[1.12.5] Bluedog Design Bureau - Stockalike Saturn, Apollo, and more! (v1.13.0 "Забытый" 13/Aug/2023)

[CobaltWolf]

[GoldForest]

1 hour ago, CobaltWolf said:

Where banana peel?

[Zorg]

On 2/22/2023 at 11:21 AM, Hydragaming said:

Ok, I want to preface this by saying that I'm reasonably new to modern KSP and picked it up to ease myself into the system in preparation for KSP 2. Previously, I had played on like 1.9 or something so please excuse me if this sort of info is in an obvious place.

 

I have cobbled together a Voyager Mars mission (at least I think) and was looking into how to launch this thing when I found an article that said the probe was meant to be double launched on a Saturn V and the unofficial Wiki corroborates this, as well as the parts in-game (the Dual Payload Truss and Dual Payload Fairing pieces). My question is, the info I found has nothing on what it was meant to be launched  alongside! Is it supposed to be 2 full stacks (orbiter and lander) of the same block? One Block 1 and one Upgrade? I couldn't find any info anywhere, which is really driving me up the wall lol. Does anyone know or have any info/docs on the proposal?

Thanks in advance!

https://imgur.com/a/JzaDbZV

Two identical probes. The upgrades were to be for future missions. There's documents on Nasa's NTRS if you really want to dig into it, you can find these on NTRS by searching for the prefix number

There were separate contractor proposals for the orbiter and the capsule/lander. You can find the others on NTRS as well. I modelled the TRW orbiter and an older internal design from JPL called VPE-14 for the lander (its harder to get info on that but its the coolest looking one).

I would highly recommend this article by David SF Portree for an overview

http://spaceflighthistory.blogspot.com/2019/02/the-first-voyager-1967.html

 

 

Edited February 23, 2023 by Zorg

[Hydragaming]

2 hours ago, Zorg said:

Two identical probes. The upgrades were to be for future missions. There's documents on Nasa's NTRS if you really want to dig into it, you can find these on NTRS by searching for the prefix number

This is an utter goldmine!! Thanks a million for the help and references!

Edited February 23, 2023 by Hydragaming
Trimming Quote

[CobaltWolf]

8 hours ago, GoldForest said:

Where banana peel?

No banana peel

[GoldForest]

3 minutes ago, CobaltWolf said:

No banana peel

Add banana please?

[Royalswissarmyknife]

wen banana

[NovaSuper]

banana

[septemberWaves]

The banana peel would be a nice extra detail, but it looks like it'd be a lot of work to add for something that's ultimately just a launch pad decoration. And, now that I think about it, launch pad decorations are more the domain of Modular Launch Pads anyway.

Edited February 23, 2023 by septemberWaves

[GoldForest]

10 hours ago, septemberWaves said:

The banana peel would be a nice extra detail, but it looks like it'd be a lot of work to add for something that's ultimately just a launch pad decoration. And, now that I think about it, launch pad decorations are more the domain of Modular Launch Pads anyway.

Could be a texture switch on the tank, doesn't have to be a part. 

[Pappystein]

So it is funny,    I have all the sources I thought I needed for Minotaur 1... instead I can now write intelligibly about Minuteman I II and III.

So while we wait for KSP 2 to release in 25 minutes... I will leave you with this thought.    Where has all the modern published history gone? 

 

[Pappystein]

On 2/22/2023 at 11:32 PM, CobaltWolf said:

This looks really awesome


In reading the several books I now own on the Minuteman, it had an interesting design history.  The M55 and M56 stages both had serious construction issues when the Minuteman I was in development.   All three stages original had Quad exhaust  and only the 3rd stage was low enough thrust/pressure on the quad gimbals to NOT EJECT the gimbals themselves as rocket Exhaust.   Truly the M55 and M56 stages were DESIGNED to RUD totally on accident.

Thus when the slightly strengthened M55 and M56 were approved for service, it was with a lower thrust level than initially designed.     The So called Minuteman IA resulted.   Range was short by almost 1000km from designed with the same payload.

The Minuteman IB was further strengthened and with the Minuteman IA payload was closer to design spec (but still not there.   The Aerojet M56 was troublesome to re-design...   By this time the payload mass had increased so the range remained about the same.

Minuteman II has the M55 and M57 of Minuteman I with a new second stage the Aerojet SR19-AJ-1 which was made from titanium to save mass and had a new LIQUID INJECTION TVC system with a single exhaust nozzle.      The SR19 allowed either even more payload or the planned range of the original Minuteman I missile.   It is not fair to blame just Aerojet for the lack of range as the Thiokol and Hercules sections (the M55 and M57) Both had their own problems.  

Minuteman III has an updated M57 for the 3rd stage a new Solid state Guidance and Control Unit and between these two features further increased the payload capability (including MIRV) or the range.  

 

 

Minotaur I is a Minuteman II's first and 2nd stage combined with the Orion 50XL, the Orion 38 and a HAPS terminal stage (all from Pegasus XL)

Minotaur IL is a Minotar I, with out the Orion 38 or HAPS and it is commonly used for Strategic defense target launches

Minotaur II is a full up Minuteman II without the Minuteman II's GCU or payload bus... the end is replaced with a strategic defense target

Minotaur C, also know as Taurus is a kinda hodgepodge between the CASTOR-120 and the Minotaur I's/Pegasus XL rocket stack of Orion50XL, Orion 38 and HAPS...  

Minotaur III is a LGM-118 Peacekeeper MX without the final stage  Again Strategic defense and Hypersonic suborbitals only

Minotaur IV is already in game and we know it is a Minotaur III with some Star rockets on top

 

 

[Entr8899]

Now that it's already been established that KSP 2 is a critically panned disaster, is it safe to assume the move over to modding exclusively on KSP 2 won't happen any time soon?

