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[1.12.5] Bluedog Design Bureau - Stockalike Saturn, Apollo, and more! (v1.12.0 "Песок" 13/Jan/2023)


CobaltWolf
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By using the HL20 Parts Pack:

i have been able to make a sweet lookin' Dream Chaser... 

Spoiler

sH7HGle.png

VBxZL4x.png

 

On a side note I haven't been able to play with BDB much recently due to the joys of switching internet providers so I'm looking forward to try the new Gemini parts when on the dev branch !

 

 

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On 4/10/2020 at 3:37 AM, Teslamax said:

I have a contract "Perform Solar Telescope Mount Observations while docked with Station Beta".  I assume this refers to the Kane-OCO Telescope Mount on the station.

This station is in LKO under JNSQ.

There are three science activities available for this part:

EXPERIMENT RESULT
"Log Observation Data"

Message shown, "Infrared Telescope can't be done right now."

 

"Start Object Tracking" Message shown, "The SENTINEL Infrared Telescope needs to be activated on a solar orbit."
"Take Solar Photography" standard science window appears

 

I tried Googling for this issue but couldn't find anything.

A search of the forum for this message was also fruitless.

  • KSP 1.8.1
  • BDB 1.6.2_hotfix_2 (CKAN)
  • DMModuleScienceAnimateGeneric v0.22

Game log here.

 

 

Just to confirm, the contract is indeed referring to the Solar Photography experiment on the Kane OCO telescope. This experiment is internally named bd_atm and is only available on this part. So the question is, does the part fail to do the science, or does the contract you got fail to complete?

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Re: Titan and photos looking sorta like the core is ground-lit:

IIRC Smoke fills the engine bells and then scatters light from the SRB plumes as it leaves.

On every solid-boosted Titan, the core was air-lit just before booster burnout.

Edited by blowfish
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New to the forums, so if there is an easier way to search for a specific parts request, or to see if there is already a mod out there, please point me in the right direction.

I was wanting to know if there are any plans on creating inline docking adapters for the mk1 and mk2 fuselage sections that are compatible with the CADS ports.  I am not seeing any existing parts when I try to search for these.

Edited by hardline
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1 hour ago, hardline said:

New to the forums, so if there is an easier way to search for a specific parts request, or to see if there is already a mod out there, please point me in the right direction.

I was wanting to know if there are any plans on creating inline docking adapters for the mk1 and mk2 fuselage sections that are compatible with the CADS ports.  I am not seeing any existing parts when I try to search for these.

The CADS ports are quite old and haven't seen any development in a while, and the aim of BDB is mainly to recreate historical stuff, so I wouldn't count on it.

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On 4/11/2020 at 3:30 AM, biohazard15 said:

I guess Atlas-Centaur fairings are coming along with (possible) Centaur revamp? Seems these are the only thing that is left in BDB-SAF lineup.

Theres still some niche stuff left but yes Atlas Centaur is the main significant one remaining and will happen when the Centaur revamp begins so that I know what the interfaces will be like. Luckily it seems the SLV3B fairing was the basis for atlas centaur so a lot of the work is already done.

You can see the roadmap here.

https://github.com/CobaltWolf/Bluedog-Design-Bureau/issues/844

 

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35 minutes ago, Zorg said:

Theres still some niche stuff left but yes Atlas Centaur is the main significant one remaining and will happen when the Centaur revamp begins so that I know what the interfaces will be like. Luckily it seems the SLV3B fairing was the basis for atlas centaur so a lot of the work is already done.

You can see the roadmap here.

https://github.com/CobaltWolf/Bluedog-Design-Bureau/issues/844

Hmm, no Saturn fairings? 

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7 hours ago, hardline said:

New to the forums, so if there is an easier way to search for a specific parts request, or to see if there is already a mod out there, please point me in the right direction.

I was wanting to know if there are any plans on creating inline docking adapters for the mk1 and mk2 fuselage sections that are compatible with the CADS ports.  I am not seeing any existing parts when I try to search for these.

if you want a more modern version of the CADS port i recommend Benjee's habtech mod

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4 hours ago, Zorg said:

I'm reluctant to do Saturn fairings until the Saturn revamp, whenever that may be.

