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[1.12.5] Bluedog Design Bureau - Stockalike Saturn, Apollo, and more! (v1.13.0 "Забытый" 13/Aug/2023)

CobaltWolf

By CobaltWolf
in KSP1 Mod Releases

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Jso

Jso

Posted
Posted
Just now, NyanTurian said:

Yes, the latest version of Sigma Dimensions (v0.60), Kopernicus (1.2.1-1), and KScale64 v1.302.

I mean which BDB version did those errors come from. The release, or the latest update. We're actively working on the adjustments for rescaled Kerbins and it seems to be going well so we need people to nitpick it. You'll want the latest files from GitHub - it's not packaged up in a release yet. We're not ready with Saturn. Everything else comes first.

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NyanTurian

NyanTurian

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, Jso said:

I mean which BDB version did those errors come from. The release, or the latest update. We're actively working on the adjustments for rescaled Kerbins and it seems to be going well so we need people to nitpick it. You'll want the latest files from GitHub - it's not packaged up in a release yet. We're not ready with Saturn. Everything else comes first.

I haven't tried any GitHub versions. I'm using v1.01 of BDB currently.

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NyanTurian

NyanTurian

Posted
Posted (edited)

I have downloaded the archive from your Github repository and I will be using it now.

I was wondering, what should my SMURFF levers be set to for this BlueSmurff.cfg to work properly? I currently have them at tanklever = 1.0, enginelever = 0.8, podlever = 0.8. Should I reset all to = 1.0?

Edited by NyanTurian
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Jso

Jso

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Posted
10 minutes ago, NyanTurian said:

I was wondering, what should my SMURFF levers be set to for this BlueSmurff.cfg to work properly? I currently have them at tanklever = 1.0, enginelever = 0.8, podlever = 0.8. Should I reset all to = 1.0?

Doesn't matter, there were enough SMURFF exclusions it became simpler to do it ourselves. What we're doing approximates PodLever 1, engineLever 0.64, tankLever 0.64.

20 minutes ago, Jso said:

Started an issue on GitHub for rescale related stuff. I don't want to clutter up this thread.

https://github.com/CobaltWolf/Bluedog-Design-Bureau/issues/270

 

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Jimbodiah

Jimbodiah

Posted
Posted (edited)

Why not just patch ISP/Thrust for all engines? That's the way I run RSS.

Spoiler 

@PART[*]:HAS[@MODULE[ModuleEngines*]]:NEEDS[RealSolarSystem]:Final
{
    @MODULE[ModuleEngines*]
    {
        @maxThrust *= 2.1

        @atmosphereCurve
        {
            @key[1, ] *= 1.7
	        @key,1[1, ] *= 1.7
	        @key,2[1, ] *= 1.7
        }
    }
}

 

 

Edited by Jimbodiah
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Jso

Jso

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, Jimbodiah said:

Why not just patch ISP/Thrust for all engines? That's the way I run RSS.

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@PART[*]:HAS[@MODULE[ModuleEngines*]]:NEEDS[RealSolarSystem]:Final
{
    @MODULE[ModuleEngines*]
    {
        @maxThrust *= 2.1

        @atmosphereCurve
        {
            @key[1, ] *= 1.7
	        @key,1[1, ] *= 1.7
	        @key,2[1, ] *= 1.7
        }
    }
}

 

 

Because the Isp is correct. The parts are too heavy.

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CobaltWolf

CobaltWolf

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4 hours ago, Jimbodiah said:

Tomato tomato .. hmm, that doesn't work so well when typing.

Thrust is factored down from real world figures so it is just an arbitrary number, why hang on to isp as being written in stone?

Jso uses mass and thrust to balance the engines, while keeping the real ISP. I didn't believe it at first but now I love it.

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Jso

Jso

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, Jimbodiah said:

Tomato tomato .. hmm, that doesn't work so well when typing.

Thrust is factored down from real world figures so it is just an arbitrary number, why hang on to isp as being written in stone?

The rockets gross in the area of 20-25% of real world mass, so thrust is set to 25% across the board for 1st stage engines, 50% for uppers (gameplay reasons). Isp is a measure of the efficiency of an engine and doesn't change with scale. There are also limits to how efficient a particular fuel can be, and multiplying by the 1.7 in your example would exceed those for virtually every engine in the game.

