Fanwork Friday: Valentina & Bill

[SQUAD]

<figure data-orig-width="480" data-orig-height="92" class="tmblr-full"></figure><figure data-orig-width="1024" data-orig-height="724" class="tmblr-full"></figure>Y0rshee captured the personalities of Bill and Valentina in her own distinct artstyle for the Fanwork Friday highlight.

Edited July 4, 2015 by Navy4422

[linuxgurugamer]

<figure data-orig-width="480" data-orig-height="92" class="tmblr-full"></figure><figure data-orig-width="1024" data-orig-height="724" class="tmblr-full"></figure>Y0rshee captured the personalities of Bill and Valentina in his own distinct artstyle for the Fanwork Friday highlight.

I thought she had more teeth. At least when I fly her, she does.

[yorshee]

Thank you so much, you guys!

[softweir]

Very nice artwork! I like the characterisation, which corresponds very well to that of Squad's.

[windows_x_seven]

Female kerbals don't have tongues.

But still, great work!

[Whirligig Girl]

The placement of Valentina's throat in the picture doesn't make sense considering where her neck is.

you're welcome for bringing attention to the mouth, scaring everyone with nightmares.

Good drawing though.

Edited July 4, 2015 by GregroxMun

[yorshee]

The placement of Valentina's throat in the picture doesn't make sense considering where her neck is.

you're welcome for bringing attention to the mouth, scaring everyone with nightmares.

Good drawing though.

Thanks!

A lot of stuff in my Kerbal drawings makes no sense, their strange anatomy is difficult to draw for me. I like drawing things with zany facial expressions and body language, which is very difficult to convey with the Kerbals because of their limited facial expressions (they lack eyelids and eyebrows which makes drawing an angry Kerbal insanely difficult for example), and their stumpy limbs and short torsos makes expressing their moods through body language difficult as there isn't a lot to work with, and their strange splayed legs just makes this even harder. I like to think I'm getting better at it, though.

Another thing that makes no sense is the way I draw Kerbals in spacesuits sometimes. The little twisty cap thing their helmets attaches to gets in the way of their shoulders and arms sometimes (for example, if they're hunching their shoulders up or are pointing their arms straight upwards). This just limits their body language even more so sometimes I just draw it anyways, even though it is incorrect. You can see this in Valentina's right arm, and Bill's left arm.

Female kerbals don't have tongues.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CB37lrOUsAAoQ7o.jpg:large

But still, great work!

That just looks strange though. D:

[Corax]

I thought she had more teeth. At least when I fly her, she does.

Female kerbals don't have tongues.

The placement of Valentina's throat in the picture doesn't make sense considering where her neck is.

It's called art, guys...

[Whirligig Girl]

It's called art, guys...

It's called criticism. It helps art to get better or for it to be better understood. Only when criticism is mean is it bad. Only non-artists will make excuses like that, implying that it's art so it must be perfect anyway.

In fact, whenever I show someone an art of mine, and they just say "Oh that's good" or something, I feel like they're not paying attention enough to see some of the bad things, be it stuff I noticed but didn't fix, or stuff I didn't notice and could fix. Criticism can only help art to grow, as long as its only purpose is not to be mean. I don't think any of the comments you quoted were being mean.

[softweir]

That's a very interesting viewpoint, but the way you phrase your criticism makes it appear to miss the point of cartooning. Cartoonists work to an entirely different set of ideals and aspirations to those of representative art: what they are after is recognisability, character and emotion. Accuracy is deliberately and with careful consideration chucked out the nearest high-rise window the cartoonist can find - the number of fingers is wrong, mouths appear on the side of the face closest to the viewer, tongues hang in mouths with no support etc etc ad infinitum.

