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Boeing's Starliner


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7 minutes ago, RCgothic said:

This is just an ISS crew rotation taxi.

That's not good.  Maybe Blue Origin could work on a pod design because I don't see how SL is ever going to go to the moon at this rate. 

Edited by reducing
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15 minutes ago, reducing said:

That's not good.  Maybe Blue Origin could work on a pod design because I don't see how SL is ever going to go to the moon at this rate. 

Starliner isn't going to the moon, it is the ISS crew capsule competitor to Crew Dragon

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https://starlinerupdates.com/boeing-advances-starliner-solutions-in-the-vertical-integration-facility/

Quote

Boeing Advances Starliner Solutions in the Vertical Integration Facility

August 9, 2021

This weekend, Boeing restored functionality on more of the 13 CST-100 Starliner propulsion system valves that did not open as designed during prelaunch system checks last week.

Boeing has completed physical inspections and chemical sampling on the exterior of a number of the affected valves, which indicated no signs of damage or external corrosion. Test teams are now applying mechanical, electrical and thermal techniques to prompt the valves open. Seven of the 13 valves are now operating as designed, with inspection and remediation of the remaining affected valves to be performed in the days ahead.

Boeing is working a systematic plan to open the affected valves, demonstrate repeatable system performance, and verify the root cause of the issue before returning Starliner to the launch pad for its Orbital Flight Test-2 mission.

The company is assessing multiple launch opportunities for Starliner in August and will work with NASA and United Launch Alliance to confirm those dates when the spacecraft is ready.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Scotius said:

TL;DR

"There's nothing wrong with the valves. They just refuse to work, and we don't know why."

Quoting Boeing,
"Thanks to Aerojet Rocketdyne for supplying and supporting the propulsion system being evaluated."

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21 minutes ago, kerbiloid said:

Exploding Raptors are nothing, compared to Boeing valves.

Seriously? You are comparing whole rocket engine at full thrust to a freaking valve? A sub component that has only two modes: open or closed.

Only Boeing valves apparently have three modes: open, closed and maybe, but mostly not.

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9 minutes ago, Scotius said:

Seriously? You are comparing whole rocket engine at full thrust to a freaking valve? A sub component that has only two modes: open or closed.

Only Boeing valves apparently have three modes: open, closed and maybe, but mostly not.

The whole engine explodes due to a single detail, doesn't it?

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Yes.

But there is difference between "Destroyed in operation" and "Refuses to even start, for reasons unknown".

One is a car that breaks on the road under the mechanical stress. Which is unfortunate but normal, even expected thing.

Other is a brand new car that can't leave the dealership, because its engine won't start. And the cause is a factory fresh component worth 20$ inside the engine, that refuses to work. Which is embarrassing and a proof of shoddy craftsmanship.

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There is a root cause investigation underway.

If you want to be aggressive about it, of course you can characterize this as "we don't know why the valves aren't working". But you know, that's what a root cause investigation is all about -- finding out why the problem happened.

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On 8/7/2021 at 10:36 AM, reducing said:

That's not good.  Maybe Blue Origin could work on a pod design because I don't see how SL is ever going to go to the moon at this rate. 

Just to further clarify this point: not only is Starliner never going to the moon, it was never supposed to go the Moon. It was designed and built to only operate up to Low Earth Orbit, and it has maintained that purpose throughout its development.
It's possible that modifications could be made to the spacecraft to give it lunar flight capabilities, but Boeing has not expressed any interest in doing so.

Edited by RyanRising
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On 8/7/2021 at 5:29 AM, Beccab said:

CRS-23 launches on the 28, so I doubt NASA would want to squeeze Starliner so close to it (19 and  20 launch dates) in case there's issues to solve. 15 and 16, if Starliner is ready by then, would be the most likely launch dates imo

Yeah, this is looking pretty unlikely for a launch in 4-5 days.

The next opportunity might be the end of the year or early 2022—though that gives them time to sort out the problem. The only issue might be how do they store Atlases? (I have no clue)

 

 

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3 hours ago, tater said:

Yeah, this is looking pretty unlikely for a launch in 4-5 days.

The next opportunity might be the end of the year or early 2022—though that gives them time to sort out the problem. The only issue might be how do they store Atlases? (I have no clue)

 

 

Either that, or maybe NASA might have to decide how high to prioritize getting a second crew transfer vehicle checked out. If it's a high-enough priority, I imagine they could shift some other schedule to make room.

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37 minutes ago, mikegarrison said:

Either that, or maybe NASA might have to decide how high to prioritize getting a second crew transfer vehicle checked out. If it's a high-enough priority, I imagine they could shift some other schedule to make room.

CRS-23 is resupply, and the other port has Crew Dragon for an active mission. They could perhaps unload Cargo Dragon, the trouble is any experiments that are using the downmass.

I know the scheduling is pretty nailed down in advance.

The other issue would be if they need extra time to sort the problem out.

The 19th I'm hearing is something they are currently actually aiming for (fingers crossed).

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4 minutes ago, tater said:

CRS-23 is resupply, and the other port has Crew Dragon for an active mission. They could perhaps unload Cargo Dragon, the trouble is any experiments that are using the downmass.

I know the scheduling is pretty nailed down in advance.

The other issue would be if they need extra time to sort the problem out.

The 19th I'm hearing is something they are currently actually aiming for (fingers crossed).

I'm not saying it would be easy, but like I said, "priorities". If a second crew capsule option is actually a priority, then they will find some way to do it. For example, maybe they try sending cargo in the CST-100? Obviously it would have to be something expendable in case things go wrong.

They should not launch until they have completed the root cause analysis and then fixed the root cause. So maybe it's all moot anyway. But I'm sure they could create options, if they really want to.

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54 minutes ago, mikegarrison said:

I'm not saying it would be easy, but like I said, "priorities". If a second crew capsule option is actually a priority, then they will find some way to do it. For example, maybe they try sending cargo in the CST-100? Obviously it would have to be something expendable in case things go wrong.

They should not launch until they have completed the root cause analysis and then fixed the root cause. So maybe it's all moot anyway. But I'm sure they could create options, if they really want to.

True, they could probably do some of that (a little cargo, push CRS out a couple months).

You also have to wonder about ULA. I'm unsure what they do with Atlas. Unstack it, or can they hold it? They have 3 other Atlas launches through to mid October.

As my friend at MCC told me they need more ports, lol.

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