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[1.12.3] Bluedog Design Bureau - Stockalike Saturn, Apollo, and more! (v1.11.0 "вне" 22/Oct/2022)


CobaltWolf
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29 minutes ago, CobaltWolf said:

Forgot to post yesterday, but there is now a mesh switch for the SLA to have payload adapters for the AARDV Block 1, Block III+ and Block IV mission modules.

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Great work. Is there any chance, in the near future, you could add some other sizes, namely 0.9375m for the KH-7 Apollo lunar orbiter thingy?

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47 minutes ago, Entr8899 said:

Great work. Is there any chance, in the near future, you could add some other sizes, namely 0.9375m for the KH-7 Apollo lunar orbiter thingy?

I think you can just put one of the Delta III 2.5m to various sizes payload adapters on it.

3 hours ago, Jcking said:

Nerva I is the one with the roll control nozzles, right?

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There have been many iterations I think but yes most often depicted like that. The Restock NERV is a great depiction to be fair but if we are doing Nerva II for BDB might as well consider doing Nerva 1 with our own balancing and so forth.

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more fictional INT stuff

INT-25

Spoiler

INT-20 but with only 1 F1 and a vastly reduced S-1C tank load, 4 UA-1207 boosters, this one is junk but it's still interesting

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INT-26

Spoiler

Basically just S-IVB on an LRB, it acts as a more powerful but technically inferior version of Saturn 1C

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INT-27

Spoiler

Basically INT-26 but with 2 additional LRB strapons (core runs on 85% thrust), and the S-IVB was replaced with S-II

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Bonus: INT-05C

Spoiler

This thing is just stupid

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Edited by Starhelperdude
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Hello!

This got buried a few pages back so I would like to ask again.

@CobaltWolf@Zorg@Invaderchaos,

I have a few questions concerning the Saturn I and IB.

I found a passage in chapter three of Roger Bilstein's Stages to Saturn in which he describes the process of modifying the S-I stage during the leadup to building the new S-IB. He stated that an aggressive program of weight reduction succeeded in reducing the overall weight of the stage by an astounding 9000 kg, or in U.S. terms nearly 10 tons! A portion of that came from the lighter fins, but the rest came from "modifications to the propellent tanks, spider beam and other components, and removal of various tubes and brackets no longer required."  When combined with the uprating of the H-1 engines to first 200,00 and then to 205,000 lbs of thrust the new Saturn IB gained a substantial performance upgrade from its predecessor.

I took a look at the BDB S-I stage and found that a fully outfitted S-IB version comes out to be only 80 lbs lighter than the S-I, and that is entirely due to changing the fins. Was this the intended situation by the dev team? Was this the result of the balancing that needed to take place to give the models semi-realistic performance? If not, is it possible to get a B9 switch for the lighter S-IB version, or perhaps a whole new version?

Also, is there a config somewhere that will give us an all white S-IB stage similar to what was flown on the Skylab and ASTP missions?

Even if you change nothing it is still a fantastic rendering.

Thank you.

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21 minutes ago, DaveyJ576 said:

Hello!

This got buried a few pages back so I would like to ask again.

@CobaltWolf@Zorg@Invaderchaos,

I have a few questions concerning the Saturn I and IB.

I found a passage in chapter three of Roger Bilstein's Stages to Saturn in which he describes the process of modifying the S-I stage during the leadup to building the new S-IB. He stated that an aggressive program of weight reduction succeeded in reducing the overall weight of the stage by an astounding 9000 kg, or in U.S. terms nearly 10 tons! A portion of that came from the lighter fins, but the rest came from "modifications to the propellent tanks, spider beam and other components, and removal of various tubes and brackets no longer required."  When combined with the uprating of the H-1 engines to first 200,00 and then to 205,000 lbs of thrust the new Saturn IB gained a substantial performance upgrade from its predecessor.

I took a look at the BDB S-I stage and found that a fully outfitted S-IB version comes out to be only 80 lbs lighter than the S-I, and that is entirely due to changing the fins. Was this the intended situation by the dev team? Was this the result of the balancing that needed to take place to give the models semi-realistic performance? If not, is it possible to get a B9 switch for the lighter S-IB version, or perhaps a whole new version?

Also, is there a config somewhere that will give us an all white S-IB stage similar to what was flown on the Skylab and ASTP missions?

Even if you change nothing it is still a fantastic rendering.

Thank you.

