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b1ackhat

Is KSP fun ?

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Here's what I love about KSP - flying around in space, building a station in orbit, building a base on a distant planet or moon.

Here's what's not fun at all about KSP: spending 3 hours between the VAB and the launchpad because your rocket flies in every direction except up, and for no reason that the game would tell me. And it's not that I'm trying to launch a 1000 part 5000 ton behemoth. It's a regular rocket with 3 stages or so.

What's the point in having a game where you can build stuff to fly if 90% of it doesn't fly in a usable manner and you spend all your time trying to discover those 10% that will eventually work?

It's gotten to the point where all the game does to me is cause frustration.

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It isn't a game about throwing stuff together, at least for me. Since physics amd aerodynamics are important factors in ship design, one's craft may not work. Thrust misalignment, drag, misplaced center of mass and/or pressure... all these things make for an engineering challenge.

Which is why the game is fun for me. Getting, as you say, that last 10% is the most satisfying thing I've come across in a game.

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The thing is that KSP is basically rocket science, its got a massive learning curve, have you posted over in the help and tutorials subfourm with some screen shots of your craft, they might be able to help you figure out what is wrong with it.

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Well that's the thing, it's not just one design. I tried dozens of variations trying to get a couple of things into an Orbit. And it keeps happening again and again, and the game doesn't tell me why this is happening. All I see is a rocket flipping over. I have no idea why, which is the frustrating part. If the game would give me an indicator, I'd have something to work with. But there's just nothing at all.

I've gotten to the Mun and back, several times with different rockets. But then I spend hours failing to even get back into Kerbin Orbit, and I have no clue why.

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KSP has consistently been and still remains the most fun I've had on a computer ever. It is in almost every way exactly the game I want it to be.

Sorry to hear your rockets are flipping around, but really the fault is either in the design or the piloting, not the game. I will give you that a little more feedback could be nice but I've so far seen massive benefit from turning on the drag indicators. And also refer to those linked posts.

It's not harder. It's a different kind of hard.

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Every rocket flipping problem always comes down to the CoM getting behind the CoL. Check your fins, check your wet and dry CoM, and check where the fuel starts draining from. If you stack a lot of tanks end to end, it's easy to have the top one drain first, then the second, and the CoM sinks backwards as you do so.

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I think that the best thing about KSP is the fact that failures can be fun to watch and encourage you to try again and again ... and again, until sweet success !

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Every rocket flipping problem always comes down to the CoM getting behind the CoL.

Not always, check my post on the matter here.

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Is water wet?

Is the Space Pope reptilian?

Seriously, tons of people are having fun in 1.0, including me. Your problems are solvable. Look around the forums and you'll see plenty of people who have figured it out which means KSP isn't to blame. You just haven't figured it out yet. It took me a week to get into orbit in 0.23 when I first got KSP, after watching lots of videos, and now it is even harder. KSP is just a hard game. Period. And super fun.

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Hee hee. I created a "duplicate thread" that I think is a bit of a better explanation, which you can find here. It covers pretty much everything you need to know, and with more accuracy than the one shown above (though it is a bit of a long read).

Now, back on topic!

KSP is fun precisely because most designs won't work unless they're carefully planned, built, and flown. It's a game about learning what's wrong and then trying again... learning what went wrong there and then trying again... and again... and again. If you reach a stumbling block (and it seems you have), there's an enormous amount of Forum-goers who want to help! If one aspect of the game makes it impossible for you to have fun, you can use a mod to bypass it. If the game is still causing you grief, just play something else for a little while, and come back when you think it would be nice to give it another shot.

And trust me, getting your rocket to work will be massively satisfying... a bit like an itch that you are finally able to scratch. You'll realize that there was a relatively easy fix for the problem, you'll kick yourself, and then you'll eagerly press onwards. It's happened to me loads of times, trust me.

KSP is fun (to me, at least). It is, to quote Dean Kamen, the "hardest fun you'll ever have." But it's the most nerve-wracking, rewarding, and enjoyable game I've ever come across.

Best of luck!

-Upsilon

Edited by UpsilonAerospace

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I have only experienced my rockets flipping around once, and that was when I mounted a plane on top of a rocket. Fortunately no one was hurt, but all it to fix it was a boat load of wings on the bottom.

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That's why I use MechJeb. If it can't put a ship into orbit, it's most probably because the ship is poorly designed. The difference between good and bad designs is actually pretty intuitive: good rockets don't look cartoonish or sci-fi'ish, they usually look like, well... rockets. Think about Falcon 9 for small payloads and Saturn V for larger ones. Enormous payloads cannot into space, deal with it.

TWR and dV readings help, too.

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People who don't fine KSP to be fun don't spend their time on a forum. So it's really bad place to ask ;)

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I had some problems with control early in my 1.02 career. I had not unlocked SAS modules so my rockets had very little control authority. When I stopped using SRBs and replaced them with gimballing engines my control problems were gone, and I was able to get stuff into space, earn science and unlock SAS.

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Aerodynamics is a huge part of rocket design, do we complain about how much fuel we need to reach space? No... Try paying attention to aerodynamics when building a rocket, just like you do with planes (I'm not saying the rocket has to look like a plane).

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Is KSP fun? I think so. Do you? If not, you don't need to play it anymore.

I am certain you could overcome your issues with aerodynamics in 1.02, just like thousands of us have, and continue having just as much fun as you did before the update.

Or you can complain about it on the forum.

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"duplicate thread"

Na sorry Upsilon the more the merrier on that one. My duplicate comment was towards all the "flipping rockets" threads that pop up every hour

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Is water wet?

Umm... not when it's frozen.

I think more than just being 'fun' (or not), I find the game a challenge - and in that challenge is the 'fun'. With the new aero, I've built plenty of wobbly rockets so far; the challenge being to make them not wobble and fly good. I've found a thing I've never used before to be a big help in that aspect - procedural fairings. That, and throttling back (almost an inconceivable concept to me lol). Oh and fins too.

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Here's what's not fun at all about KSP: spending 3 hours between the VAB and the launchpad because your rocket flies in every direction except up, and for no reason that the game would tell me. And it's not that I'm trying to launch a 1000 part 5000 ton behemoth. It's a regular rocket with 3 stages or so.

What? I have no clue what you're talking about. Unless I try launching overly large stuff, I haven't had a problem like that, outside of using FAR on my last 0.90 save. Maybe that was enough practice to not have problems with the new stock aero, maybe I'm just naturally building stuff that flies well, but I seriously cant imagine how you have a problem getting a normal 3 stage rocket off of Kerbin... o_O

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Honestly, I like it when my rockets keep flipping around, It forces me to try new methods to keep them straight, from adding more fins in unexpected places to just going whatever andding add moar boosters to power through the atmosphere (guess how that one worked out). Basically its the failures that make this game fun for me. Also playing without quicksaves is a blast, it makes everything way more tense.:wink:

Edited by peachoftree
profanity

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