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I would like to extend an HABITAT object (similar to a telescope)


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hi all, need little help to fix an issue.

Perhaps there is no answer to this problem, at least I'm grateful for any feedback.
- in short.
I would like to extend an object (similar to a telescope)
Now the problem is the 'node_stack_top ".. the changes after the animation UP - the parts originally fitted to overwrite.

- Would be the solution the attached parts are brought with the telescopic movement upwards.

cheers :)


 

* start postion 1

------ (A part. Eg. Decoupler or ship)
[ [] ] "Node_stack_top"
 


 

* postion 2 (after animation)

 [ ]   docking.module (after animation)
------ (Decoupler still here ..)
[   ] "Node_stack_top"

 

 

* desired solution (after animation P 2. )

------ (Decoupler or ship now here ..)

 [ ]   docking.module (after animation)
[   ] "Node_stack_top"



- Attached image gallery with problem detail description.

 


* config *  --- node definitions ---

 

Spoiler

 

// --- node definitions ---

// definition format is Position X, Position Y, Position Z, Up X, Up Y, Up Z

node_stack_top    = 0.0, 1.325, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 1
node_stack_bottom = 0.0, -1.322, 0.0, 0.0, -1.0, 0.0, 1

bulkheadProfiles = size1, size1

 

TechRequired = start
entryCost = 0
cost = 650

category     = Pods
subcategory  = 0
title        = LBSI HABITAT Portofino RB-8
manufacturer = LeBeau Space Industries
description  =

// attachment rules: stack, srfAttach, allowStack, allowSrfAttach,allowCollision
   attachRules = 1,1,1,1,0

 

Edited by RaendyLeBeau
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On 1.1.2016 at 8:35 PM, RaendyLeBeau said:

Hi, I would like to introduce my next Project.

I would love to create a bigger Habitat module.

- is an access to IVA possible with inflatable habitats ? - how it works ?

- maybe there are other plugins or maybe come with the next version of a KSP stock Access Control ... That would be just great

 

Thank you all in advance!

cheers !

Hello,

you had me written on the Tantares thread.

On the subject of IVA's, I can not give any information. I use for my part so far only Tantares or standard IVA's. Wait for KSP 1.1 with what probably better tools and opportunities for IVA-design should appear.

At least the outer access (Airlock) you can prevent by UNITY animation of the object. Hide the Airlock (Hatch) just in the central object and move it to the intended position during the Habitat is inflated.

The further work on my habitat I have discontinued due to lack of feedback.

Edited by hraban
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17 minutes ago, hraban said:

At least the outer access (Airlock) you can prevent by UNITY animation of the object. Hide the Airlock (Hatch) just in the central object and move it to the intended position during the Habitat is inflated.

HI hraban

- first many thanks for the Notes.
perhaps you could have a few times if times Unity screenshots Post. would certainly help me. !!  :)

thank you !

cheers, reandy

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  • 3 weeks later...

hi all, need little help to fix an issue.

Perhaps there is no answer to this problem, at least I'm grateful for any feedback.
- in short.
I would like to extend an object (similar to a telescope)
Now the problem is the 'node_stack_top ".. the changes after the animation UP - the parts originally fitted to overwrite.

- Would be the solution the attached parts (like ship or decoupler etc.) are brought with the telescopic movement upwards.


lSN78xX.png


 

Spoiler

 

* start postion 1

------ (A part. Eg. Decoupler or ship)
[ [] ] "Node_stack_top"
 


 

* postion 2 (after animation)

 [ ]   docking.module (after animation)
------ (Decoupler still here ..)
[   ] "Node_stack_top"

 

 

* desired solution (after animation P 2. )

------ (Decoupler or ship now here ..)

 [ ]   docking.module (after animation)
[   ] "Node_stack_top"

 


- Attached image gallery with problem detail description.


* config *  --- node definitions ---


 

Spoiler

 

// --- node definitions ---

// definition format is Position X, Position Y, Position Z, Up X, Up Y, Up Z

node_stack_top    = 0.0, 1.325, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 1
node_stack_bottom = 0.0, -1.322, 0.0, 0.0, -1.0, 0.0, 1

bulkheadProfiles = size1, size1

 

TechRequired = start
entryCost = 0
cost = 650

category     = Pods
subcategory  = 0
title        = LBSI HABITAT Portofino RB-8
manufacturer = LeBeau Space Industries
description  =

// attachment rules: stack, srfAttach, allowStack, allowSrfAttach,allowCollision
   attachRules = 1,1,1,1,0

 

 

Edited by RaendyLeBeau
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The first half of your question is a pretty easy answer - instead of defining your nodes by location in the .cfg file, define them with unity empty game objects and a NODE{} block in the .cfg file.  There are tutorials for that.  The game object can be animated and the attachment point will move with the animation.  NOW...  you get to the crummy part.  If you move your part after something is attached there...  the attached object won't move but will just float in space where it used to be.  You can't extend a docking port, dock, then retract the port and attached craft back into the hull, for example.  The docked craft will just hang awkwardly in space while the docking port retracts.