[Beccab]

10 minutes ago, Entr8899 said:

Now that it's already been established that KSP 2 is a critically panned disaster, is it safe to assume the move over to modding exclusively on KSP 2 won't happen any time soon?

Please stop

[Gargamel]

37 minutes ago, Entr8899 said:

Now that it's already been established that KSP 2 is a critically panned disaster, is it safe to assume the move over to modding exclusively on KSP 2 won't happen any time soon?

Yes because being live for an hour is a disaster.    Any further comments like this will be considered off topic for thread and removed.  

[AdrianDogmeat]

Titan III CT3 Medium - Intelsat 904

Edited February 24, 2023 by AdrianDogmeat

[Gargamel]

A number of posts have been removed for being off topic.   KSP2 material belongs in the   KSP2 section.   Responding to off topic material really doesn’t belong anywhere. 

[Saturn1234]

Would you recommend any good tech tree mod for BDB?

 

EDIT: I found The Skyhawk Science System

Edited February 25, 2023 by Saturn1234

[DaveyJ576]

Since Titan seems to be the Topic du Jour, I thought I would post some images and info of the Greatest Rocket Ever Flown^TM_.  

An ICBM has to be protected at its launch site or it becomes very vulnerable to attack. The Atlas program instituted the coffin style launcher, where the vehicle was stored in a horizontal position on a rotatable launcher inside a semi-hardened building. To launch, the roof was rolled back, the vehicle and launch base rotated to vertical, the rocket was fueled, and the go button was pushed.

Spoiler

This system was mechanically complex, placed undesirable stresses on the vehicle, and was still too vulnerable to attack as a large portion of the launcher housing was above ground. Storing the missile vertically inside an underground "silo" came to be the preferred method, but there was a considerable amount of concern that the blast and acoustic effects of lighting a rocket engine inside an enclosed tube would adversely affect the vehicle. Atlas in particular, with its pressure stabilized structure, would not hold up in that environment.

The solution was to simply store the vehicle in the silo, but raise it up above the ground prior to firing.

Spoiler

This method required the vehicle to be mounted to a rather complex elevator system that raised it and a stabilizer tower up above the ground prior to launch. The launch sequence was equally complex. If the missile was on alert status, the RP-1 fuel would be loaded. It was stable at ambient temperatures and thus could remain in the missile for a long period of time. When a launch order was received, the LOX was fast loaded while the missile was still in the silo. Once LOX loading was complete, the massive silo doors would be opened and the elevator engaged. Once the launch table was fully above ground the final launch countdown was started and the missile was fired. Total time from receiving the launch order to missile away: 15 minutes.  Atlas F missiles were also silo based and their launch sequence and time was similar to the Titan I.

There were obvious liabilities with this method. It took way too long to raise and fire the missile, making it vulnerable to incoming enemy ICBMs and bombers. The sequence could not be initiated if there were any nearby detonations with their associated blast effects, and similar to the coffin launchers it was mechanically complex. In one test on 15 October 1960 a Titan I missile was undergoing a wet dress rehearsal at the Operational Suitability Test Facility (OSTF) at Vandenberg AFB. The fully RP-1/LOX loaded missile (dummy warhead) was raised up on the platform. Upon completion of the test the lowering sequence was begun. Shortly thereafter the mechanism failed and the missile with its launch platform fell back into the silo and exploded. The blast was so powerful that a five ton piece of wreckage landed 1200 feet away. The silo was completely destroyed.

It was well understood that this was not the perfect basing method. A parallel effort was undertaken to develop a true "fire from the hole" capability of launching the missile directly from the silo. This was not a possibility with the Atlas F, but it was felt that the Titan I could be adapted for this new method.  A separate silo was built at the OSTF to test this concept. Before the first Titan I was launched from an elevator silo, and several months before the first Minuteman, a test of this new method was conducted. On 03 May 1961 Titan I VS-1 was launched directly from an underground silo at the OSTF and the test was entirely successful.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSZC4ol8va0&t=436s

It was initially thought that the Titan I would be transitioned to silo launch, but this was deferred to the follow-on Titan II. All operational Titan I missiles were based in elevator silos. Prior to becoming operational, many Titan I vehicles were test fired from LC-15, LC-16, LC-19, and LC-20 at Cape Canaveral and from several pads at Vandenberg. It was a good looking vehicle, and despite being relatively short lived, it remains one of my favorites. Below is a recreation of one of those test launches from Vandy.

On the pad and the launch:

Spoiler

Staging!

Spoiler

 

Second stage flight

Spoiler

"Reentry Vehicle" separation.

Spoiler

 

[Blufor878]

Energia Saturn. It's @Rutabaga22's fault!

[Ultim32]

1 hour ago, Blufor878 said:

Energia Saturn. It's @Rutabaga22's fault!

Would you be able to do a saturn v first stage with an energia on top?

[Blufor878]

1 hour ago, Ultim32 said:

Would you be able to do a saturn v first stage with an energia on top?

Maybe? That might be a bit much...

Stay tuned.

[Ultim32]

2 minutes ago, Blufor878 said:

Maybe? That might be a bit much...

Stay tuned.

After seeing the masterpieces that you create, my request wouldn't even be close to too much!

[nrum7366]

Hi, I need a bit of help with the Ground deployable science, how does it works? 
My understanding is the same as DLC, plonk it on the ground near each other, place a control box and antenna next to it and make sure there is enought power. is this correct? as it seems to me that the DLC control box is not capatible with BDB deployable science. 

[Blufor878]

45 minutes ago, Ultim32 said:

After seeing the masterpieces that you create, my request wouldn't even be close to too much!

Why are y'all like this (for the record I'm including myself).