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Kerbonautical

The things that never happened

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Ok so it's been a very long time since I played KSP, around a year perhaps, so when I came to the forums to see what has changed since the 1.0 release I was surprised to see that it has mostly been minor additions. Other than the announcement of PS4/Xbone version coming which will require some understanding of GPGPU offloading to even hope of running off their measly processors as it is now, I'm not seeing much going on around the development anymore so I decided it's time to ask what is/isn't going to happen anymore.

For instance there have been a number of features planned or considered that have come and gone over the years, it's been a very long time since we even heard anything about some of these ideas and they are on a list of *not to be mentioned* items. Now that's all well and good except the game has been in full release for a while and we've never really been given much of an update on what may or may not be planned and the restriction makes discussion difficult. So instead of directly discussing one of those ideas I want to ask in general, what happened to all of the ideas that never came to be, for instance enhanced IVA was something that never truly got announced as planned but hoped for, but it's likely a huge challenge given the game system we have. (kerbal size v rocket size) I'm guessing it would be safe to assume that this will not be making it into KSP and would only be remotely possible if a sequel were to happen.

But others have gone unmentioned for a very long time despite being possible within the games scope as is, for instance the second gas giant planned to for Eeloo to orbit. Is this ever coming or has this been abandoned? I feel like Eeloo has been sitting alone for rather too long now.

These and many of other features have been mentioned in the past but all have faded into obscurity over time. Perhaps I'm also rather out of the loop, but me and my friend would often take breaks and have no trouble finding the info on what is coming, when it's coming and how it may effect the game.

Perhaps someone here can enlighten me and maybe I've missed tonnes of info on what's planned. (no I don't mean the dev updates, I always read them)

As a long time fan of the game I'm having difficulty coming back without being bored fast due to the lack of any particularly major content updates. DLC was talked about in the past so perhaps any possible ideas have been mentioned?

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Devs refuse to state what their plan is, so there's no way to figure out what they're thinking for the future.

The rationale for this is that if they say "We want to have feature <X> in the game", and later find out they cannot implement it, people will get their panties in such a wad that there will be some sort of massive player rebellion.

Edited by razark

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I'm pretty sure we already had a player rebellion of sorts around the whole 1.0 fiasco and the end result appears to have been a period of uproar on the forums followed by players either grudgingly accepting the game for what it is and using mods to fix things they don't like or just simply vanishing off the forums while they play other games.

Anyways, as razark said, Squad has been very hesitant to say anything about their plans for the game beyond the next update (multiplayer and console ports being an exception) so we really don't know where they want to take the game or what happened to a lot of those features.

There have been some efforts with mods to implement some of the features you mentioned, especially the planets. At this point I agree that the base game desperately needs more content, what works for me to make the game playable are all the amazing mods out there that address most of the issues in the stock game and can add a ton of new content.

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Lets see, a year ago would have been 0.24.

Plane parts sucked (barely existed really)

You couldn't transfer crew

The Navball still didn't have anything more than prograde and retrograde.

Buildings only had one upgrade level

Grand total of 5 contract types.

Biomes only existed on Kerbin, Mun, and Minmus.

No Gizmos

No Female Kerbals

No Destructible Buildings (not that I care)

Explosions sucked (well sucked more than they do now anyway)

No Kerbal Professions

No Resource gathers (again, if you care)

Aerodynamics sucked

No heat model at all/heat shields, etc.

No fairings

Only half the command pods/cockpits had IVA

No editor filters

No administration facility (sounding like a broken record here, but I guess some people use these things)

No difficulty selector.

If that is your definition of minor additions, I would sure love to know what you consider major? KSP 2.0?

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Lets see, a year ago would have been 0.24.

...

If that is your definition of minor additions, I would sure love to know what you consider major? KSP 2.0?

I think that's a bit strong. The KSP wiki has had a list of planned features on it that's grown and contracted a lot since I first started (0.10 I think...), and though a lot of things have been 'partly implemented', many have been sidelined or dropped, or all-but. I think GasPlanet2/3 are obvious examples, since I guess I expected this to be fairly simple to add, at least in as an 'under development' feature like any other planet.

