[1.12.5] Bluedog Design Bureau - Stockalike Saturn, Apollo, and more! (v1.13.0 "Забытый" 13/Aug/2023)

[fs10inator]

I see some solid progress going on with Titan.

However, there's just only one suggestion I'm going to make regarding Titan: decoupler cosmetics. 

Another Titan II decoupler, same model, but only a repaint; a purely grey-ish scheme similar to the one found on Titan 23G (pictured below), as well as on later Titans.

...as well as another copy of the same decoupler model, but with a white texture for Titan IVB.

Edited December 30, 2015 by fs10inator

[BMot360]

14 hours ago, CobaltWolf said:

Using the 64bit hack shouldn't make a different for a part mod. What do you mean in the debug menu? I would say reinstall the mod, if that doesn't work try it with a fresh install and no other mods.

In other news, Titan II parts are more or less done. I still need to do the new fairing base but I don't have time to do that tonight. Also, I will be in the middle of the forest the next two days, and then Friday is a 10 hour bus ride back to my University. Since I'd rather make the time productive, start posting pictures of Titan III/IV if you have any particular feelings towards how I should texture the remaining fuel tanks.

EDIT: Also, @VenomousRequiem is in charge for the next 2-3 days, please direct all complaints directly to her doorstep.

 

Awesome looking parts there. Any plans to add TweakScale?

[akron]

I have some early "First-impression" "casual gamer" feedback from my testing last night.

- I felt the Techtree progression was a little strange, will it get a revision later on? It seemed like I was unlocking things a bit too quickly as I had way more advanced tech than what I am used to in Tier 1 career. Batteries and solar panels early on, as well as a more science experiments than usual. I don't think a Thermometer should be mid-Tier, mind you, but that's how it is in stock sot it's weird to get it ahead of time.

- The simple antenna (AKD2?)is rather heavy despite saying it is light. Not sure why, but it registered as heavier than the Communotron 16

- Mercury Parts are fracking awesome. The capsule does flip quite a bit after using the escape tower though. Also, is the solid fuel AND oxidizer on the retro pack intentional? Is it just to make it throttle-able?

- I love modular designs, but I sometimes put together mod parts that are "supposed" to go together. I got confused early on because I was seeing fuel tank sizes that didn't have an adapter or an engine counterpart. I guess I just need to get used to it and become more familiar with the real-life counterparts (And your naming convention), but it was confusing until I got past the "Mercury" parts. I didn't what was supposed to match with what. It was a lot of different diameters too quickly. I know this won't change, just a first impression.

- I like the fuel tanks are not plain but have interesting, different, textures and more geometry than just a "cylinder"

- May I suggest a custom editor category for the part pack? It will certainly make it easier to separate them

More thoughts as I come across them and progress through the tech tree. I find it easier to test parts in little chunks as they unlock. Good job, guys

52 minutes ago, BMot360 said:

Awesome looking parts there. Any plans to add TweakScale?

I could have sworn I saw Tweakscale configs in the latest release and it is mentioned in the OP

[VenomousRequiem]

@BMot360 Every part that needs it will have TweakScale, RealPlumes, and RemoteTech support on release. We gotchoo fam.

@akron All of your concerns are duly noted. I think Cobalt has the things placed in the tech tree as uh... somewhat of a thing to allow crappier parts earlier on? That way you don't have to wait forever to get something a simple as a solar panel. Tbh I don't typically play in career or science, but he only ever plays career.

Thank you for all the suggestions. Any more feedback, please, please lay it on me.

[komodo]

Bearer of bad news alert!

In the last dev preview, the Leto stage 2 engine is missing the ...exhausts? Emissives? off the vernier portion of the engine. Everything else seems like its in good shape as far as I can tell though. It was pretty late last night though, so I may not have played with all the parts. Time to give them a more thorough shake out now

[Kamaling]

From Bluedog Design Bureau I have a "MSC Dome Antenna" and a "DP-75 Antenna". I believe this is are parts of this Partpack.for KSP 1.05

First Issue: If I use this antenna right on top of any (also with vanilla "Probadobodyne OKTO") Probe Core, the missile starts without a problem but in hight of 6000m and again in hight of 12000m the camera switches and the missile flies out of sight of the camera view.