Oh yeah I did see it, the thing is according to JSO the Saturn IB is such a pig that the weight of the structural parts is already as low as it could reasonably be. Perhaps there is performance margin to increase the mass for Saturn I but a mass only switch on a structural part like the engine mount (which is where it probably needs to be) is a bit of an outlier. We can think about it though perhaps after Pegasus is done since iirc that should be the most demanding payload for Saturn I?

Edited by Zorg
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4 hours ago, Zorg said:

Oh yeah I did see it, the thing is according to JSO the Saturn IB is such a pig that the weight of the structural parts is already as low as it could reasonably be. Perhaps there is performance margin to increase the mass for Saturn I but a mass only switch on a structural part like the engine mount (which is where it probably needs to be) is a bit of an outlier. We can think about it though perhaps after Pegasus is done since iirc that should be the most demanding payload for Saturn I?

Most demanding would be the all Water S-IV and The Apollo Boilerplate  from the Water hauling missions I think.  

However I *DO* think a lot of sources quote S-I mass for the S-IB.   Maybe, if I get them unlocked, my FOIA request will have better data.  I did receive notification that the request was received yesterday!

 

 

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i've found to small bugs.

the textures for the SLA panels are broken, the hinge and the bits on the bottom corder are now a splotchy gray color.

 

also with waterfall installed the turbine exhaust from the F-1B comes out sideways

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9 hours ago, Zorg said:

Oh yeah I did see it, the thing is according to JSO the Saturn IB is such a pig that the weight of the structural parts is already as low as it could reasonably be. Perhaps there is performance margin to increase the mass for Saturn I but a mass only switch on a structural part like the engine mount (which is where it probably needs to be) is a bit of an outlier. We can think about it though perhaps after Pegasus is done since iirc that should be the most demanding payload for Saturn I?

Just found some Saturn information from Ed Kyle on NASASpaceFlight quoting his post from earlier today (unrelated to me being there just lucked into it!)

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The flight reports as mentioned have detailed mass budgets.  Note that each individual Saturn rocket was slightly different and that only the Skylab Saturns flew to consistent orbit insertions.  The Block I Saturn I first stages were shorter and lighter than the Block II Saturn I first stages.  The early S-IB stages were "leftover" Saturn I stages, so they differed from later S-IB stages, and so on.

Also note that some of the on-line information is based on projected Saturn I(B) types that were under or close to development but that never actually flew.  I've posted some Saturn info of this type to the L2 photo threads, but may bring some here if I have time (something I have not had much of lately).

Here, for example, are the SA-10 and SA-208 (Skylab 4) reports.  They list the following masses related to the  first stages.

SA-10  S-I + Interstage at Liftoff:  448,194 kg
           S-I + Interstage at Separation:  53,889 kg
           Interstage Mass:  1,095 kg

SA-208  S-IB + Interstage at Liftoff:  448,762 kg
             S-IB + Interstage at Separation:  46,279 kg
             Interstage Mass:  2,606 kg
 

Hope that is helpful

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1 hour ago, Pappystein said:

Just found some Saturn information from Ed Kyle on NASASpaceFlight quoting his post from earlier today (unrelated to me being there just lucked into it!)

Hope that is helpful

They dialed in the fuel system better as they went. There was less fuel left over at burnout. That would account for a lot of the mass differences.

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On 11/15/2021 at 5:51 AM, Araym said:

... and for those that were enjoying also my unofficial BDBNIC fork for the new Apollo capsule repaint I made, a simply reminder to download it again, as the new Titan cleanup gives some B9PartSwitch error with the previous version.

Grab the updated version here: https://github.com/Araym-KSP/BDBNIC
(downlad the repo thru the big green button... then you can simply copy-paste and everything should be fixed)

Pushing some ulterior fixes to my BDBNIC fork, after the Titan texture updates, for all of those downloading any of the BDB dev versions!

  • Fixed  Titan II second stage tank
  • Fixed Titan II Gemini decoupler


If anyone using it found any other errors, feel free to post it here or to send me a PM here on the forum (or drop an "issue" warning on the github page). I will try to fix them "as soon as possible™"

Edited by Araym
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Apollo 11: The Big One

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Sit down and grab a drink, and make sure you're connected to WiFi, lots of images and lots of text here, as you might expect for this mission.

 

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Early morning, July 16th, 1969. Saturn V SA-506 sits on the pad at LC-39A, creaking and venting cold vapors as it anxiously awaits the firing command which will send it, two spacecraft, and three astronauts on the greatest voyage ever undertaken.

