[1.8.0-1.12.5] AtmosphereAutopilot 1.6.1

[Boris-Barboris]

2 minutes ago, mor128 said:

I tried using Fly-By-Wire with a single engine prop craft. The torque of the engine seems to be amplified by the autopilot and the craft rolls with maximum roll rate until I disable the autopilot.

Is there a way to fix this?

Not at this moment. Blades are assumed to be part of the craft and take part in the math, breaking assumptions.

Is this DLC prop or some mod?

[mor128]

Ah I see. They're the breaking grounds parts.

[Beetlecat]

Shoot -- yeah -- the BG parts aren't being treated as distinct powerplants, just flapping/spinning bits of plane.

[vardicd]

@Boris-Barboris A quick question if i may, is it likely that this mod would have problems working with the mods Ground effect and correctcol? both of them have some effects on flight models and flight effects, as i understand them, and I didn't know if this mod would be able to accept those changes or would need the pure stock aerodynamics to function correctly. Also sorry if this has been asked before and I didn't see the answers 

 

[Boris-Barboris]

5 minutes ago, vardicd said:

@Boris-Barboris A quick question if i may, is it likely that this mod would have problems working with the mods Ground effect and correctcol? both of them have some effects on flight models and flight effects, as i understand them, and I didn't know if this mod would be able to accept those changes or would need the pure stock aerodynamics to function correctly. Also sorry if this has been asked before and I didn't see the answers 

 

Ground effect should shake you a little bit when the lift rises rapidly, but I wouldn't expect AA to break. Just try it, because I didn't.

CorrectCol doesn't change anything in-flight.

[vardicd]

Just now, Boris-Barboris said:

Ground effect should shake you a little bit when the lift rises rapidly, but I wouldn't expect AA to break. Just try it, because I didn't.

CorrectCol doesn't change anything in-flight.

Okay, thanks for the reply. 

[vardicd]

It does work.

Important note, however, cruise control flight uses height above sea level, not height above terrain. May the kraken have mercy upon poor Helena. She was my best test pilot. 

[vardicd]

OMG how did i ever fly planes without this mod. How did i never see this before!?

[Tahvohck]

What's going on with the difference in flight performance for drones vs pilots? I thought this was just because my drone planes were small, but even small piloted planes are stable, while small drone planes wobble all over the place. I've even tested this by putting a command seat on a drone plane and suddenly it's stable.

[Boris-Barboris]

1 hour ago, Tahvohck said:

What's going on with the difference in flight performance for drones vs pilots? I thought this was just because my drone planes were small, but even small piloted planes are stable, while small drone planes wobble all over the place. I've even tested this by putting a command seat on a drone plane and suddenly it's stable.

There is no technical difference. You can start the investigation by thinking about other mods that may interfere with drone cores. If unsuccessfull, come back with screenshots and logs.

[Tahvohck]

You're correct. This is an interaction with RemoteTech.

The only mods in this save are Remote Tech, Atmospheric Autopilot, and Module Manager. Without Remote Tech, this plane flies stable. With Remote Tech, the plane flies with rapid oscillations. A 10 microsecond delay probably shouldn't cause these oscillations by itself, which means this is an issue with how AA sends commands to the vessel. Remote Tech has an API that allows bypass of the signal delay, which this mod appears not to be hooking into (and should be, given its purpose). I couldn't find RemoteTech.API referenced in your github, so "fixing" this oscillation should just mean hooking into the Remote Tech API and registering a sanctioned pilot.

[vardicd]

31 minutes ago, Tahvohck said:

 {Stares with annoyed disbelief at image} I have been playing this game, for years. Not once. Not one time, did it occur to me, to make a flying drone. I can not even begin to fathom how much lighter, faster, safer, and more fuel efficient I could have been doing this, all this time. 

Lets build a plane, fly it all over kerbin, collect science, have to make it a crewed craft, pump that weight up, risk those lives! 

Sometimes, I feel so stupid. Tahvohck, I'm stealing this idea. 

[Boris-Barboris]

5 hours ago, Tahvohck said:

Remote Tech has an API that allows bypass of the signal delay, which this mod appears not to be hooking into (and should be, given its purpose). I couldn't find RemoteTech.API referenced in your github, so "fixing" this oscillation should just mean hooking into the Remote Tech API and registering a sanctioned pilot.

Sorry guys, but I'll pass. Will accept PR though.

[Tahvohck]

 You know the codebase a lot better than me, but I'll dig through and see if I can find the correct place to hook in.

