Kerbin Circumnavigation 1.0.4/1.0.5 - Aviator Challenge Continuation

[Xannari Ferrows]

Yeah, if there were any oxider in the mix you would have burnt way more fuel. Weights before and after suggest total usage just over 470 for an average rate of a little less than .2 and usage between minutes 8 and 30 looks to have been at a rate of about 0.17. Doesn't look like any funny business. Like I said, my only real complaint is that I'll be away for a couple days and unable to try again until I'm back.

And when you do, you will face off against the Sky Arrow Mk4; sleeker, good looking, and a need for speed! Batteries not included.

[Triop]

Turned my plane around like suggested by ExalterDuck and then swaped the turbojet for a rapier.

Then this happened...

I love this game

Edited June 26, 2015 by Triop

[Triop]

Fixed it and then this happened:

Almost home . . .9.18 fuel left...

Ran out of fuel...But I won't keep giving up on this plane, and I will keep flying without mods.

I'll be back...

Edited June 26, 2015 by Triop

[WolfGeek101]

Done it!

35 minutes of flying at sped up 16x to be less agonizing:

[MacGamer04]

Fixed it and then this happened:

Almost home . . .9.18 fuel left...

http://i.imgur.com/c1HwssY.png

http://i.imgur.com/ELXJzVM.png

Ran out of fuel...But I won't keep giving up on this plane, and I will keep flying without mods.

I'll be back...

You should try putting more intakes on the bottom and then you could land it like a seaplane...that could possibly work

[Xannari Ferrows]

Done it!

35 minutes of flying at sped up 16x to be less agonizing:

Definitely a whole new breed of plane that engineers are dying to get the schematics on.

Well done! This guy looks like he has potential for a grand circumnavigation. You should try that sometime!

As per routine, here you are:

http://www.datainterlock.com/Kerbal/circumnavigator%20resized.png

[Triop]

Is anybody here really actualy flying his plane themselves ( and in realtime? ) ? ? ?

Mods mods mods...

I think I don't wanna play no more...

Edited June 27, 2015 by Triop

[t3hJimmer]

Is anybody here really actualy flying his plane themselves ( and in realtime? ) ? ? ?

Mods mods mods...

I think I don't wanna play no more...

For most challenges I fly the whole thing manually. This challenge isnt so much about pilot skill though, so I use mechjeb for the boring parts. I perform the take off and landing manually, but I let mechjeb handle the cruise. If i had to sit and watch 45 minutes of pointing at the horizon I wouldn't even participate.

Edited June 27, 2015 by t3hJimmer

[Triop]

For most challenges I fly the whole thing manually. This challenge isnt so much about pilot skill though, so I use mechjeb for the poring parts. I perform the take off and landing manually, but I let mechjeb handle the cruise. If i had to sit and watch 45 minutes of pointing at the horizon I wouldn't even participate.

I understand what you are saying but for a "challenge" it would be nice to do it 100% yourself.

I am giving myself a challenge to compete here designing crafts, fly them myself and often fail.

Don't mind the failing much cause this game is fun and I learn...

But I don't care much in failing competing against people who take a walk while competing.

I'm sorry.

You did do the single jet engine challenge without (some) mods flying yourself, so you may still go to heaven

Edited June 27, 2015 by Triop

[t3hJimmer]

I believe I'm the first to complete the triple circumnavigation in 1.0.4

I made a custom Mk3 based plane powered by 6 turbojets. I took off with 17465 units of fuel, and only had 68 left after landing!

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Aircraft Specs:

name: C-77 Continuity

parts: 58

mass: 121.7 t

length: 26.5 m

wingspan: 25.4 m

craft file: http://pastebin.com/5jiMSnWN

[WolfGeek101]

Is anybody here really actualy flying his plane themselves ( and in realtime? ) ? ? ?

Mods mods mods...

I think I don't wanna play no more...

All of the SAS, none of the SAS modification, baby.

[ExaltedDuck]

I believe I'm the first to complete the triple circumnavigation in 1.0.4

Aw man. I have my basic design together but had some gremlin to work out. Won't get a chance to run it till Sunday. I guess I'll have to try for 4 or 5 laps.