I mean, I'm very appreciative of the devs attention to detail, but speaking for myself I'd rather have a few big-dumb improvements (such as the above) over a bunch of small tweaks (e.g. Mk3 overhaul, aero overhaul, etc). However much the game has been improved as a simulator, I don't really love it any more now than I did when it was flawed and cartoon-ish.

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Lets see, a year ago would have been 0.24.

Plane parts sucked (barely existed really)

You couldn't transfer crew

The Navball still didn't have anything more than prograde and retrograde.

Buildings only had one upgrade level

Grand total of 5 contract types.

Biomes only existed on Kerbin, Mun, and Minmus.

No Gizmos

No Female Kerbals

No Destructible Buildings (not that I care)

Explosions sucked (well sucked more than they do now anyway)

No Kerbal Professions

No Resource gathers (again, if you care)

Aerodynamics sucked

No heat model at all/heat shields, etc.

No fairings

Only half the command pods/cockpits had IVA

No editor filters

No administration facility (sounding like a broken record here, but I guess some people use these things)

No difficulty selector.

If that is your definition of minor additions, I would sure love to know what you consider major? KSP 2.0?

Lets see again, a year ago:

There is a MOD,all of this stuffs you mentioned.

A lot better than the stock.

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Lets see again, a year ago:

There is a MOD,all of this stuffs you mentioned.

A lot better than the stock.

Lol, so the game should just stop then. I mean there is a mod that adds damn near everything.

Squad, I guess you are done, your job is over. No need to release 1.1 or anything else, they apparently don't want it because mods.

- - - Updated - - -

I think that's a bit strong. The KSP wiki has had a list of planned features on it that's grown and contracted a lot since I first started (0.10 I think...), and though a lot of things have been 'partly implemented', many have been sidelined or dropped, or all-but. I think GasPlanet2/3 are obvious examples, since I guess I expected this to be fairly simple to add, at least in as an 'under development' feature like any other planet.

I mean, I'm very appreciative of the devs attention to detail, but speaking for myself I'd rather have a few big-dumb improvements (such as the above) over a bunch of small tweaks (e.g. Mk3 overhaul, aero overhaul, etc). However much the game has been improved as a simulator, I don't really love it any more now than I did when it was flawed and cartoon-ish.

That is where we differ, the little things grow to make big annoyances. Some of those things had been needed for a long time. I can't see myself playing without Gizmos anymore. The finishing of career mode is important to me. And even those things I listed that I don't enjoy, others do. You can't keep ignoring the polish, and Squad still has work to do on that front. These changes are bigger than you think. The aero overhaul for example is no small tweak. It may not be as flashy and visible, but it certainly wasn't small.

Edited by Alshain

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These changes are bigger than you think. The aero overhaul for example is no small tweak. It may not be as flashy and visible, but it certainly wasn't small.

I didn't mean to suggest that it didn't involve a huge amount of work and time investment. I would not have prioritised it over more obvious and less-implemented features. I've never found any part of the physics engine to be unacceptably poor for what is, after all, a game. There's definitely more to do in KSP now than there used to be, and the game's learning curve has if anything got steeper. Still, when I reflect on it, I find the lack of news or encouragement on features that were planned when I began, that I would certainly expected to have had at least a whiff of by now, rather disappointing.

Don't get me wrong, a lot of work has certainly been done and I'm sure it's still being done. For me, though, it would be nice to know that some ideas haven't been forgotten even if they're not in the short-term pipeline. The lack of a clear statement either way just leaves some of us in limbo, taking a break from the game until new stuff (edit: by which I mean features we've heard of and looked forward to) turns up and then coming back to find out that not only it hasn't, but there's been absolutely no news about it at all in a year!

Edited by The_Rocketeer

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I didn't mean to suggest that it didn't involve a huge amount of work and time investment. I would not have prioritised it over more obvious and less-implemented features. I've never found any part of the physics engine to be unacceptably poor for what is, after all, a game. There's definitely more to do in KSP now than there used to be, and the game's learning curve has if anything got steeper. Still, when I reflect on it, I find the lack of news or encouragement on features that were planned when I began, that I would certainly expected to have had at least a whiff of by now, rather disappointing.

