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[1.12.3] Bluedog Design Bureau - Stockalike Saturn, Apollo, and more! (v1.11.0 "вне" 22/Oct/2022)


CobaltWolf
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36 minutes ago, Zorg said:

This is made faithfully to the ETS descriptions and art.

I submit, that the ETS description and art, are in error from a technical standpoint.

 

Edit: Welcome to page 905

On 10/29/2021 at 7:27 AM, GoldForest said:

 

Saturn C-3 (Note: This thing can't really fly. It has a .60 to .7 twr fully configured and fully fueled.)

NrzQ07w.jpg

Replace the center cluster of H-1 with an F-1. I'm reading Stages to Saturn and this is mentioned on page 48. It says that this is a possible configuration in lieu of uprated H-1s. @Pappystein @CobaltWolf This might be something to look at as a part switch.

Edited by birdog357
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33 minutes ago, birdog357 said:

I submit, that the ETS description and art, are in error from a technical standpoint.

I’ll just put it very clearly. What you are asking for is a near complete remake of the port except for the outer base ring. I am not doing that. 
 

I could have made it fully androgynous by offsetting the petals 22.5 degrees as I did in my initial draft as well but the decision to go with the extant art was a deliberate decision and is final. 

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Since several of the new Saturn and Apollo parts conflict with the old parts, there is little point to keeping them on in the OldParts folder causing bugs for people.  Like the Saturn folder already was earlier, the Apollo folder will be deleted shortly. Any craft using those parts (which arent sharing names with new parts) WILL break so fair warning. hey no warranty for dev build :P

Skylab folder is being retained.

Edited by Zorg
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1 hour ago, Zorg said:

Since several of the new Saturn and Apollo parts conflict with the old parts, there is little point to keeping them on in the OldParts folder causing bugs for people.  Like the Saturn folder already was earlier, the Apollo folder will be deleted shortly. Any craft using those parts (which arent sharing names with new parts) WILL break so fair warning. hey no warranty for dev build :P

Skylab folder is being retained.

Would it be possible to maintain the old Apollo docking ports? I, and I imagine other people, have used them extensively on things like Gemini Ferry and MOL builds.

Edited by Hay
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7 minutes ago, Hay said:

Would it be possible to maintain the old Apollo docking ports? I, and I imagine other people, have used them extensively on things like Gemini Ferry and MOL builds.

We've always advertised major BDB updates as being breaking changes, this time the Saturn/Apollo/Skylab update needs to be considered a breaking change from day 1. Its best to start retiring those craft.

 

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4 hours ago, birdog357 said:

 

Replace the center cluster of H-1 with an F-1. I'm reading Stages to Saturn and this is mentioned on page 48. It says that this is a possible configuration in lieu of uprated H-1s. @Pappystein @CobaltWolf This might be something to look at as a part switch.

:confused: Those are 2 F-1s on the first stage. 

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7 hours ago, Spaceman.Spiff said:

A SOFI S-IVB would have been cheaper though right?

yes,  By probably Hundreds (I don't honestly know, this is more TJ's bailiwick) of man hours.

I do know that the Thermo properties of the Shuttle Tank are not quite up to Saturn S-IVB standards for conductivity.   It is close... but even with the greater separation between LOx and LH2  there is still more cross liquid heat transfer.  Again TJ would know better than I

4 minutes ago, GoldForest said:

:confused: Those are 2 F-1s on the first stage. 

I am considering trying an FOIA request for the pertinent pre 1960 and pre and post Silverstein configuration documents for the C-2 and the C-3.    It will be my first FOIA request believe it or not.

Goal is to find the actual Conceptual Engineer documents so we can get accurate info on all of the important bits that make up a rocket.   What little remains on NTRS is shadows, and smoked mirrors

34 minutes ago, Daelkyr said:

Is that just the super long S-IVB with the SOFI or did I miss a S-IE update?

Pretty sure it is SOFI-stretched S-IVB.    But don't take my word for it. :D

*Loads Github Desktop*   Sticking with my guess above

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21 minutes ago, Pappystein said:

I am considering trying an FOIA request for the pertinent pre 1960 and pre and post Silverstein configuration documents for the C-2 and the C-3.    It will be my first FOIA request believe it or not.