Edited June 27, 2015 by ExaltedDuck
Android keyboard is kind of terrible sometimes

[MunGazer]

It's been fun reading this thread so far, and I've done some testing of the new aero with the craft that I used in the last competition. I made some slight modifications to it to give it a little less drag. This was basically just getting rid of a wing plate and an unnecessary structural fuselage segment among other minor things. I was able to accomplish a manually flown circumnav a few seconds under 45 minutes stopping the watch at a full halt after landing back at the KSC runway; however, don't take my word for it as any kind of entry - this is all just in the interest of conversation.

One variant I made of it can hold a consistent 1,700 m/s (give or take a few m/s depending on fuel levels which can affect angle of attack and thus drag) and at about 20 - 22 km altitude. It's nothing very special or innovative relative to the current field in this challenge - just a matter of good thrust to drag ratio and reasonably well composed layout for functionality and ease of handling. I did some math for a rough calculation of what kind of circumnav time 1,700 m/s would give me if that speed was maintained non-stop to give a sort of idea of the time barrier I'd have: (3,770,000 meters)/(1,700 m/s) = 2,217 seconds of flight = 37 minutes. Once I figure in time spent accelerating, ascending, slowing down for a landing, etc., I'd be hard pressed to exceed the 40 minute record that currently stands despite having an almost identical cruising speed. To optimize your ascent and time your descent in such a way as to come so close to that 37 minute limit deserves, at the very least, a tip of the hat.

I'm fairly certain after a decent amount of experimentation that 1,700 m/s at around 20 - 22 km is the sweet spot for high speed rapier aircraft - and this is at least partially confirmed by Xannari's craft. Go any higher, and you begin to slow a bit due to less intake air and therefore less thrust. Go any lower, below 19 km or so, and you start to risk exploding due to too much heat - that is, if you're keeping it pegged out and you exceed the aforementioned speed via more intake air and thrust.

Now, if we get some people doing some really creative and clever clipping techniques, we may begin to see something in a substantial excess of that air speed.. and that of course is a feat in and of itself that accomplishes, if nothing else, "the best number". However, I will be truly amazed if I see a design that exceeds a cruising speed for the bulk of the circumnav of, say, 1,750 m/s and doesn't owe the significant cruising speed improvement mostly to a part hiding trick that reduces drag, overlaps engines, fuel, etc.

So, I was thinking... what if... in addition to the best of the best one upping each other by a matter of petty minutes or seconds (for the "fastest time" seekers) in the challenge, what if we added a sub-category of the competition that introduces a new dimension in which creativity, piloting skill, and engineering have even more free roam? I'll give an idea for it, although we can brainstorm others. How's this one:

1. All the rules are the same, except the following.

2. You may use any engine you'd like.

3. You may exceed 30 kilometers.

4. You may use engineering and autopilot tools.

My thinking there is it would be a lot of fun to play around with a lot of the other parts, add in some interesting re-entry situations, sub orbital trajectory strategies, and maybe even make a good chunk of the circumnav more digestible and less grueling for a lot of the would-be participants. As far as the badge goes for it, perhaps a simple image edit would suffice for the "Sub Orbital Division" as it might be called. That is, if it was popular enough to warrant a distinguished badge.

I wouldn't want to in any way impede the fun that's being had for fast times within the existing rules - and of course don't want to take away from the "spirit" of the competition. All I'm wanting to see is what I think could be an exciting new dimension to this competition that I think would be a natural evolution of it To add to, but not take away from.

Edited June 27, 2015 by MunGazer
grammar :P

[Xannari Ferrows]

As far as the badge goes for it, perhaps a simple image edit would suffice for the "Sub Orbital Division" as it might be called. That is, if it was popular enough to warrant a distinguished badge.

I don't know, I have a very limited library of editing software. The original makers made it 100x harder by adding shadows, not to mention the central lighting effects. It'd take days to make one.

[GDJ]

HMM.... will have to do this again.....

[Xannari Ferrows]

I believe I'm the first to complete the triple circumnavigation in 1.0.4

I made a custom Mk3 based plane powered by 6 turbojets. I took off with 17465 units of fuel, and only had 68 left after landing!

http://imgur.com/a/moDk9

Wow, now there's an interesting design.

Good ol' Mk3 parts this time? Well, you certainly made it work! Let's run through to book...

Wow, that's good endurance! I wonder if... No, that's super secret plans!