Second Issue: If I use a Science Tool like Thermometer or else and I transmit data, the data will not be transmitted by the DP-75 Antenna. I have to rightclick on the Antenna self and select "Transmit Data" on the Menue of the Antenna self.

I use several Mods so it may be a compatibility.problem. But for shure, check it with vanilla.

Mods I use for 1.05:

Asteriod Day, Behemont Aerospace Engeneering Large parts, Distant Objects, DMagic Orbital Science, Docking Camera KURS style, Dr. Jets Chop Shop, Firespitter (dll only), Fuel Tank Plus, Kdata, Kerbal Engineer, KSP-AVC, Lithobrake Exploration Technologies, Modula Rockes Sytem, OctoSat, RLA Stockalike, ScienceAlert, SpaceY Heavy Lifters, TAC Life Support, Tarsier Space Tech, Universal Storage, Vanguard Aerodynamics

Edited December 31, 2015 by Kamaling

[Jso]

The bottom node on the Prometheus-II-875 Stack Decoupler is a hair too low. I can see sky between it and an attached tank. I don't mean the blast openings (nice btw).

I think there's too much fuel in the tanks. For example the Prometheus-II-1287 Liquid Fuel Tank is 4.1 by 1.875 meters. It holds 1287 units of LiquidFuel and 1573 Oxidizer (2860 units total). The volume of that cylinder is 11.32 cubic meters, or 11,320 liters. At 5 liters per fuel unit, there should be max 2264 units of fuel. At 85% utilization it would be 1924, or 865.8 LiquidFuel and 1058.2 Oxidizer. I have a couple days off, I can go through and check the other tanks if there's agreement with my math.

The plumes look good. I can never get them lined up that well.

[VenomousRequiem]

2 hours ago, komodo said:

Bearer of bad news alert!

In the last dev preview, the Leto stage 2 engine is missing the ...exhausts? Emissives? off the vernier portion of the engine. Everything else seems like its in good shape as far as I can tell though. It was pretty late last night though, so I may not have played with all the parts. Time to give them a more thorough shake out now

Heh... I don't ever play without RP so I wouldn't know. Of course... I'm bad at writing RP configs so the verniers don't have effects with that either...

Will investigate.

1 hour ago, Kamaling said:

From Bluedog Design Bureau I have a "MSC Dome Antenna". I believe this is a part of this Partpack.for KSP 1.05

If I use this antenna right on top of any (also with vanilla "Probadobodyne OKTO") Probe Core, the missile starts without a problem but in hight of 6000m and again in hight of 12000m the camera switches and the missile flies out of sight of the camera view.

I use several Mods so it may be a compatibility.problem. But for shure, check it with vanilla.

Mods I use:

Asteriod Day, Behemont Aerospace Engeneering Large parts, Distant Objects, DMagic Orbital Science, Docking Camera KURS style, Dr. Jets Chop Shop, Firespitter (dll only), Fuel Tank Plus, Kartographer, Kdata, Kerbal Engineer, KSP-AVC, Lithobrake Exploration Technologies, Modula Rockes Sytem, OctoSat, RLA Stockalike, ScienceAlert, SpaceY Heavy Lifters, TAC Life Support, Tarsier Space Tech, Universal Storage, Vanguard Aerodynamics

I could have sworn that was fixed... Yes, that seems to just be us. We've had problems with the dome antenna doing that.

Noted.

Also I feel like Behemoth Aerospace really conflicts with this mod... we're like tiny early rockets and Behemoth's parts are... wow...

36 minutes ago, Jso said:

The bottom node on the Prometheus-II-875 Stack Decoupler is a hair too low. I can see sky between it and an attached tank. I don't mean the blast openings (nice btw).

I think there's too much fuel in the tanks. For example the Prometheus-II-1287 Liquid Fuel Tank is 4.1 by 1.875 meters. It holds 1287 units of LiquidFuel and 1573 Oxidizer (2860 units total). The volume of that cylinder is 11.32 cubic meters, or 11,320 liters. At 5 liters per fuel unit, there should be max 2264 units of fuel. At 85% utilization it would be 1924, or 865.8 LiquidFuel and 1058.2 Oxidizer. I have a couple days off, I can go through and check the other tanks if there's agreement with my math.