Don't get me wrong, a lot of work has certainly been done and I'm sure it's still being done. For me, though, it would be nice to know that some ideas haven't been forgotten even if they're not in the short-term pipeline. The lack of a clear statement either way just leaves some of us in limbo, taking a break from the game until new stuff (edit: by which I mean features we've heard of and looked forward to) turns up and then coming back to find out that not only it hasn't, but there's been absolutely no news about it at all in a year!

Well, the only one you (or anyone) has mentioned specifically thus far is Gas Planet 2. That is one feature dropped, these things happen. Are there any more? From what I recall, Gas Planet 2 was dropped or delayed because the statistics didn't support adding it. If you recall that little box asking to send statistics data when you first start a new install, that reports back how many people actually get to Jool and Eeloo and apparently that number is relatively few (keep in mind this is from the best of my memory, which isn't great, it would take some digging to find that explanation again now). You can't blame them for not wanting to develop areas for a small minority of people.

Other than GP2, what other features are we waiting for specifically? I know Multiplayer, but they have continually assured us it is being worked on and is just taking time. Other than that?

EDIT: By the way, the Wiki is highly inaccurate. A lot of those "planned" features have never really be planned at all.

Edited by Alshain

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Other than GP2, what other features are we waiting for specifically? I know Multiplayer, but they have continually assured us it is being worked on and is just taking time. Other than that?

Here's the list on the wiki:Planned Features

Most of the things on there have been there for a very long time and we've heard practically nothing about them. I'm not saying that we haven't heard about the things that Squad are working on, but we haven't heard anything at all in ages about a lot of things we assume they have on the backburner. GP2/3 are just good examples, not the whole question. The game has clearly been developed a lot, but a lot of those developments have never been on that list. While I grant you that this is a community list on a community website, in the absence of an official list it's the best we have to go on.

While I agree that there may be good reasons or good explanations about why some or all of these things have been dropped or abandoned, or even why there isn't any news, this thread is really asking for that information to be disseminated to someone who explicitly hasn't been around to hear them first hand. I don't see any reason to jump down the guy's throat and get on the defensive on Squad's behalf.

Edit: I also don't see myself as the sole advocate of this question, nor the wiki planned features list as the only repository of anticipated features that have or haven't turned up. I'm sure others will be able to add specific looked-for features to this thread, but I doubt you'll be able to field them all.

Edited by The_Rocketeer

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Here's the list on the wiki: Planned Features.

Did you miss the part at the top that said This list is not an official road-map for KSP?

Honestly, unless the devs have stated they are working on it right now, it's safe to assume the things on the list were a) at one point planned, but now not and they forgot to tell us B) still on the backburner c) someone got a little wild in what they were talking about. (I'm looking at you, Max ;))

The devs do what the devs want. It's their game.

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Here's the list on the wiki:Planned Features

Most of the things on there have been there for a very long time and we've heard practically nothing about them.

Because they are mostly wrong as I said in my last post. Take the first one for example. Follow the citation and all you see is talk about more IVA's in parts missing them. That isnt partially implemented, its finished as of 1.0. That list is inaccurate and unverified.

I would propose that page is so useless it should be removed from the wiki. It isn't bennificial to the communuity at all. Speculation is for social media, not the wiki.

Edit: In fact, nominated for deletion.

Edited by Alshain

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Did you miss the part at the top that said This list is not an official road-map for KSP?

No. Did you read my whole post?

Honestly, unless the devs have stated they are working on it right now, it's safe to assume the things on the list were a) at one point planned, but now not and they forgot to tell us B) still on the backburner c) someone got a little wild in what they were talking about. (I'm looking at you, Max ;))

The devs do what the devs want. It's their game.

Because they are mostly wrong as I said in my last post. Take the first one for example. Follow the citation and all you see is talk about more IVA's in parts missing them. That isnt partially implemented, its finished as of 1.0. That list is inaccurate and unverified.

I would propose that page is so useless it should be removed from the wiki. It isn't bennificial to the communuity at all. Speculation is for social media, not the wiki.

Edit: In fact, nominated for deletion.