The solution to this is the Infernal Robotics plugin.  With it you can build a part that can move and take attached parts with it.  

Hope that helps!

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hi artwhaley,

oh yes, you have helped me.  :)  Thanks for the advice !

as with the "nodes" I thought somewhere I have so times in a forum.

as with the "nodes" I thought somewhere I have so times in a forum.
- So I look at times the concept "ATTACH Nodes" & "Infernal Robotics plugin" more closely.

Many Thanks !

cheers

 

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On 1/24/2016 at 7:17 PM, artwhaley said:

The first half of your question is a pretty easy answer - instead of defining your nodes by location in the .cfg file, define them with unity empty game objects and a NODE{} block in the .cfg file.  There are tutorials for that.  The game object can be animated and the attachment point will move with the animation.  NOW...  you get to the crummy part.  If you move your part after something is attached there...  the attached object won't move but will just float in space where it used to be.  You can't extend a docking port, dock, then retract the port and attached craft back into the hull, for example.  The docked craft will just hang awkwardly in space while the docking port retracts.

The solution to this is the Infernal Robotics plugin.  With it you can build a part that can move and take attached parts with it.  

Hope that helps!

Am I correct in saying that @curtquarquesso 's animated docking ports avoid this issue by leveraging the magnetic ability of docking ports, and simply animating the colliders?

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Yes, I'd say that's a correct assessment.  Though in the soft docking parts, the collider is initially positioned to KEEP the dockingNodes from touching and forming a hard seal, then the animation retracts the collider to allow them to finish touching.  It still can't animate the pieces in relationship to each other after a hard dock is achieved though, unfortunately!

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ahh  :)  thanks you all for the tips!!!

- have found the link to - awesome

 

if I understand correctly, it is possible to move through the animation Unity collider parts upwards (in Y direction) using.  :)

4xpMUO0.gif

but if I'm not mistaken, I have the animation also created in Blender that. (later exported to Unity) .. I must look again.

I have to try as soon as possible ... I'll give you a later Feedback   - 

big cheers for tips & hints !! :)

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by RaendyLeBeau
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11 hours ago, CobaltWolf said:

Am I correct in saying that @curtquarquesso 's animated docking ports avoid this issue by leveraging the magnetic ability of docking ports, and simply animating the colliders?

I believe so. Recall that to retain magnetism, the dockingNode itself can also be animated with no adverse effects as far as I know. I believe it depends on whether or not the dockingNode is set to an attach node, like the stock Clamp-O-Trons, or set to a unique node, like the stock shielded Clamp-O-Trons. @Porkjet's inflatable base hub does the same thing. The 4 radial ports on the base can be docked to, but can't be used as attach nodes in the VAB. I can't recall what happens when you deflate the base when you have stuff docked to it, but I don't think it's good... That's where the parameter to disable retraction while docked comes in handy, as is present on the stock shielded Clamp-O-Trons. The magnetism only really works when the docking ports are in acquire mode. Once docked, the parts act as they were joined in the VAB by attach nodes. 

4 hours ago, RaendyLeBeau said:

ahh  :)  thanks you all for the tips!!!

- have found the link to - awesome

if I understand correctly, it is possible to move through the animation Unity collider parts upwards (in Y direction) using.  :)

4xpMUO0.gif

but if I'm not mistaken, I have the animation also created in Blender that. (later exported to Unity) .. I must look again.

I have to try as soon as possible ... I'll give you a later Feedback   - 

big cheers for tips & hints !! :)

I'm so glad this ended up helping people out in other things. I have yet to really dive back into this stuff after all the new docking node definitions included in 1.0.5 by @NathanKell. I'm still having difficulty with finding proper plain-english documentation of what all the parameters do. I am not a smart man... The colliders can really move anywhere you want. The tricky thing is when you have an attach node that has to move. As @RaendyLeBeau said, the only way around animated attach nodes is the Infernal Robotics plugin. I have no experience with that, so I can't really be of help. That is a great idea though. 