The plumes look good. I can never get them lined up that well.

Yeah, I noticed that with the decoupler, too. I'll see if I can fix that myself; However I'm not the best with actual part configs.

That math seems... really useful. I'll talk to Cobalt about it. Good job. :3

As for the plumes, are you talking about the RealPlumes configs? If so, thank you very much.   wrote them myself.

[Jso]

31 minutes ago, VenomousRequiem said:

As for the plumes, are you talking about the RealPlumes configs?

Yep. I do Real Fuels and stock effects don't work with that, so I'm forever adding plumes and I'm very bad at it. These are appreciated.

[VenomousRequiem]

17 minutes ago, Jso said:

Yep. I do Real Fuels and stock effects don't work with that, so I'm forever adding plumes and I'm very bad at it. These are appreciated.

RealFuels don't work with stock effects? That seems a little silly, no? 

Yo, yo, if you made a RealFuels config I'd get Cobalt to link it in the OP and/or include it in the download! I like RealFuels, but I don't typically get to use it...

[komodo]

1 hour ago, VenomousRequiem said:

Heh... I don't ever play without RP so I wouldn't know. Of course... I'm bad at writing RP configs so the verniers don't have effects with that either...

Will investigate.

 

I'll check, but I thought I was using the RP configs. This is of course on my horror show scaled kerbal space program, so I may have to fire up a normal sized one to see what's up there.

I hope in a few days to have some nice screen shots up! I haven't in a while, but i've an imgur account... somewhere around here

[VenomousRequiem]

1 hour ago, komodo said:

I'll check, but I thought I was using the RP configs. This is of course on my horror show scaled kerbal space program, so I may have to fire up a normal sized one to see what's up there.

I hope in a few days to have some nice screen shots up! I haven't in a while, but i've an imgur account... somewhere around here

Horror show scaled KSP? What scale do you play at? I'm a fan of Harder Solar System x3; I don't typically play without it. :3

[komodo]

15 minutes ago, VenomousRequiem said:

Horror show scaled KSP? What scale do you play at? I'm a fan of Harder Solar System x3; I don't typically play without it. :3

The scaling of the system is not too horrific, its just a 'standard' 6.4x scale.

However, I've been going off the deep end rescaling parts based on the ROMini.cfg that NathenKell wrote for RO.

It's... Interesting for sure. I like the feel of it though, things work well on the whole, aside from some naggling KSP bugs. I've been learning MM slowly but surely over the last few weeks, at least enough to tweak and read some of the more intricate wizardry that has been come up with. If the bugs ever get worked out of the base system, I think it'd be quite popular in light of how drag and drop it would be. Time will tell!

In any case, that's why i'm not sure if its the part that is a little wacky, or just my incarnation of it.

The next disaster I have been pondering is New Horizons, but i'm not sure how their rescale support is. I loved Alternis Kerbol back in 0.23.5... Apparently stock is too boring or something,

 

[Jso]

1 hour ago, VenomousRequiem said:

Yo, yo, if you made a RealFuels config I'd get Cobalt to link it in the OP and/or include it in the download! I like RealFuels, but I don't typically get to use it...

Just to be clear, I don't have a Realism Overhaul config. I didn't resize anything. I use 64K so I've got Real Fuels configs made for 64% scale models (which these are for the most part). Masses and thrusts are dropped to maintain real world fuel ratios and TWRs, and the mass reductions are significant in some cases. The LR-87 drops from 2 tons to 187 Kg. It should work ok in any size Kerbin between stock and 6.4x. Anything bigger than 6.4 and you won't make orbit.

It's very much a work in progress, but I've got Explorer, Able, Ablestar, Vanguard, Thor, various Mercury pod tweaks, Redstone, Atlas, and Agena A/B/D. Some, like Agena, are well hashed out with all the variations. Others, notably Atlas, are pretty basic. Explorer I've got very little confidence in. I'm getting 5000 DV in 10 seconds out of it when I plug in the numbers. It's so small! I know I've missed Centaur. Not sure what else. I had built an HGR+Procedural parts Titan GLV and was working on an Atlas-Agena when I stumbled into this project so the Titan II config homework is done. Won't be any big deal to dive into those.