I wholeheartedly disagree that a community list of 'planned features' for a game undergoing rapid and extensive development isn't beneficial, even if it is incomplete or inaccurate due to lack of official announcement.

Nonetheless this is all entirely beside the point. The question posed in the OP is regarding what happened to the features that were widely circulated and discussed throughout the community a year ago that have not been implemented. I think it would help to keep that in mind. What you think of the developments that have been implemented is also irrelevant, or of the wiki's list, or anything else.

If you haven't got anything pertinent to say in response to the questions posed in the OP, how about you just find somewhere else to post today.

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As others have said, anything the community discusses is just that, discussion. Unless a dev says they are working on it or will work on it then it doesn't have anything to do with what is going into the game. There were some dev posts recently about them working on 1.1 and some features etc were confirmed in those topics.

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If you haven't got anything pertinent to say in response to the questions posed in the OP, how about you just find somewhere else to post today.

The OP didn't specify a specific 'feature' and in lieu of an actual example I must conclude he is working from bad information he got from somwhere making this conversation very pertinant. If you don't like it you may follow your own advice.

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I wholeheartedly disagree that a community list of 'planned features' for a game undergoing rapid and extensive development isn't beneficial, even if it is incomplete or inaccurate due to lack of official announcement.

Nonetheless this is all entirely beside the point. The question posed in the OP is regarding what happened to the features that were widely circulated and discussed throughout the community a year ago that have not been implemented. I think it would help to keep that in mind. What you think of the developments that have been implemented is also irrelevant, or of the wiki's list, or anything else.

If you haven't got anything pertinent to say in response to the questions posed in the OP, how about you just find somewhere else to post today.

A map of planned features is only pertinent if that map originated from the devs themselves. The wiki page is about as useful as a toothbrush for a new born.

The only real planned feature that isn't in some way in the game is gas giant 2. And this is because it would only benefit a small portion of the community in comparison to other things that have been added. I have kept an eye on this game since about 0.24 and have been playing since 0.90, and in that time devs only confirmed features that were close to being released. They have talked about others but rarely confirmed them. As far as I can tell we have gotten the majority of promised features. Remember that discussion is discussion and unless the devs give a date or patch number it is not truly a planned feature. I'm sorry you feel slighted by the devs, but at the end of the day they have done right by the community at this point, and so accusations of poor development (which is the between the lines read of your OP) is basically pissing in the wind. If you dont find enjoyment playing the game, then it should probably be a priority of yours to find another game that entices you - or actively advocating for the features you think the game is in dire need of.

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regardless of whats in or isnt in ksp , you can get most things that you would like via mods. and if your gonna use alot of mods, then just dualboot linux, and you can run all the mods. works great.

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No need to get mad at each other over this, people.

As the game develops, some things get put on a back burner, or even cancelled. Other things get added. Also, things that already existed get re-worked, such as aerodynamics. That takes a lot of work. The rate of new features implemented is not an objective measure of progress.

And no need to blame anyone over it, either.

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I'd be interested to know the stats for the number of people that make it to the different planets and moons. Not a forum poll, which has a minuscule sample size, but the actual bulk game data Squad receives.

I'm sure it's only a very low percentage of players who make it to places like Jool and Eeloo, but I'd wager a much greater percentage still enjoy the experience of these planets via Youtube videos and shared screenshots. Back before I'd ever played KSP, seeing a video showcasing the view of Jool as a spacecraft landed on Laythe is what inspired me to invest hours and hours into the game to try to get there myself.

I bet the marketing value of an update video which featured the view of a ringed gas giant from a nearby moon would be massive, even if only a small fraction of players actually make it there in-game. :)

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Did you miss the part at the top that said This list is not an official road-map for KSP?

Honestly, unless the devs have stated they are working on it right now, it's safe to assume the things on the list were a) at one point planned, but now not and they forgot to tell us B) still on the backburner c) someone got a little wild in what they were talking about. (I'm looking at you, Max ;))

The devs do what the devs want. It's their game.

Don't forget that Nova left the team, so some of his brainchildren were abandoned (GP2, for example).