I think the simplest solution is usually the best. That would be imitating the behavior of the stock shielded Clamp-O-Tron. The drawback is that you can't attach anything to the node you want to animated and move. The work-around would be using the infernal robotics plugin, but I think that opens up a huge can of worms. Would that then make the animation work like a servo? :huh:

Since you're working on inflatable, perhaps hit up @Porkjet and see if he's figured out a sensible way around this. He'll probably know better than anyone. As far as I know from his last inflatable dev pics, the ends of his modules don't change in length, so perhaps he's not attempting to find a work around for that issue. 

Keep this thread going. I want to find a good solution to this problem. Many inflatable mods have this issue.

 

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I've set up an IR part once, for the open source part week challenge... but that means it's all open source, so it might help!  Also IR has decent documentation on how to add it to a part, somewhere.  The open source part post is at :http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/91205-open-source-part-week-week-1-submission-thread-status-winner-announced/&do=findComment&comment=1552214


Yes, it makes the part move like a servo instead of an animation.

This has got me thinking.... I may dig into the IR code and see how it works a little.  A derivative that just used animations, but adjusted the attachment of everything to the new position when the attachment point moved would be really useful, wouldn't it?

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2 hours ago, curtquarquesso said:

I'm so glad this ended up helping people out in other things. I have yet to really dive back into this stuff after all the new docking node definitions included in 1.0.5 by @NathanKell. I'm still having difficulty with finding proper plain-english documentation of what all the parameters do. I am not a smart man... The colliders can really move anywhere you want. The tricky thing is when you have an attach node that has to move. As @RaendyLeBeau said, the only way around animated attach nodes is the Infernal Robotics plugin. I have no experience with that, so I can't really be of help. That is a great idea though. 

I think the simplest solution is usually the best. That would be imitating the behavior of the stock shielded Clamp-O-Tron. The drawback is that you can't attach anything to the node you want to animated and move. The work-around would be using the infernal robotics plugin, but I think that opens up a huge can of worms. Would that then make the animation work like a servo? :huh:

Since you're working on inflatable, perhaps hit up @Porkjet and see if he's figured out a sensible way around this. He'll probably know better than anyone. As far as I know from his last inflatable dev pics, the ends of his modules don't change in length, so perhaps he's not attempting to find a work around for that issue. 

Keep this thread going. I want to find a good solution to this problem. Many inflatable mods have this issue.

 

 

HELLO EVERYBODY,
MANY THANKS FOR THE SUPPORT. I appreciate this very much ! :)

- Feedback from the trials still follows.
(first try in unity to move the collider 'up' seem then to export the game to not work)

- That's with 3t manufacturers-plugin as you have just mentioned such a thing.
nobody guarantees you with a new release that will work this .. therefore your parts of the dependent are .. so if possible rather not.

- This weekend I've looked under Unity .. perhaps this could be an alternative towards solve the problem ..

http://docs.unity3d.com/Manual/class-FixedJoint.html

http://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/FixedJoint.html

https://grovecodeblog.wordpress.com/2013/10/30/combining-physics-and-animation-in-unity/

- nice animated overview about Unity rigidbody (unity web player)

http://sampsy.com/blog/physicsanimation.html

 

cheers :)

 

 

 

 

Edited by RaendyLeBeau
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On 25.1.2016 at 7:47 PM, artwhaley said:

This has got me thinking.... I may dig into the IR code and see how it works a little.  A derivative that just used animations, but adjusted the attachment of everything to the new position when the attachment point moved would be really useful, wouldn't it?

wow, looks very awesome. good work. - I need time with this "Infernal Robotics" plugin closer look. :)

he man ! on something wait the guys from NASA  .. is very likely that she herself using KSP - play through all the scenarios.   :)

cheers

zWkfaeo.png

 

Edited by RaendyLeBeau
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On 25.1.2016 at 5:25 PM, curtquarquesso said:

The work-around would be using the infernal robotics plugin, but I think that opens up a huge can of worms. Would that then make the animation work like a servo? :huh:

niet!  no rather not. :)

Anyway, I have so far found no really good solution.
got a lot has tried everything not functioning satisfactorily.

I've read (do not remember where) with Unity 5 it is in the IVA area also new features will come.
I hope that soon KSP with U5. will come, so that any solutions already available.

The danger is that we Mod-developers now have plenty of time to put the matter up with the upcoming version KSP Unity 5 will change fundamentally.
That's why I still hold myself back with developments in this area. (as good as possible ..)

I think (and this is the most important to this thread) it must be currently considered many ksp mod Topics. ^_^

 

cheers :)

 

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