[VenomousRequiem]

20 minutes ago, komodo said:

The next disaster I have been pondering is New Horizons, but i'm not sure how their rescale support is. I loved Alternis Kerbol back in 0.23.5... Apparently stock is too boring or something,

 

I mean... Harder Solar System supports OPM, I know that much. I don't know about New Horizons.

 

10 minutes ago, Jso said:

*Snip*

Yeah, I figured. You didn't mention anything about RO.

But anything that can expend 5,000M/s DeltaV in 10 seconds doesn't belong in this world... no man should have that much power.

Isn't that like 0-60MPH in like... a fraction of a second..?

[Jso]

1 hour ago, VenomousRequiem said:

But anything that can expend 5,000M/s DeltaV in 10 seconds doesn't belong in this world... no man should have that much power.

Isn't that like 0-60MPH in like... a fraction of a second..?

Rechecking I get about 2100 DV in 7 seconds, which sounds more reasonable. It's 47 G's at the end of the burn. I'm probably screwing something up in the imperial/metric conversions. Didn't somebody crash into Mars that way?

Here's the Real fuels file as it is. Hopefully it works outside of my little sandbox.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/0dvilkix4twu7pu/BDB_RF_12-31-15.zip?dl=0

You'll want Real fuels plus the Stockalike configs. The only file it requires from the Stockalike configs is Fuel_Conversions.cfg because it will auto-magically convert the tanks I didn't do by hand.

[komodo]

On the topic of Explorer 1 dV, that one is pretty straight forward... Secondly, first, it appears to be 0-60 mph in about 56 ms. BEEEEYOWWWWW! Perhaps as it doesn't belong in this world, it's a good thing they aimed that one at the sky!

Firstly, second, Wikipedia numbers give 14kg mass of the probe+stage 4 and a 6.7 kN thruster (214 s ISP, btw), which fired for 7 seconds. Ramming the numbers through WolframAlpha kicks out 3350 m/s. So, i'd believe it. Even a 'dinky' thruster attached to a tiny payload gets going in a hurry.

I'll have to see what numbers my config has; they were something equally insane, so they're probably about right.

It'd be an insane ride for the little guy, though. Juno-I was a crazy rocket >< Semi-automatic rocket staging practically. ... Almost Kerbal-esque.

Harder-Solar-System also looks interesting, it's been considered before as well. So many ideas, so little time... So much time tilting at cfg files  

Edited December 31, 2015 by komodo

[Jso]

It's a fun little rocket. I stuck one on top of a Vanguard-Ablestar and flung it upwards. Lit off the Explorer at apoapsis and it ended up in something like a 300x1500 km orbit. It even inadvertently spin stabilized itself when KOS lost roll control on the way up. I never realized how tiny those first satellites were.

[BMot360]

14 hours ago, VenomousRequiem said:

@BMot360 Every part that needs it will have TweakScale, RealPlumes, and RemoteTech support on release. We gotchoo fam.

Awesome. I look forward to it! Thanks.

[Araym]

On 30/12/2015 at 4:07 AM, CobaltWolf said:

Using the 64bit hack shouldn't make a different for a part mod. What do you mean in the debug menu? I would say reinstall the mod, if that doesn't work try it with a fresh install and no other mods.

In other news, Titan II parts are more or less done. I still need to do the new fairing base but I don't have time to do that tonight. Also, I will be in the middle of the forest the next two days, and then Friday is a 10 hour bus ride back to my University. Since I'd rather make the time productive, start posting pictures of Titan III/IV if you have any particular feelings towards how I should texture the remaining fuel tanks.

EDIT: Also, @VenomousRequiem is in charge for the next 2-3 days, please direct all complaints directly to her doorstep.

 

I took a ride to the Titan parts: VERY NICELY DONE!

Just a "minor bug" found about them:
in the techtree, Titan IV first stage engines come BEFORE Titan II...
... probably in setting their node, you got them "crossed" with early engines version.

