Why am I so bad at career mode?

[wossname]

1.0 is kicking my butt. Didn't used to be like this. It's as if my ship design is a secret password - wrong password, NO SPACE FOR YOU!

Why is there so little science reward for such hard early contracts? 1 science point for a mun flyby? Are you kidding me?

I'm struggling to find enjoyment in the career mode any more.

HEEEEEEEEEEELP!

[MacroNova]

They want you to get science from doing experiments. And they want you to reach for bigger and bigger goals instead of grinding. Get to orbit, do a Mun flyby, do a Minmus flyby, etc. You'll get lots of science real quick. You only need about 1000 extra dV after making orbit to do free return flybys of each moon.

[Randazzo]

1.0 is kicking my butt. Didn't used to be like this. It's as if my ship design is a secret password - wrong password, NO SPACE FOR YOU!

Why is there so little science reward for such hard early contracts? 1 science point for a mun flyby? Are you kidding me?

I'm struggling to find enjoyment in the career mode any more.

HEEEEEEEEEEELP!

Contracts are mainly for funds now. You (mostly) only get science for actual science.

One of the first steps for me was to send small, cheap science bombs (goo!) to as many biomes as I could reach. Don't forget that you can run every type of experiment from the launchpad, the runway, and every building at KSC to collect some science. Once you've made enough to unlock the surface sample ability, this can be a pretty significant boost.

Admittedly it was a lot tougher to get my feet off the ground (as it were) than in previous version careers, but once you get used to the gathering, it starts to fall into place.

[Ulzgoroth]

1.0 is kicking my butt. Didn't used to be like this. It's as if my ship design is a secret password - wrong password, NO SPACE FOR YOU!

Where is it going wrong? If you're having trouble getting launch to space to work, a few 1.0 key notes:

-Don't go too fast in the lower atmosphere. You will have stability and heating problems. And don't even try to turn more than the tiniest bit at those altitudes.

-Once you get to 20-25km the air is thin enough that you can tip over to orbital prograde safely.

-High atmosphere drag is very low. Flying at 60km for a while building up orbital speed won't hurt you much.

Oh, and if your rocket doesn't look streamlined, there's a good chance it isn't, and that can make things worse in the low atmosphere.

Why is there so little science reward for such hard early contracts? 1 science point for a mun flyby? Are you kidding me?

You should be getting science by doing science. A mun flyby gives you opportunities for temperature readings, crew reports, EVA reports, goo and material bay experiments...

Lots of science, but you won't just get it handed to you.

[wossname]

More moaning, because I feel sorry for myself for no reason...

I was initially encouraged by being able to get about 120 science by doing the normal science spamming tactics - but that only gets you to the mediocre early rocketry parts and crap aircraft parts and maybe thermometers if you're lucky.

Now I'm pretty much stuck on Kerbin with 400 tightwad hipster tourists and no decent biomes in range because my unmanned rockets will not fly in a straight line and a grand total of 3.6 science to spend.

Trapped in purgatory and there is no science here.

The other option is sandbox. But in sandbox, nothing matters. No fun.

Bah

[Aragosnat]

Sounds like you need a bigger launch pad and bigger VAB. That way you can spam rockets that hopefully get you to land upon Mün and Minmus easier. But, from the looks of it. There should still be enough science to fill out the bulk of the tech tree.

[Randazzo]

More moaning, because I feel sorry for myself for no reason...

I was initially encouraged by being able to get about 120 science by doing the normal science spamming tactics - but that only gets you to the mediocre early rocketry parts and crap aircraft parts and maybe thermometers if you're lucky.

Now I'm pretty much stuck on Kerbin with 400 tightwad hipster tourists and no decent biomes in range because my unmanned rockets will not fly in a straight line and a grand total of 3.6 science to spend.

Trapped in purgatory and there is no science here.

The other option is sandbox. But in sandbox, nothing matters. No fun.