/sigh...   Fair enough.   I figured that was why Saturn was not on the list so I hadn't asked.   And Sadly, It TOTALLY makes sense given the scope and breadth of a Saturn Revamp.   But could we request one of these fairings on a 3.75 BDB plate (not a Saturn specific Fairing, but rather just re-use one of the existing fairings like say Titan IV?)

EDITED....  Or since I just saw that you are planning on a 3.125-3.75m PLF for LDC, could that 3.75m Fairing be on a 3.75m plate as well? 

 

Edited by Pappystein
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6 minutes ago, Pappystein said:

/sigh...   Fair enough.   I figured that was why Saturn was not on the list so I hadn't asked.   And Sadly, It TOTALLY makes sense given the scope and breadth of a Saturn Revamp.   But could we request one of these fairings on a 3.75 BDB plate (not a Saturn specific Fairing, but rather just re-use one of the existing fairings like say Titan IV?)

 

So LDC is going to get a 3.125m to 3.5m adapter (either a boattail part or built into the fairing) to use the Atlas V fairing.

In addition to which I had the notion of doing a 3.125m to 3.75m LDC fairing (which is on that roadmap).

I would probably do it as a trisector in this style although going from 3.125m to 3.75m it will have a more pronounced flare than the source image.

Three-banger Titan – The Unwanted Blog

If I make this it would not be too much trouble to adapt the 3.75m upper section into a generic 3.75m fairing base.

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Just wanted to say a big "thank you" to everyone who contributes to this mod. I just flew a Surveyor-type mission, using an Atlas-Centaur (MMMB), the Surveyor probe from Coatl, and using KSRSS. This was definitely the closest I've come to any real mission, and it was a lot of fun! The dV worked out perfectly with this build. KSRSS isn't perfect but it's so nice having the real solar system (despite the fact that I remain utterly baffled by planetary inclination). 

 

 

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Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap 

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Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap  Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap  Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap 

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On 4/12/2020 at 12:11 AM, sslaptnhablhat said:

The CADS ports are quite old and haven't seen any development in a while, and the aim of BDB is mainly to recreate historical stuff, so I wouldn't count on it.

In ETS CADS were androgynous versions of the real-life CBM and should have been 1.25m in-game. (Common Androgynous Docking System)

I believe the models were originally identical to the APAS used in BDB and have stayed that way.

If you look at the gallery images for ETS you'll notice that CADS also differ from APAS in that they have 4 petals instead of 3.fetch.php?w=750&tok=7ccefb&media=timelinfetch.php?w=750&tok=acdb92&media=timelin

Edited by Teslamax
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On 4/11/2020 at 9:25 AM, Morphisor said:

Just to confirm, the contract is indeed referring to the Solar Photography experiment on the Kane OCO telescope. This experiment is internally named bd_atm and is only available on this part. So the question is, does the part fail to do the science, or does the contract you got fail to complete?

I have transferred such observations to the capsule and returned it.

Since it failed to complete I assumed it was because I used the wrong science instrument.

I have retrieved science from this instrument before but I forgot what the exact text of that contract was.

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27 minutes ago, Teslamax said:

I have transferred such observations to the capsule and returned it.

Since it failed to complete I assumed it was because I used the wrong science instrument.

I have retrieved science from this instrument before but I forgot what the exact text of that contract was.

Sounds like a contract issue then. I may be able to help figure out what's wrong, but the specific contract info is needed then.

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4 hours ago, Teslamax said:

 

In ETS CADS were androgynous versions of the real-life CBM and should have been 1.25m in-game. (Common Androgynous Docking System)

I believe the models were originally identical to the APAS used in BDB and have stayed that way.

If you look at the gallery images for ETS you'll notice that CADS also differ from APAS in that they have 4 petals instead of 3.

Eh, CMB IRL is 50" in diameter which is 1.27m.   In KSP scale (x 0.64) would be SLIGHTLY smaller than 0.9375m (at 0.8128m.)    So at the scales used in BDB, 0.9375 is about PERFECT size (maybe slightly small but closer to correct than 0.625 or 1.25m.)      Now a lot of mods use 1.25 and that is fine... But, unless their parts use the same scale factor... the CMB/APAS/CADS/WhateverYouWantToCallIt ends up looking HUGE.   Checking the web I found the Dimensions of the most modern iteration (the US designed IDA which updates the existing APAS-95 on the ISS to the new NDS or IDSS system.  1.6m to the outer skin of the extension which is actually BIGGER than the docking port by about a decimeter  1.6x0.64= 1.024m....   1.5x.64 = 0.9375....  So for ISS type docking ports the physical part should be on the 0.9375m size (by math.)