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A year ago, the notion of a landing after only four manned Apollo flights would have sounded ludicrous. However, the rapid acceleration which accompanied Apollo 8's reassignment as a circumlunar voyage has allowed NASA to thoroughly test the Apollo/Saturn architecture and procedures in manned operation in under ten months' time and the spacecraft, now fully mature, is finally ready to fulfill its purpose. Amidst a column of smoke and flame, Apollo 11 rumbles skyward.

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The Saturn V, now on its sixth flight, has by now been freed of virtually all of the teething problems discovered during testing. The concerning pogo oscillations experienced by the crew of Apollo 8 have been greatly reduced, the J-2 engine's reliability has been assured, and the instrument unit's guidance programs have been refined to the peak of excellence.

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After a steady launch, parking orbit, and TLI, the crew of Apollo 11 prepare to extract the Lunar Module for the three day voyage. Once Columbia and Eagle are a safe distance from the spent Saturn booster, it will vent its excess fuel in such a way as to send it into orbit around the sun, where it will no longer pose a threat to the Apollo 11 spacecraft.

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Lunar Orbit Insertion, a tense and uncertain procedure only seven months ago, is by now a straightforward process. Although only the third crew to reach lunar orbit, the astronauts onboard '11 are calm and collected as they slow down behind the Moon.

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Upon reemerging from behind the Moon, Apollo 11 is allotted a period of rest to prepare for the events of the next day. As they wait for the lighting conditions above the Sea of Tranquility to reach their optimal level, the crew spends time photographing key landmarks from Columbia's windows. Seen here, the prominent far-side crater Tsiolkovsky, a site for which some of the more idealistic geologists are aggressively advocating as a site for a later landing.

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Now, the moment of truth. Eagle is powered up, checked out, and released from the command module. If all goes well it will return in a day's time. If not, she may never return at all.

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Before entering the descent orbit, the astronauts onboard photograph each other's spacecraft and inspect them to ensure all is in order. If a problem has arisen concerning the spacecraft exterior, it must be detected now.

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One orbit later, Eagle's DPS is lit to begin Powered Descent. Until now, everything the crew has done was tested and rehearsed on a previous flight. Now, they have truly entered the realm of the unknown. At this early stage of the descent, the crew flies facing the surface to track their approach landmarks. Upon seeing them pass by ahead of schedule, they realize their landing site will be slightly further west than intended.

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Upon pitchover, the spacecraft commander finds himself descending into a hilly, boulder-strewn landscape. While perhaps more geologically interesting, the difficulty this presents is highly undesirable. Eagle  is instructed to adjust its aim point further down the track.

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Author's note: I've seen floating boulders in KSP before, but never this many; must be a KSRSS thing. Either way, I deactivated terrain scatter after this trainwreck ruined my chance for aesthetic screenshots. That's why you won't see boulders in any more of my photos.

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And now, Bill Kerman is the most observed person in history, as billions across the Earth watch him descend Eagle's ladder, to make that giant leap which will change the world forever.

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Though dark, colorless, and grainy, these images will captivate the world as they bear witness to the peak of human achievement...

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...And as they watch, that first step breaks the silence which spans across thousands of miles of space. It sets off a cacophony of noise across the globe, although the men responsible can hear none of it. Fireworks erupt over Houston, billboards proclaim the news in Times Square, newsboys in London and Paris shout their papers' headlines aloud, and in Washington an anonymous person places a note on the grave of President Kennedy reading, "Mr. President, the Eagle has landed".

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However, for the men on the ground (or in the sky, as it were), there is time neither for reflection nor jubilation. After collecting a contingency sample and gaining his footing on the alien lunar surface, Bill photographs his LMP descending the ladder after him. By the mission checklist, they have a little over an hour to complete their surface activities.

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While the CDR extracts the EASEP equipment, the LMP deploys the tripod television camera which will film the events of the moonwalk. Although no clearer than the grainy camera of the MESA pallet, this will offer a much better picture to the audience on Earth. Having been coiled up for weeks inside the LM's storage compartment, the wires of the camera do not lay flat on the ground but fall in a loose spiral, waiting for a carless astronaut to trip over them.