Bah

Have you flown around in a plane, landing at all the biomes you can reach and taking samples/reports/experiments?

Beyond that I could suggest perusing the add-ons forum for something that might interest you. (yes, yes, "You shouldn't have to mod stock!" blah blah)

[klgraham1013]

The other option is sandbox. But in sandbox, nothing matters. No fun.

Nothing matters? I find designing and completing a difficult mission in sandbox highly rewarding.

- - - Updated - - -

Also, the problem might not be you, but career mode itself.

[Sandworm]

Have you tried the science-only option?

Career mode is unbalanced, creating lots of pressure points that take the fun out of things. The science-only approach allows for progression without grind.

[wossname]

Sounds like grinding. If it takes several (real-world) days to get up to a strong tech base then this is going to hurt a lot of players every time a new update comes out.

I notice that 1.0.1 and 1.0.2 have been released in the last few hours.

*sigh*

The trials and tribulations we endure eh?

[Bandock]

I nearly succeeded in bringing in a Science Jr. along with the Service Bay (containing a mystery goo container) a few days ago until it fell victim to the pod flipping bug, killing Jeb. This was from a Mun flyby that went well, but exploded due to the flipping bug in 1.0.0. I haven't tried doing that again yet in 1.0.1, but I'm planning to.

[Ulzgoroth]

More moaning, because I feel sorry for myself for no reason...

I was initially encouraged by being able to get about 120 science by doing the normal science spamming tactics - but that only gets you to the mediocre early rocketry parts and crap aircraft parts and maybe thermometers if you're lucky.

Now I'm pretty much stuck on Kerbin with 400 tightwad hipster tourists and no decent biomes in range because my unmanned rockets will not fly in a straight line and a grand total of 3.6 science to spend.

Trapped in purgatory and there is no science here.

The other option is sandbox. But in sandbox, nothing matters. No fun.

Bah

If you've spent all the science you can get in the space center and in Kerbin orbit and gotten airplane bits but not good enough rockets to orbit the moon (if you have 909s, you can do that pretty easily), you're probably going to need to go farm up some science by flying the airplanes around Kerbin with instrument packages. Which will take a while.

I suspect you're overlooking some available sources of science, though. I have left a lot of orbital and even planetary science untapped and had both adequate rockets and thermometers for my moon orbit mission.

[wossname]

In answer to recent posts - yes I have built new planes with many science instruments and flown them far and wide and hath spammeth aplenty where applicable. The rewards are dwindling, alas.

I understand the attraction of sandbox mode, but it's something that I have always felt to be a bit aimless. "Sure I can build this 8000 ton mega-frigate with homing missiles, but so what?".

Might go back to 0.90.

[ghpstage]

A big tip for maximising science income - Scientists can both reset goo and Science jr experiments allowing unlimited re-useability, and can use them to perform experiments while EVA. I just did a second flight in a new career game where I grabbed just under 150 science while completing the first orbit contract (just about scraped high orbit), I bought the EVA upgrade while in orbit and reused a single material lab and two goo's to pick up in flight, high altitude, low space and high space as well as EVA spam and crew reports.

Also nice is that thermometers no offer high space science rather than just bugging out.

A small lander to Minmus, with a single science jr to hop around biomes may be able to pick up in excess of 1,000 SP.

[wossname]

A big tip for maximising science income - Scientists can both reset goo and Science jr experiments allowing unlimited re-useability, and can use them to perform experiments while EVA. I just did a second flight in a new career game where I grabbed just under 150 science while completing the first orbit contract (just about scraped high orbit), I bought the EVA upgrade while in orbit and reused a single material lab and two goo's to pick up in flight, high altitude, low space and high space as well as EVA spam and crew reports.

Also nice is that thermometers no offer high space science rather than just bugging out.

A small lander to Minmus, with a single science jr to hop around biomes may be able to pick up in excess of 1,000 SP.

