]

The LV-N should have a reduced heat output, but it has always run hot. What likely happened is that the devs simply reduced the heatProduction of the engine by a set amount or multiplier and released. Hopefully it will be reduced in the next update.

[NovaSilisko]

Radiator parts would be a great way to help this out. The heat can stay the same if they come along. Heat management is a mechanic sorely lacking in almost all space games.

[Whirligig Girl]

The poll is biased. There's a solution without changing the LV-N, which is to add heat radiator panels!

[NFUN]

Perhaps if they didn't want everyone to use the nuke they shouldn't have nerfed the ISP of every single LFO chemical engine.

-Argon

Fair point, though getting into orbit is much cheaper.

[Temeter]

Or you build a craft that spreads heat:

Not a single part included for extra radiation, and that's without using the cargo to further radiate heat. Full thrust, 0.32t/w with cargo and full tanks. Doesn't overheat.

Edited April 30, 2015 by Temeter

[Argon]

Fair point, though getting into orbit is much cheaper.

A fair point as well, but they could have just nerfed atmo ISP not vacuum.

-Argon

[Enorats]

Ha! Yeah, build a ship that spreads the heat. That's a wee bit difficult when you're putting them on space planes. Your options a far more limited.

[Levelord]

SQUAD gave us overheating NERVAs but never provided us with radiator parts or parts designed to radiate heat.

"The NERVA is realistic guys, just place wing parts all over it to radiate the heat" - This is saying that the part is realistic, you just need to make unrealistic modifications to make it work. Wings are not realistically meant to radiate heat, and they are not a solution for this if you want to aim for realism. Give us some radiator parts to deal with the heat.

[Temeter]

Ha! Yeah, build a ship that spreads the heat. That's a wee bit difficult when you're putting them on space planes. Your options a far more limited.

You know what planes are full of? Parts, which are superfluous in spaceflight but radiate heat. You know what planes have in spares? Wings, the number one heat radiator. I actually just tested my old nuclear plane, and it made more than 2000 dv before overheating, and that was without even trying to build a long range plane.

[regex]

Ha! Yeah, build a ship that spreads the heat. That's a wee bit difficult when you're putting them on space planes. Your options a far more limited.

Well, you're essentially limiting yourself to an aerodynamic shape that can handle aerodynamic forces, what did you expect?

[ArmchairGravy]

I saw where it has overheating issues, limited it to 88.5%. Doesn't overheat, works fine when attached to a liquid fuel fuselage. *shrug* Poll should have a third option: Knows how to use it, works fine.