While CADS is part of the Eyes Turned Skyward Alt timeline it is basically an APAS-75 with minor changes.

 

Now my opinion:

Spoiler

While the APAS ports hold up well.  They leave a lot to be desired. 

Pros of the existing parts:

  • Graphically they hold up well to the current Standards of the Saturn parts.   However that is an old standard to go by.
  • They look/feel more real than most docking ports
  • They DO work as designed
  • They are a semi accurate representation of the APAS-89...... a Soviet Design :)

Now the Cons:

  • The particular part is a Soviet APAS-89 (even matching much of the coloring and iconography)
  • No easy Visual indication of UP (or zero degree position)
  • The colliders do guide the docking port to "proper" orientation but it is such a hard adjustment that if the ship is just a little off it will look docked but not actually Dock
  • Very hard to work with to plan your Station in the VAB.

Final thoughts:  I do NOT think the APAS needs any major changes... except graphically a easy to see in VAB contrasted section to denote "up" would be appreciated...   However it IS a APAS-89 and not the US APAS (4 petals OUTSIDE the docking area) nor is it the newer APAS-95 or CMB or CAD.  

APAS-75 has a huge issue when used on the Apollo Command Module.  Simply the shield for the Escape tower would have 4 "tynes" of the Docking adapter poking through and be very visible. (and drag causing given the colliders it would need.)

In the Future, should Cobaltwolf wish to tackle a new Docking-port for Apollo or Alt-history builds, I would recommend that APAS-89 be replaced by either APAS-75 or IDSS.   Sure the latter is a 2010s invention, but it is the most appropriate for alternate history and gives "growth room" in-case the future of the BDB jumps into the Future.

 

Edited by Pappystein
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8 hours ago, sslaptnhablhat said:

@CobaltWolf Do you eventually plan on redoing the Delta III adapter tank to match the style of the new Thor/Delta tanks?

It will happen at some point, yeah. Just haven't gotten around to it. I also want to try and bully Zorg into doing it so I don't have to

 

5 hours ago, Teslamax said:

In ETS CADS were androgynous versions of the real-life CBM and should have been 1.25m in-game. (Common Androgynous Docking System)

I believe the models were originally identical to the APAS used in BDB and have stayed that way.

If you look at the gallery images for ETS you'll notice that CADS also differ from APAS in that they have 4 petals instead of 3.

1 hour ago, Pappystein said:

Eh, CMB IRL is 50" in diameter which is 1.27m.   In KSP scale (x 0.64) would be SLIGHTLY smaller than 0.9375m (at 0.8128m.)    So at the scales used in BDB, 0.9375 is about PERFECT size (maybe slightly small but closer to correct than 0.625 or 1.25m.)      Now a lot of mods use 1.25 and that is fine... But, unless their parts use the same scale factor... the CMB/APAS/CADS/WhateverYouWantToCallIt ends up looking HUGE.   Checking the web I found the Dimensions of the most modern iteration (the US designed IDA which updates the existing APAS-95 on the ISS to the new NDS or IDSS system.  1.6m to the outer skin of the extension which is actually BIGGER than the docking port by about a decimeter  1.6x0.64= 1.024m....   1.5x.64 = 0.9375....  So for ISS type docking ports the physical part should be on the 0.9375m size (by math.)

While CADS is part of the Eyes Turned Skyward Alt timeline it is basically an APAS-75 with minor changes.

Now my opinion:

Ancient history at this point that might help explain things - our "CADS" ports are borrowed from the old CX Aerospace mod and are, in fact, APAS ports or whatever.

At this rate I assume I'd have to remake them proper some day but idk. I don't have any intention of making the rest of Freedom, but on the other hand we have the later Apollo versions...

I believe @Beale recently made an APAS-75 for Tantares?

Who knew Gemini had so much crap sticking out of it?

HTcbHWr.png

 

Heatshield will have a toggleable MOL hatch (doesn't really affect gameplay but its there)

VKoDpYX.png


This is mostly just to give an idea of what's visible once the docking port is jettisoned (parachute bag removed for clarity)

bhcTZC9.png

 

 

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