Were I to take an Earth rocket and scale it down for Ksp, using 25% thrust, 25% fuel mass, and 25% dry mass without changing the Isp it would have exactly the same performance as the original. What we do is scale it down and break it into parts, then make those parts as stockalike as possible. You end up with something resembling 25% thrust, 19% fuel mass, 80% dry mass**, and the same Isp. The excessive dry mass drags the deltav down. To correct for that to get the deltav we need for 3x, 4x, or 6.4x, we adjust the dry mass appropriately. About a 50% reduction - putting you around 30% of real, seems to be working out for 6.4x. We could add fuel, but it would take a lot of fuel, and it would break craft files.

** There is quite a bit of variation in dry mass. Our Atlas sustainer stage weighs almost twice what the real thing weighs (dry).

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CobaltWolf

CobaltWolf

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4 hours ago, Foxxonius Augustus said:

Astronauts, roll out! *Soon... hopefully.

Edit: Also thanks for the 2.5m multi-adapter @CobaltWolf any chance we could get a 1.875m version?

Good thing there's plenty of Skylab images for you to post :wink:

Yeah, I made the 1.875m MOL one into one but overwrote my gamedata folder from the version on Github, thinking I had already uploaded it. It's still updated with the multiple meshes in Unity, I just have to re-export it and rewrite mesh switching lines for the part cfg.

58 minutes ago, papics said:

Small question: is there already an RPM config floating around somewhere for the LEM? I managed to find the one for the KP0110, so I thought maybe it exists and it's only my search skills that are lacking.

I don't believe so. BDB IVAs are on a volunteer basis, and our volunteer was working on redoing the CSM interiors completely before he suffered some hardware issues that reset his progress.

42 minutes ago, davidy12 said:

@CobaltWolf: FYI: On the Sarnus Multi-Body:

FYI: Apparently the S-IVD (in ETS) had two engines. (IE: Had double the thrust)

FYI: Multibody uses the S-IVC (In the M43 or H03 configurations) or the S-IVB (M02 and all others). Are you talking about ETS Saturn II? In which case, I never actually said I'd DO that.

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legoclone09

legoclone09

Posted
Posted
51 minutes ago, NotAgain said:

@CobaltWolf, do BDB's science instruments have any unusual bit to their coding, as they are the only instuments in my install that work properly at the moment, and the rest complain that they can't be done in this situation, whatever situation they're in.

Thanks!

Do you have the DMagic science plugin? The science parts need that, I think it's bundled with the download.

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davidy12

davidy12

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, CobaltWolf said:

FYI: Multibody uses the S-IVC (In the M43 or H03 configurations) or the S-IVB (M02 and all others). Are you talking about ETS Saturn II? In which case, I never actually said I'd DO that.

 

No the S-IVC has double the thrust. My bad

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CobaltWolf

CobaltWolf

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9 minutes ago, davidy12 said:

No the S-IVC has double the thrust. My bad

No, it doesn't. It's still a single J-2S.

1 hour ago, NotAgain said:

@CobaltWolf, do BDB's science instruments have any unusual bit to their coding, as they are the only instuments in my install that work properly at the moment, and the rest complain that they can't be done in this situation, whatever situation they're in.

Thanks!

I mean, some of them (the geiger counter, magnetometer, micrometeoroid, and the cameras) use DMSA which just got an update (actually, we need to update it on our Github...) but I don't know. Does it happen on a clean install with just stock + BDB + its dependencies..?

EDIT: Also, @minepagan's first pass at rebalancing the BDB tech progression is now up on Github. If anyone is interested, drop it into a stock game and play through the first few tech levels and see how it feels.

Edited by CobaltWolf
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CobaltWolf

CobaltWolf

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, davidy12 said:

@CobaltWolf: http://wiki.alternatehistory.com/doku.php?id=timelines:eyes_turned_skyward_spacecraft_and_launch_vehicle_technical_data

Check the LV stats and compare S-IVB to S-IVC. Double the thrust. It must have two.

I'll have to ask @e of pi or @Workable Goblin about that. The drawings as well as the chapters that describe it refer to the J-2S as singular. I know that the wiki wasn't solely maintained by them. Sounds like something that might have been quietly retconned.

In any case, it would be a useful configuration to have. But don't hold your breath for it. Something like that would require all new modeling and textures...

Edited by CobaltWolf
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