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EASEP is much more rudimentary science station than what is planned to be used by subsequent Apollo missions. It contains only one long-term experiment and features only one low-gain antenna for data transmission. Regardless, the experience it provides for flight crews and ground technicians alike will prove valuable as the more sensitive and capable ALSEP equipment enters the field.

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Nothing highbrow to say about this photo other than that I tried to replicate the famous Aldrin visor shot, a photoshopped version of which serves as my current profile picture. Unfortunately not being able to position the kerbal's hands and arms means this dollar-store value knockoff is the best I can do. Not as impressive as I had hoped.

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Once EASEP is fully installed and the bulk sample collected, the crew perform perhaps the most culturally significant part of the moonwalk; raising the first Stars and Stripes on the lunar surface. Not since the flag on Iwo Jima has Old Glory served as the centerpiece for such an important photograph.

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Following this, the two moonwalkers unveil the plaque mounted on Eagle's front leg, and receive a call from the President congratulating them on their achievement. What they don't know is that he's already planning on strangling the Apollo Program and will probably cripple the Space Shuttle as well...

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Although impressive in its own right, this first moonwalk will pale in comparison to future ones. At no time did the crew venture beyond 100 meters from their lander, and for now the distant mountains will remain an untapped mystery.

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Even so, the camera continues to broadcast the moonwalk back to Earth. While to a few skeptics the poor image quality represents proof that the entire landing was staged, for most people this footage will remain embedded in their minds for the rest of their lives.

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At last, after over an hour on the surface, the crew ascends the ladder and closes the hatch. They will spend the rest of the day on the Moon, trying to rest win preparation for the ascent and rendezvous.

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Meanwhile, the command module Columbia and her lone pilot keep a silent vigil in orbit. The CMP receives no Presidential phone calls, airs no television footage, and is afforded few, if any thoughts by most people back home. Still, he inherits a different kind of reward; as he passes behind the Moon, the CMP becomes the most isolated person in all of history. Nobody can contact him, and he has nothing but a few inches of hull and insulation to separate him from the unfathomable emptiness of space. As he passes into lunar darkness, the pilot witnesses the majesty of the stars, unmarred by light pollution or smog. Familiar constellations are obscured by yet more stars hitherto unseen, and the great void reveals itself to this one chosen soul.

Remember to love your CMPs, folks.

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Back on the surface, Eagle roars skyward once again, accelerating towards its rendezvous with Columbia and the conclusion of the mission. The exhaust from the APS batters the flag and blows the discarded camera to the ground.

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The ascent goes smoothly, and the Sea of Tranquility soon recedes to a distant splotch on the horizon.

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Three orbits later, Eagle appears outside Columbia's windows again, and is captured in a sobering photograph which will become one of the icons of the mission. Here, every person who has ever lived is captured in frame, with the lone exception of the photographer himself.

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Soon, however, the thoughtful reflection gives way to joy, as the three crewmen are reunited. Regolith samples and excess consumables are loaded into the command module, while waste and superfluous equipment is deposited in the LM. Eagle is then jettisoned, its  role complete.

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Shortly after this, the crew photographs their landing site from orbit, displaying the scene of the first manned exploration beyond Earth.

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One SPS burn later and Columbia is on its way home, set for a Pacific splashdown in two and a half days.

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And so the mission comes to a triumphant end with another landing, ironically much rougher than the lunar touchdown itself. It has been said that while Apollo is a fine spacecraft, it makes a poor boat.

 

I'm trying to brush up on my creative writing a bit, so if you actually read this far I'd love to know how I did. If this stylistic AAR doesn't go over well I can always return to shorter, more direct reports.

 

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8 minutes ago, pTrevTrevs said:

Remember to love your CMPs, folks.

Always. Never forgetti. IIRC though, in the days where Apollo was expected to continue to at least 20, and maybe beyond, Slayton had intended to rotate some CMPs to commander slots to give them an opportunity to walk on the moon, and Collins was indeed offered the backup commander slot on 14, which would have lead him to command 17, but he refused because he wanted to retire and spend time with his family. Dick Gordon was in line to command 18 as he was the backup commander for 15, but sadly that got cancelled. Stuart Roosa was another likely contender to command a landing, probably 20.

Edited by TaintedLion
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2 hours ago, Starhelperdude said:

would the cancelled apollo CSMs have the same experiments in the SIM bay as apollo 17?

18, 19, and 20 were all considered J-type missions, so they definitely would have had something in the SIM bay. It could have been same as any of the ones that flown, or it could have been something different entirely.

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