If you had been able to criticise the cartoon because the characters were unrecognisable or the emotions were inappropriate - in other words the "essence" of the characters was wrong - then that would have met with agreement. (I would say that in this case there is no case to answer: the characters are recognisable and the emotions are appropriate.) If Bill had been made to look as reckless as Jeb then that would have been a criticism the artist could well have learnt from, or if Valentina had looked too girly that would have been useful. But "the number of teeth is wrong" is as inappropriate as accusing the Mona Lisa for not having enough falling anvils*, or a picture of kittens in a boot** for not having enough haywains or towering oceans - it's the wrong criticism for the wrong artform.

* Anvils in the Mona Lisa would be droll, but not art.

** Personally, I would object to any picture of kittens in boots for existing, but that's a matter of taste. Kittens do daft things, it's realistic, and some people love that sort of thing.

[Whirligig Girl]

But nevertheless comenting about these things did lead to an interesting exchange in thoughts and information. I wouldn't have known about Yorshee's particular troubles in making Kerbals without having mentioned it. But I seriously doubt anyone could seriously imagine that art would be better without criticism, which is very much what Corax is implying.

[softweir]

Artists very rarely need criticism to improve, as they are their own worst critics. Uninformed criticism over silly little details doesn't make the art better, it just makes the process even more difficult. If an artist needs outside criticism they will go to another artist and ask "how the H*** do I fix this?!" Or else they will draw, and draw, and draw, until one attempt looks much better, and then they try to reproduce the improved art, and when they can do that they fine-tune it. They really, truly, do not need us to be involved.

If you are a better artist, post some of your art to show Corax how to do it. THAT would be truly excellent criticism!

[Corax]

[...] that art would be better without criticism, [is] what Corax is implying.

That is very much not what I am implying. That may be what you infer from my criticism of y'all's posts.

What I am implying though is that you guys came across as saying "that's not how it is done, but well yeah it's still mostly alright, in a way", which is what I inferred from your posts.

<rant>

It is alright to say "why, that's a piece of {genius|crap|whatever}", but that's only voicing your opinion, which you're entitled to (even if it may be considered rude) and has nothing to do with art criticism.

If you're telling the artist "that's an {interesting|non-standard|imaginative|whatever} way you used this technique", or "this combination of {colours|styles|whatever} is {innovative|whatever}", they can explain their choices, modify their style with that in mind, or simply ignore you.

"Art" is not about depicting something in the most realistic way, it is about expressing one's self, which may very well be depicting something as realistically as humanly possible, but it may just as well be the exact opposite, or not paying attention to realism in the first place.

Some artists may depict Kerbals with tongues, and some without, and maybe even both in the same picture, or even paint Kerbals red, and you are absolutely entitled to say "but that's not how I see it". But please don't tell the artist "how it is done".

</rant>

Thanks for reading

- - - Updated - - -

Artists very rarely need criticism to improve, as they are their own worst critics. Uninformed criticism over silly little details doesn't make the art better, it just makes the process even more difficult. If an artist needs outside criticism they will go to another artist and ask "how the H*** do I fix this?!" Or else they will draw, and draw, and draw, until one attempt looks much better, and then they try to reproduce the improved art, and when they can do that they fine-tune it. They really, truly, do not need us to be involved.

If you are a better artist, post some of your art to show Corax how to do it. THAT would be truly excellent criticism!

Yes, that would make me a very happy art critic

Still, I don't think terms like "better artist" have a place in a discussion about art - a better artisan, maybe; more familiar with their tools, or more literate in art history, or having had a formal education.

Art is not a competition (unless it is for a competition, but even those are not about who's the better artist, but who's better in meeting the jury's expectations )

Edited July 4, 2015 by Corax
stupid vBulletin ate my tags, again

[oriramikad]

Valentina and Bill. I ship it. #myotp

[linuxgurugamer]

It's called art, guys...

Sorry, I meant my comment to be funny. Guess it didn't come across that way.

[Esme]

Fab work there, Yorshee!

[Astrofox]

Amazing work Yorshee!

[Candlelight]

Why do they remind me of Dipper and Mabel from Gravity Falls?