Nertea

[1.7.x] Heat Control - More radiators! (May 29)

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the only thing i noticed is, that when the radiators (or an other single part of the ship) is very hot and you timewarp really fast, the heat is distributed evenly to the whole ship ... which can be very destructive, when you have 4 or more nearly melting radiators ...

Well, theres already wierdness with the heat system when you timewarp.

Also, I'm not sure how much of it was because I was at Moho, but the entire ship got pretty hot after returning to it after some time. Give me a min to post a pic.

I don't have an image of the hot ship atm, but I do have a pic of the stage that I'm talking about in the editor.

Also, the maxtemp of those hydrogen tanks is really low, no idea if that was intended or not.

screenshot58_zpstyphwnah.png

Edited by smjjames

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the only thing i noticed is, that when the radiators (or an other single part of the ship) is very hot and you timewarp really fast, the heat is distributed evenly to the whole ship ... which can be very destructive, when you have 4 or more nearly melting radiators ...

Was about to comment on this. As soon as I go over 100x timewarp, things start blowing up. I've tested this on a clean install with only Heat Control and Near Future Electrical (and HyperEdit, for testing purposes, but I doubt that's it), and it still happens. It's really easy to reproduce as well.

Take a probe core, an MX-2 reactor and two XR-4500 radiators, put them in space, extend the radiators, start the reactor and increase warp to above 100x. The MX-2 overheats and explodes.

EDIT: And you already commented on that. Is it possible to detect time warp? Maybe add a workaround that sets heat output to zero when using 100x+ time acceleration or something similar? I realize that would be more of an Near Future Electrical Issue, but still.

Edited by Hellrespawn

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I'm still a little confused about how this all works. Should the insulators be between the engines and the fuel tank, or should it be insulating what's above the fuel tank in the stack?

That is, should I be treating the fuel tank as a heat sink, with radiators attached radially and the insulator to keep the heat from spreading?

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Was about to comment on this. As soon as I go over 100x timewarp, things start blowing up. I've tested this on a clean install with only Heat Control and Near Future Electrical (and HyperEdit, for testing purposes, but I doubt that's it), and it still happens. It's really easy to reproduce as well.

Take a probe core, an MX-2 reactor and two XR-4500 radiators, put them in space, extend the radiators, start the reactor and increase warp to above 100x. The MX-2 overheats and explodes.

Is it just one part thats exploding or does the whole thing explode?

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I'm still a little confused about how this all works. Should the insulators be between the engines and the fuel tank, or should it be insulating what's above the fuel tank in the stack?

That is, should I be treating the fuel tank as a heat sink, with radiators attached radially and the insulator to keep the heat from spreading?

Heat management is tricky, and it all depends on where the heat is coming from and what you want to protect.

If you just want to keep the engine from blowing up, likely you don't want any insulators at all. Dump the engine heat into the biggest mass you have available (ie. the whole rest of the ship), and then radiate away from that mass.

If you have multiple heat sources (like a nuclear reactor and also an engine), you may want an insulator between them so you can treat each one as an independent problem.

Keep in mind that as you use up the fuel, the mass of the fuel tank will decrease, which might also complicate matters.

(FWIW I've done heat engineering in real life, but I'm only starting to play around with it in KSP.)

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I reproduced what I was talking about while over Kerbin. Pretty sure that it shouldn't be getting that hot and the temp is actually cooling down after. Plus I think it's the same one because when you go into high warp, it resets up to 794 or so. Even bypasses the insulation.

screenshot61_zpsapmvypcb.png

Closeup of the network of heat pipes.

screenshot63_zpsu1evglbw.png

- - - Updated - - -

Nothing to do with me sadly, that's how heat behaves in stock.

Oh wait, that thing which I showed above is a stock quirk? Oh well.

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As I mentioned above, this is a stock bug/"feature". When you go above 100x timewarp, the entire ship gets treated as one unit and the sum of heat dissipation and generation is computed and applied to the ship. I'm not 100% sure how the formula works. I suspect it is the same with loading/saving. There's nothing I can do about this, really.

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As I mentioned above, this is a stock bug/"feature". When you go above 100x timewarp, the entire ship gets treated as one unit and the sum of heat dissipation and generation is computed and applied to the ship. I'm not 100% sure how the formula works. I suspect it is the same with loading/saving. There's nothing I can do about this, really.

so best things is to stay UNDER 100x timwaro until things got cooled enough.

good to know

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so best things is to stay UNDER 100x timwaro until things got cooled enough.

good to know

Doesn't help if you've got a reactor running with radiators because things won't cool down. Well, the radiators won't anyway.