No! I've done goofed now... I'll have to speed your name down on the way out the door!

[MunGazer]

I don't know, I have a very limited library of editing software. The original makers made it 100x harder by adding shadows, not to mention the central lighting effects. It'd take days to make one.

Alright, I hear you there. I went ahead and did a quick badge edit in microsoft paint. Of course, I'm not trying to be pushy with this, only offering help where the badge is concerned. It isn't anything flashy, but it has symmetry and looks clean. Transparency is lost due to saving with ms paint but I think people will live lol. Whether or not you implemented a sub orbital division for velocity is up to you. Let me know if you have any other badge ideas and I'll help where I can - I used to be pretty good with Gimp but it hasn't worked on my pc for some reason as of late and I'm forced to use ms paint.

[Xannari Ferrows]

Alright, I hear you there. I went ahead and did a quick badge edit in microsoft paint. Of course, I'm not trying to be pushy with this, only offering help where the badge is concerned. It isn't anything flashy, but it has symmetry and looks clean. Transparency is lost due to saving with ms paint but I think people will live lol. Whether or not you implemented a sub orbital division for velocity is up to you. Let me know if you have any other badge ideas and I'll help where I can - I used to be pretty good with Gimp but it hasn't worked on my pc for some reason as of late and I'm forced to use ms paint.

http://i.imgur.com/ozb3P5y.png

Well, it's infinitely better than anything I could do. Maybe Paint.net would work better?

[MunGazer]

Well, it's infinitely better than anything I could do. Maybe Paint.net would work better?

I've downloaded paint.net and I will put something together soon

[MunGazer]

Ok, well that was fairly fun and easy. Paint.net is intuitive to work with so far. In this badge edit, I was able to preserve the transparency, add a neat looking negation effect to the text, and also a symbolic sub orbital trajectory trace curve.

[Xannari Ferrows]

******* awesome! You sure you didn't hire a professional? I'll definitely have to put this on the records...

In the meantime, I believe it's time for endurance; my least favorite part of the day. Great...

[WolfGeek101]

With the new SOD award, I feel it might end up being complimentary for most of the standard circumnavigations. It seems simpler to me.

[MunGazer]

******* awesome! You sure you didn't hire a professional? I'll definitely have to put this on the records...

In the meantime, I believe it's time for endurance; my least favorite part of the day. Great...

Lol thanks man, no hired pros, I just have a bit of experience from having artistic tendencies in the past and tooling around with basic image editing functions.

With the new SOD award, I feel it might end up being complimentary for most of the standard circumnavigations. It seems simpler to me.

No problemo, I'll at least do the same badge edit for the basic circumnavigator award here in just a minute. As for the other ones for looping around multiple times, the only reason I'd hesitate with those is because that crosses into more of an orbit followed by de-orbit operation and... I just get the sense that it would be significantly different in nature to the original intended spirit of the suborbital class and whether you orbited two, three, or seven thousand times in orbit before de-orbiting, it would be in excess of the core ascent/descent/sub orbital trajectory problem solving envelope. My vision of sub orbital was in the true sense of the word; however, the basic sub orbital circumnavigation definitely warrants a badge and I'll get right on it

- - - Updated - - -

Here's the edit for the sub orbital division version of the basic circumnavigator badge:

Edit: Oh um... so I've been thinking about the 2x, 3x, etc. circumnavigations and their complimentary sub orbital versions... wellllll, I could kind of see if you wanted to make a ship and have it go round several times at, say, 40, 50, 60 kilometers altitude, etc., and that could technically still be considered sub orbital since if you ran out of fuel or thrust you'd aerobrake back down again generally but... I think.. it still might be kind of like saying how many times can I dribble the basket ball before I shoot the 3 pointer, you know? For the standard atmospheric jet engine circumnavigations, it's definitely a challenging thing because you're dealing with huge fuel efficiency considerations and what not. But, I think that S.O.D. multiple circumnavs might be a bit too tangential. Just my opinion

Edited June 27, 2015 by MunGazer

[nicky4096]

i am determined to get this to work:

http://imgur.com/gallery/NL6Cqy4/new

[Xannari Ferrows]

I've got a work of my own!

Don't sigh too hard...

Yeah, still needs some revisions...