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Concerning the amount of players that go to Jool or Eeloo or anywhere outside the Kerbin SOI for that matter, the stats that exist for the current version should be ignored for several reasons. As far a Jool is concerned, you can't use Jool to aerobrake anymore because the atmospheric heating models aren't finished and basically don't work. Your ship just gets instantly incinerated. Spending crap loads of time setting up gravity assists may be fun for some, but not always for me. Also, many players wait for interplanetary stuff until they unlock all the necessary parts in career mode, by which time many of those players get burned out or bored and move on to another game before even going to Duna, much less Eeloo or Jool. Lastly, there are some players, like me, that don't let the game "call home" anymore for various reasons.

I think that if "moar planets" were released with the stock game, you would find that the "stats" would show a HUGE number of players going there, just because "something new".

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Well there was the dV readouts, not huge but looked for

I believe that one is still coming, just like multiplayer. But no confirmation on that, just speculation. The Gas Planet is the only one Squad has truly backed down on as originally it seemed definite and later the phrase "big maybe" was used.

- - - Updated - - -

Concerning the amount of players that go to Jool or Eeloo or anywhere outside the Kerbin SOI for that matter, the stats that exist for the current version should be ignored for several reasons. As far a Jool is concerned, you can't use Jool to aerobrake anymore because the atmospheric heating models aren't finished and basically don't work. Your ship just gets instantly incinerated. Spending crap loads of time setting up gravity assists may be fun for some, but not always for me. Also, many players wait for interplanetary stuff until they unlock all the necessary parts in career mode, by which time many of those players get burned out or bored and move on to another game before even going to Duna, much less Eeloo or Jool. Lastly, there are some players, like me, that don't let the game "call home" anymore for various reasons.

I think that if "moar planets" were released with the stock game, you would find that the "stats" would show a HUGE number of players going there, just because "something new".

Except any new gas planet would behave similarly to Jool, so adding a new planet right wouldn't make sense anyway. Nevertheless it is a somewhat valid point if they correct it. I imagine their stats are probably version tagged. Truthfully, I have no idea if the limited info on stats we have are even accurate anymore, last time I heard about them was a very long time ago.

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Sorry if it seemed like I'd posted this thread and bailed, I've been fighting to connect to the internet most of the day. It's a real shame to hear about a divide that happened around the point that 1.0 launched, despite it not really containing much content that was what I was hoping to see, I still think it was good to see the game finally reach official launch. I can understand why though as the game really did change a lot.

Some users I notice pointed out the fact the list of planned features is unreliable and being honest, it really is, however that shouldn't devalue the idea as it can provide a very useful tool were it to actually contain relevant information. The only problem is as others also mentioned the devs have chosen that it's best to keep the secrets close to home to avoid disappointment which makes a lot of sense. I guess I've just become so used to being disappointed by other early access projects that a bit of disappointment here or there is worth it to me as long as I have a good idea what is still to come.

Regardless, whatever happens with the content from here on out, I really hope this won't be a one off and that perhaps we can see where KSP may go in the future one day (sequel). I do still feel that a major content update though would benefit the game hugely and regain some of the attention the game has been slowly for a long time now, or at least it appears, I could of course be wrong in my assumption there.

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The question posed in the OP is regarding what happened to the features that were widely circulated and discussed throughout the community a year ago that have not been implemented.

Like what? GP2? Nova left, and with him, GP2. What else was confirmed by the devs to be included but not, a year ago? We have reworked aerodynamics, we have resources, life support has never been confirmed, the editor aerodynamic overlay is coming.. provide solid examples of apparently planned features if you want answers to why they aren't implemented (yet). You're asking for specific information, but not providing specific questions.

If the questions really does relate to things that were "widely circulated and discussed throughout the community", the conversation is moot as the ideas were never confirmed to be planned and you're asking why fans ideas weren't implemented - to which the answer is 'because the devs didn't want to".

EDIT:

it can provide a very useful tool were it to actually contain relevant information.

And if my aunt were a bloke, she'd be my uncle. The wiki doesn't contain relevant info, so it isn't a useful tool. Until it does, it can and should be considered garbage.

Edited by ObsessedWithKSP

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