[Tahvohck]

I'm able to hook it into RemoteTech, but for some reason that completely destroys the feedback loop that AA uses. I'm not sure where I'd even start to look for troubleshooting that. You might still get a pull request from me at some point, but it won't be any time soon, since programatically dealing with FlightCtrlStates isn't something I know how to do. 

In the meantime, the oscillations aren't so bad that they aren't manageable.

[Boris-Barboris]

11 minutes ago, Tahvohck said:

I'm able to hook it into RemoteTech, but for some reason that completely destroys the feedback loop that AA uses. I'm not sure where I'd even start to look for troubleshooting that. You might still get a pull request from me at some point, but it won't be any time soon, since programatically dealing with FlightCtrlStates isn't something I know how to do. 

In the meantime, the oscillations aren't so bad that they aren't manageable.

https://github.com/Boris-Barboris/AtmosphereAutopilot/blob/master/AtmosphereAutopilot/Models/FlightModel/FlightModel.cs#L58

https://github.com/Boris-Barboris/AtmosphereAutopilot/blob/master/AtmosphereAutopilot/Modules/TopModuleManager.cs#L94

 

AA's module order:

flight model's onPreAtopilot ->  top module manager's ApplyControl -> flight model's onPostAutopilot.

I guess you'll have to call all three from the callback you pass to remotetech, while also ensuring they will not be called again in the same fixedupdate by stock ksp code.

 

[Tahvohck]

Hm. I'll look into that.

[vardicd]

@Tahvohck Drone planes are definitely the way to go, of course I've gotten the design so stable and safe now I'm using them as short range passenger drones:

@Boris-Barboris  I discovered an ... unfortunate hot-key confluence. It seems that the shift-P to toggle the autopilot GUI on and off is also the stock hot-key for deploying kerbal parachutes while on eva, or in a chair on a drone airplane.... If you should happen to feel up to it, adding a caution line to the opening post about that little, unfortunate overlap, might save someone else's planes and kerbals from explosive unplanned disassembly midair because of unexpected parachute deployment.... 

EDIT: correction, it's just P doesn't have to be shift. pressing P at all, will deploy personal parachutes.

Edited February 19, 2020 by vardicd

[vardicd]

By the way, Have I mentioned how amazing this mod is?

Spoiler

 

 

I've never managed to get a plane to fly this high, this straight, this smoothly, this easily! before. 

[Boris-Barboris]

1 hour ago, vardicd said:

I discovered an ... unfortunate hot-key confluence. It seems that the shift-P to toggle the autopilot GUI on and off is also the stock hot-key for deploying kerbal parachutes while on eva, or in a chair on a drone airplane.... If you should happen to feel up to it, adding a caution line to the opening post about that little, unfortunate overlap, might save someone else's planes and kerbals from explosive unplanned disassembly midair because of unexpected parachute deployment.... 

EDIT: correction, it's just P doesn't have to be shift. pressing P at all, will deploy personal parachutes.

GameData/AtmosphereAutopilot/global_settings.txt
master_switch_key

[vardicd]

1 minute ago, Boris-Barboris said:

GameData/AtmosphereAutopilot/global_settings.txt
master_switch_key

Oh, yeah I've already adjusted the keybind for myself, I didn't mean that as a demand for, how do i fix, or you should fix this, that wasn't my intention at all, sorry if that wasn't clear. I was only posting as a courtesy warning for others who like myself might not have realized that the P key was also a hotkey for personal parachutes, and also letting you know, so that should you feel generous, a word of caution could be added to the front post, not as a demand that you do so. again sorry if any of that was misunderstood.

[Hotel26]

1 hour ago, vardicd said:

it's just P doesn't have to be shift. pressing P at all, will deploy personal parachutes

I ran into this, but since I was very accustomed to P for the a/p, and chutes were brand new, I rewired chutes to 'Y' using KSP's own key-binding settings.  Worked for me.

Edited February 19, 2020 by Hotel26

[Stone Blue]

@Boris-Barboris Hi... just wondering if there are any *KNOWN* issues/incompatabilities with using this mod *and* Kramax Autopilot in the same install... vOv
I read back a couple pages in this thread, but didnt see anything...
 

 

[Boris-Barboris]

1 minute ago, Stone Blue said:

*KNOWN* issues/incompatabilities

Not that i'm aware of, just don't activate them both. At the worst some hotkeys may intersect.

[Stone Blue]

1 minute ago, Boris-Barboris said:

Not that i'm aware of, just don't activate them both. At the worst some hotkeys may intersect.

OK.. kewl... thanx for the quick reply... I may end up trying both in the same install... If I come across any incompatabilites, I'll be sure to post back