Goal is to find the actual Conceptual Engineer documents so we can get accurate info on all of the important bits that make up a rocket.   What little remains on NTRS is shadows, and smoked mirrors

Why not go for all of them? :P Go big or go home right? :D  By all of them, I mean all Saturns. A-1 through C-8. There's also like 6 C-3s to choose from. C-3, C-3B 2 stage, C-3B 3 stage, C-3BN, INT-20 and Saturn II.

Edited by GoldForest
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12 minutes ago, GoldForest said:

Why not go for all of them? :P Go big or go home right? :D  By all of them, I mean all Saturns. A-1 through C-8. There's also like 6 C-3s to choose from. C-3, C-3B 2 stage, C-3B 3 stage, C-3BN, INT-20 and Saturn II.

INT-20 and Saturn II we have in spades (the main MLV documents as well as the Saturn II documents are either on NTRS or other servers.)    Any MLV variants are OK.   So anything from the Saturn-I and the Saturn-V families are good.

There are more like 8 or 9 C-3s.  There are at-least 3 to 5 C-2s....   You see why I want those documents.   I can always make more request in the future if my initial request goes through.

There was no C-7 and C-8 does not interest me.   If I were to jump on other rockets right away it would be some of the more unique Nova rockets.

 

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@Pappystein had a breakthrough on the S-4 saga. On page 119 of Stages to Saturn, while discussing F-1 development: "In general, the configuration of the engine package followed the pattern of the Atlas sustainer engine(the S-4), Rocketdyne's first large liquid-propellant gimbaled engine with the turbopump mounted directly on the thrust chamber."

 

The S-4 IS the LR-105.

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3 hours ago, GoldForest said:

:confused: Those are 2 F-1s on the first stage. 

I think I figured out the problem. The C-3 I was looking at was a 2 million lb thrust class booster with all the stages above the first at S-IV(not B) diameter and hydrolox fueled. You have 2nd and 3rd stages at base diameter. You've got a 3 million pound thrust first stage with a 4.2 million pound stack.

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Quick Little Joe II

Image

Image

Plumes are a little overzealous so the action can't be captured well, I would encourage you to load a CM with a tower on it and press backspace to see it for yourself.

Image

Avionics cost money, astronauts do not.

Edited by Clamp-o-Tron
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1 hour ago, birdog357 said:

I think I figured out the problem. The C-3 I was looking at was a 2 million lb thrust class booster with all the stages above the first at S-IV(not B) diameter and hydrolox fueled. You have 2nd and 3rd stages at base diameter. You've got a 3 million pound thrust first stage with a 4.2 million pound stack.

I just followed the picture and wikipedia page to create the rocket, don't blame me, blame them. lol

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7 hours ago, Daelkyr said:

Is that just the super long S-IVB with the SOFI or did I miss a S-IE update?

6 hours ago, Pappystein said:

Pretty sure it is SOFI-stretched S-IVB.    But don't take my word for it. :D

*Loads Github Desktop*   Sticking with my guess above

Yup, it's a 6 meters extension SIVB with SOFI plus a few other parts to look more like the proper SI-E (mainly placing the Saturn 1C engine mount on top of the SIVB to maintain the black stripes of the interstage on the first stage like on the ETS art)

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Having fun with photoshop and the new Apollo models in development, I'm in the process to make some extra paints to complement the already official variations (mine will be release indipendently, as add-on):
for now I have "Boilerplate 1101A" and "Boilerplate 1102A" (and in the process to make "Boilerplate 23A").

screenshot35.png

screenshot36.png

 

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CgEQcpN.jpg

GPiU5IV.jpg

iGdUxqS.jpg

x4sHcGe.jpg

B3LscMA.jpg

Some snippets from the Apollo 18 Mission. The rover decided to roll away and launch itself off a cliff into the crater.  Safe to say Trados was not happy with Sigfen, who felt really bad once Trados silently stared at him for a few minutes. 

See the whole album here: Imgur: The magic of the Internet
(Too many images for be to post here.)

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21 minutes ago, EDS_Pilot said:

You think you're BETTER than me?

Yes, I didn't have a solar panel ripped off at launch.

-Transmission from a Skylab to another.

I realized that spacelab doesn't have the solar telescope thing and now I need to remove it in the craft file/subassembly and that's annoying

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