I changed it in some ways, to make them more likely an advancement from previous researched version, putting the "upper stage" a node higher than the first stage engine, as they are already in your config (in a way that first were researched a better first stage one, then in the next node you get the better upper stage one)

What I have now in my career tech tree (some were really not changes, as I moved not all the tech node definition, but actually I do not remember which were where :P):

- Prometheus-I-700 "Perses" Liquid Engine (first stage Titan I) at TechRequired = generalRocketry

- Prometheus-II-900 "Pallas" Liquid Engine (first stage Titan II) at TechRequired = advRocketry
- Prometheus-I-250 "Leto" Liquid Engine (upper stage Titan I) at TechRequired = advRocketry

- Prometheus-IV-1000 "Astreous" Liquid Engine (first stage Titan IV) at TechRequired = heavyRocketry
- Prometheus-II-325 "Lelantos" Liquid Engine (upper stage Titan II) at TechRequired = heavyRocketry

- Prometheus-IV-375 "Asteria" Liquid Engine (upper stage Titan IV) at TechRequired = heavierRocketry

... this way, at general Rocketry is possible to build just the first stage Titan I...

... at adv Rocketry, it is possible to build a full Titan I, and eventually an "hybrid" Titan II first stages-Titan I upper (I thought about a "first study" about a better rocket :P)

... at heavy Rocketry, the full Titan II is possible (developed a better upper stage) for Gemini-like missions, or an "heavy duty" Titan like the Titan III series (those used, for example, to launch the MOL-Gemini mockup - the first stage engine was very likely the same as Titan IV) as an "hybrid", again, with a Titan IV first stage-Titan II upper stage

... at heavier Rocketry, the last Titan IV upper stage, for a full developed Titan IV.

 

Real life notes: actually, there was really not so much differences but what was a Titan III and a Titan IV, for the main rocket: both first and second stage engines were the same.
The real change were about the solid boosters: Titan III had the first generation solids like in the Gemini-MOL launch (in various lenght but with the same engineering layout, with those side tanks to "stear" the solids), then came Titan IV with the newer solids with actual, real, gimballing nozzle.
But to not mess too much with tech nodes, I found the Titan IV upper stage already were it was in your config, higher than the first stage ones, so I "build up" the idea of a "scalar development" of first stage first than the upper one

Edited December 31, 2015 by Araym

[fs10inator]

2 minutes ago, Araym said:

in the techtree, Titan IV first stage engines come BEFORE Titan II...

Technological and temporal paradox, I suppose?

[Araym]

2 hours ago, fs10inator said:

Technological and temporal paradox, I suppose?

Kerbals going time travel, stealing an advanced engine, then retro-engineering it in a worse model!!!

[fs10inator]

12 minutes ago, Araym said:

Kerbals going time travel, stealing an advanced engine, then retro-engineering it in a worse model!!!

That must explain the rocket explosions anomalies that happen about 95% of the time in KSP

[CobaltWolf]

On 12/27/2015 at 6:22 PM, somnambulist said:

Hey CobaltWolf -

Could you check out an issue with the Hermes parachute/rcs part? I think the game is using the dimensions of the parachute canopy to determine part size for the engineers report. The report shows the part as 14.6m H x 8.6m W x 8.6m L which kinda kills its usefulness in an early career mode game

Thanks!

@somnambulist and everyone else who was having trouble with the Mercury parachute, I have a fixed version of the mu file available for download here. (I actually have no idea if it works as a parachute, I've just fixed the bug where the VAB thinks it's too big) I've been out of town the last two days and the realization that the mercury parts were basically unusable was really getting to me. I have to go to a New Years Eve party in about five minutes, but I took a small window I had once I was back with my PC to try and get it fixed. Hopefully @VenomousRequiem will have a chance to update the pack on Kerbalstuff (nothing new, just the hotfix).

For everyone else - Jeez. I was in the woods with no cell service for 36 hours and when I came back I had something like 33 notification emails from this thread. I will be off the grid again tomorrow, and likely busy for most of the weekend. Once I've settled back into my apartment I'll try my best to reply to everyone's posts. I skimmed most of them, and wanted to thank everyone for the input. I also want to quickly reiterate that the dev releases are not meant to be played, especially in a career save. They're simply for testing for balance and bugs.

Cheers everyone, and Happy New Years!

Edited December 31, 2015 by CobaltWolf

[VenomousRequiem]

Version 0.08b now available on KerbalStuff!

Like Cobalt said, nothing new, just a parachute fix.

Edit- I say "fix"... could someone actually validate that as the right word? Maybe test it for me?

Edited December 31, 2015 by VenomousRequiem