I wonder if the new skin heating system in 1.03 will fix this.

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I'm about to do a small update to this pack, are there any bugs that need to be worked out?

Not so far, loving it, could we get a larger radiator please ? :P

One of my craft is sporting 2x 2000ec/s reactors and with the engines I needed almost 30 of the largest radiators to keep it all from burning up.

Would be nice to cut down on the part count ;)

Edited by Donziboy2

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Not so far, loving it, could we get a larger radiator please ? :P

One of my craft is sporting 2x 2000ec/s reactors and with the engines I needed almost 30 of the largest radiators to keep it all from burning up.

Would be nice to cut down on the part count ;)

Uh, the XR-4500 is pretty dang big, and for the reactors, use the ones that are specialized for the reactor type.

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Minor update, with several new parts, including the oft-requested ISS-style triple radiator, surface curved radiators (make an Apollo radiator!) and a new mini radiator fin. In addition, two heat exchanger parts which have high conductivity and nice mount points for heat pipes and radiators.

Heat Control 0.1.1

  • Added RBMK-1500 and RBMK-1000 Heat Exchangers
  • Added XR-1500x3 Deployable Heat Radiator
  • Added YC 600, YC 400 and YC-400 Surface Heat Radiators
  • Added YZ-70 Heat Radiator Fin
  • Fixed compatibility issues with DRE
  • Fixed identical costs for all insulators
  • Cost pass for all radiators, most got cost decreases.
  • Reduced mass of Tau radiator to 0.07 from 0.10
  • Increased mass and heat rejection of XR-6000 (used to be XR-4500) to bring it in line visually with other radiators

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Uh, the heat rejection for the XR-6000 says 4500, I'm guessing it's supposed to be 6000?

Edited by smjjames

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Incorrect archive! Should be fixed! You saw nothing!

lol!

/5 chars

Also, I spotted that I typo'd 6000 as 600, just fixed that typo in the post.

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Do these interact with Interstellar's 'Waste Heat' resource?

No. /10chars

And thx for the update, DRE compatibility is much appreciated :)

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No.

Thank you for the quick response. Liking the update too, can make nice little mini-probes.

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Minor update, with several new parts, including the oft-requested ISS-style triple radiator, surface curved radiators (make an Apollo radiator!) and a new mini radiator fin. In addition, two heat exchanger parts which have high conductivity and nice mount points for heat pipes and radiators.

Heat Control 0.1.1

  • Added RBMK-1500 and RBMK-1000 Heat Exchangers
  • Added XR-1500x3 Deployable Heat Radiator
  • Added YC 600, YC 400 and YC-400 Surface Heat Radiators
  • Added YZ-70 Heat Radiator Fin
  • Fixed compatibility issues with DRE
  • Fixed identical costs for all insulators
  • Cost pass for all radiators, most got cost decreases.
  • Reduced mass of Tau radiator to 0.07 from 0.10
  • Increased mass and heat rejection of XR-6000 (used to be XR-4500) to bring it in line visually with other radiators

Just out of curiosity, where does RBMK name comes from? Because in Russian nuclear tech, it means "High Power Channel-type Reactor", a type of nuclear reactor developed in USSR.

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Just out of curiosity, where does RBMK name comes from? Because in Russian nuclear tech, it means "High Power Channel-type Reactor", a type of nuclear reactor developed in USSR.

Not a coincidence ;)

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Heat management is tricky, and it all depends on where the heat is coming from and what you want to protect.

If you just want to keep the engine from blowing up, likely you don't want any insulators at all. Dump the engine heat into the biggest mass you have available (ie. the whole rest of the ship), and then radiate away from that mass.

If you have multiple heat sources (like a nuclear reactor and also an engine), you may want an insulator between them so you can treat each one as an independent problem.

Keep in mind that as you use up the fuel, the mass of the fuel tank will decrease, which might also complicate matters.

(FWIW I've done heat engineering in real life, but I'm only starting to play around with it in KSP.)

Thanks. I see Nertea added heat exchangers, which ought to help me greatly. I'm mainly using this for LV-N overheating for now, but I'll bear your advice in mind if I start to explore closer to Moho. :)

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CKAN is saying this conflicts with DRE and wont allow it to be installed. It allows the "Heat Control Core" to install, but not the "Heat Control"

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CKAN is saying this conflicts with DRE and wont allow it to be installed. It allows the "Heat Control Core" to install, but not the "Heat Control"

Yes, well, there's a reason it says that.

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