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Fr3aKyHDx

[Early Dev] Engine Level System

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Hey Guys,

some Users of our ksp forum had the awesome Idea to make a rocket engine level system.

As you know it is possible to level up your Kerbals, now we thought why you can't level up your engines?!

We think it is a concept with really big potential and also a concept like in the real World. Nearly every single engine from SpaceX, over Roscosmos and Arianespace

get improved and upgraded.

For example SpaceX first Falcon rocket used 9 Merlin 1C engines but these engines got tested and tested so they got improved today there is a new Merlin engine out called 1D

with more efficiency and more thrust.

Why should this awesome feature not be integrated in Kerbal Space Program?

Now just a few examples of our early plans:

- We want to make the engine upgrades visual...

that means on Level one your engine has simply a nozzel and a few pipes nothing special just a cheap, simple Engine.

Now when you achieve level 2 the engine got a upgrade now it has more pipes and some nozzel holders and so on...

When you achieve the maximum level of the Engine (level 5, like the Kerbal level system) your engine is fully upgraded, it looks now really heavy and the Nozzel is a bit bigger, there are more pipes now and more details on the engine...

- We want to make it like in "reality". (That sounds a bit weared but read my Ideas)...

When your engine is on level 1 it has little or no Gimbal. If you level up you Engine the Gimbal increase, too.

You can fire the engine on level 1 just one single time. Than on level 2 you can fire the engine 5 times and so on up to engine level 5 unlimited times...

Or the thrust, the mass, cost, efficiency(ISP values), fuel consumption... increase with the level of the engine.

And how can I upgrade these Engines?

I would say you level these engines up the same way like kerbals, but a bit different.

- First i would say you need the classic achievements for example: come to a altitude of 10.000 meters, orbit Kerbin, travel interstellar and so on...

- Second now the Contracts to test & run a engine would be worth!

-and third your engine have run a special amount of time, until you can upgrade the engine.

I think this concept has a really huge potential (and I love that concept)

All in all it is also a huge improvment in you KSP carreer experience!

What do you say about this Idea?

Fr3aky :)

Sorry for my bad english... :blush:

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I was thinking the same thing. Engines should be upgradable. Available in lower tear science but upgradeable after hundreds of hours running and unlocked in higher tear science node.

It could be connected to Test flight mod.

I hope you release something soon.

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Why use an XP system, when there's the tech tree? (Indeed, that was how the tech tree was originally unveiled to the forums--nodes would unlock better performance for your parts. But then it was changed to just 'unlock new parts').

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For example SpaceX first Falcon rocket used 9 Merlin 1C engines but these engines got tested and tested so they got improved today there is a new Merlin engine out called 1D

with more efficiency and more thrust.

Why should this awesome feature not be integrated in Kerbal Space Program?

Sure, sounds fine so far.

- We want to make the engine upgrades visual...

that means on Level one your engine has simply a nozzel and a few pipes nothing special just a cheap, simple Engine.

Now when you achieve level 2 the engine got a upgrade now it has more pipes and some nozzel holders and so on...

When you achieve the maximum level of the Engine (level 5, like the Kerbal level system) your engine is fully upgraded, it looks now really heavy and the Nozzel is a bit bigger, there are more pipes now and more details on the engine...

Well... If you want it more like reality(further down on your list) then a rocket engine is way more complex than a few pipes and a nozzle. (And very rarely are rocket engines cheap or simple).

- We want to make it like in "reality". (That sounds a bit weared but read my Ideas)...

When your engine is on level 1 it has little or no Gimbal. If you level up you Engine the Gimbal increase, too.

You can fire the engine on level 1 just one single time. Than on level 2 you can fire the engine 5 times and so on up to engine level 5 unlimited times...

Gimbal range doesn't really make sense, a gimbal can be as simple as a swinging the thrust chamber with a hydraulic arm(or two if you need two axis motion, pitch and yaw), it's basically the same if you allow 1 degree or 10 degree motion. You could have the same engine, one with and one without gimballing, where the one without is lighter.

This can also be solved with not gimballing, but the A-3/A-4(V-2) way with carbon tungsten jet vanes in the exhaust(first firing of the A-3 was in 1937), which results in basically the same thing, a deflection of the thrust to steer the rocket.

Also, unlimited engine starts depends a bit, if you use the J-2 approach (engine used on the Saturn-V), you basically have unlimited firing with the Augmented Spark Ignited, which is basically a couple of spark plugs mounted in the combustion chamber. It makes no sense to limit the system to 1 or 2 firings. It also makes no sense to put this on an engine that will fire once only from ground, as anything you put on the rocket will mean less payload capability. (Granted, that's a much bigger deal in real life, where you need close to 10k m/s DeltaV for orbit).

And then we have hypergolic fuels, which means that restarting systems are not needed, you just mix the two fuels together and magic happens.

A thing to also take into account though is that most rocket engines are not rated for multiple starts, the few that were restarted are more of a rarity than anything.

Or the thrust, the mass, cost, efficiency(ISP values), fuel consumption... increase with the level of the engine.

Sure, we already have something similar in RealFuels, where it is, as far as I can tell, already somewhat realistic(and overpowered for standard KSP, it's better in a real earth size system).

- First i would say you need the classic achievements for example: come to a altitude of 10.000 meters, orbit Kerbin, travel interstellar and so on...

- Second now the Contracts to test & run a engine would be worth!

-and third your engine have run a special amount of time, until you can upgrade the engine.

First: Doesn't make sense, how come the engineering team comes up with great ideas suddenly after you pass 10km altitude?

Second: Granted, does make sense.

Third: Sooo, put the engine on the lauchpad, stap it down, connect LOADS of fuel to it and let it run for an hour or two while you afk in your bath? (Or if you want to do it realistic, static test firing of rockets are a real thing, just not for hours and hours). Needs more thought on how you want it to work in game, if "beating" the system this way is allowed.

Please don't take this as "I hate your idea and want it to die!", it is not my intention at all. I have to admit I tend to go for realism over gameplay, which isn't always the right way.

-

Kolbjorn

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