There is a phrase "easier said than done". I'd seriously appreciate a good description (or a tutorial) about how to accomplish that. Getting to Minmus seems to be an impossibility given the tech tree choices I've made so far.

Painting oneself into a corner is definitely a thing in KSP 1.0.x.

[Ulzgoroth]

There is a phrase "easier said than done". I'd seriously appreciate a good description (or a tutorial) about how to accomplish that. Getting to Minmus seems to be an impossibility given the tech tree choices I've made so far.

Painting oneself into a corner is definitely a thing in KSP 1.0.x.

I don't think we know what choices you've made so far, or what you are having problems with. Do you, for instance, have Advanced Rocketry? If you do, and you have the first launch pad upgrade, you most definitely can go to the mun.

(And if you don't it's only 45 science, you can definitely scrape that up without having to go far.)

[SRV Ron]

The two patches changed enough in Career that I had to start a new one. The RT-10 got so nerfed in the reconfigured atmosphere that I needed a three stage version just to reach slightly over 70,000 meters

I didn't test the 2 stage design, the one that didn't require a pad upgrade, to see if it could still reach orbit. This design below with the upgraded pad reached orbit with some fuel to spare. And yes, you can still reach orbit with fuel to spare with just under 3,000 delta V. Note, I forgot to put a KE module on it so had to fly it the hard way to orbit. With a third stage using the LV-909, it should do a Mun flyby with ease.

Reentry took less time in the heating phase. I was even able to land at KSP on the very first attempt just by eyeballing when to do the retro burn. As far as the parachute, that has been fixed so if you deploy it too soon, it will burn off. However, the 15G kick is now gone.

Edited May 2, 2015 by SRV Ron

[Wanderfound]

This sort of grindy trickery really isn't necessary, but if you do need some easy science:

RT-5 + Stayputnik + ScienceJr/GooPods + launch clamps + tailfins + parachute. Launch clamps are optional.

Angle the tailfins a tiny bit to provide spin stabilisation (like on a dart or an arrow). If using launch clamps, angle the whole rocket to point it in the desired direction; if not, just push the nose over immediately post-launch before the spin gets too strong to overcome. Light rocket, wait for burnout, deploy parachute, collect science. You can reach at least half a dozen biomes from KSC by doing this.

[wossname]

Wow, lots of good advice here, thank you everyone.

I also think the new aero system has thrown me off kilter, perhaps my vehicles are inefficient because I'm too accustomed to the old soup atmosphere. I'll get the slide rule out and try some different stuff.

1.0.2 is just out so I'll upgrade and start fresh and put some of your tips into practice!

[Bilfr3d]

Although you may think that sandbox is not 'fun', it can be useful in times like this. Go into sandbox, limit yourself to the tech tree parts you're at (using the category part selection > tech tier), and just fiddle around with some different craft designs until you get the hang of the new aero. TBH it really isn't hard, you just need to get the hang of it first. I found the transition easy myself, for the pure fact that I used to use FAR on my base install... and *cough* never did gravity turns in stock anyway *cough*

[wossname]

I've changed my strategy to the following...

Do nothing but get all the local science data that can be had with the Flea engine and take the most direct route through the tech tree to get the "Aviation" category parts - this has wheels and wings! I reckon this is a better jumping off point for spamming science points since I can just taxi around the KSC and visit each building in turn. Hmm, wonder if the swimming pool is it's own biome...

I managed to get 33 science points by using this rather odd looking contraption...

Crank the thrust limit all the way down to the lowest setting (seems to be 5.5%) and tilt it up very steeply (but not quite vertical). This will then gently accelerate and you can steer easily and govern the speed by using the brakes. There is enough go juice to visit the astronaut complex, the R&D centre, the tracking station and the VAB in one trip. That was enough to go back and buy some of the earlier tech tree items I had done without in order to grab the Aviation parts.

Bootstrapping FTW

Edited May 2, 2015 by wossname