Arrow. Single Stage to Anywhere!

[Rune]

Have you ever wanted to do the Jool 5 challenge in a single stage? Flag every rock on the kerbol system in the same emission? Well now is your chance! Introducing the Arrow.

With enough oomph (that's the technical term) to land on Tylo and take off again, quite literally, Eve is the limit. As in, Eve is the only place you can't take off from, not that you can't end your Grand Tour there! But hey, I'd say every other place with a solid surface is good enough, for today at least. And before I go any further, huge thanks to @TAL, whose amazing video in the SSTO thread got me started on this road. Спасибо!

How do you do such things, you ask? Well, with a lot of fuel, basically. Plus, the ability to mine even more fuel, meaning you range is limited by your piloting skills, mostly. Land vertically like a rocket on some airless moon, open the cargo bay ramp, and start drilling away to your heart's content. Being RTG-powered and using a single big drill, it doesn't care about local insolation or ore concentration, given enough time, it will fill up the tanks and allow you to continue with the tour. It can take quite a bit of time, tough...

It also has docking gear, though I don't really know why you would use that, other than the shielded docking port being an awesome heatshield. Still, I wanted the option of super-powerful RCS to control attitude, so why not. And regarding reentries, the wing loading is kind of... well, to put it bluntly, it has very little wings. I know it looks like a plane, but it is mostly a rocketship, if you want to glide it down you'd better make sure it's fully empty or you will find it only flies because the Vectors can give it quite the kick in the pants (and if you have some remaining fuel, make sure it's on the front of the vehicle) . For everywhere else with less than one bar of pressure, I'd say fly it like a rocket, ass first.

Oh, and did I mention I packed all of the goodies into 75 parts? Yeah, it wouldn't be one of my builds if it didn't have a low and round part count.

Now, onto the rest of the flight notes... they are not that many to keep in mind, unless you want to tackle the ultimate mission, the dreaded "Tylo run".  Let's get on with it, bulletin style:

-Of course, remember to control form the front-mounted docking port, otherwise things won't make any sense. Made a note somewhere to mention that so you know, just in case.

-Make sure that your vertical landing speed is less than 4m/s on high gravity landings, too, or you risk breaking something.

-You can tailstrike when taking off. I was going to solve that, but my testing team* cheerfully informed me that I should leave things as they are, since this way the takeoffs are "more fun". When there is no air for the wings to help, the use of a suitable terrain ramp is highly encouraged, BTW.

-The nuke is for space, the high TWR Vectors for takeoff. That is generally true, and will serve you 90% of the time, starting with liftoff from kerbin. You always want to burn the low Isp propulsion first in order to maximize dV...

-...but that is not always true. In order to make Tylo, you have to save the high TWR propulsion for last, and still have enough dV to get you to low Tylo orbit. Empty the Mk3 adapters surrounding the main fuel tank of oxidizer in that case, so you have a bit more dV on low thrust mode to get to Tylo from Bop with just enough LFO mix to make the landing. I am by no means saying that is an easy thing to do, as @PointySideUp can attest to. But it can be done!

-Other fuel loads would apply to other challenging mission plans (i.e: to make it to Moho you need to load just enough oxidizer for the final landing, so you have enough dV on the nuke to get there). But those are untested, and while easier than Tylo, I can't do all the work for you guys, right? Experiment and tell me how it goes!

-Kerbin takeoff, OTOH, is pretty simple and straightforward. Just get to a 45º climb ASAP, and at about 7kms of altitude start following the usual gravity turn that you would follow with any rocket of such a high TWR, aiming for a time to apoapsis somewhere under one minute. You should make it to orbit with some LFO mix left, if you circularize on the nuke, or burn the last fumes of oxidizer to make orbit. And with a fuel flow that keeps you (mostly) aerodynamically stable the whole time, too, which was not easy to accomplish!

-The only tricky part in the whole flight envelope, really, is that the Vectors provide a tad too much control authority and general... exuberance, shall we call it? As it is, you can pull enough aerodynamic stress on the first pitch up maneuver to make it blow up! So please take your time and do things carefully, if you want to go to space today.

...And I can no longer think of things to say, so that must mean I am done, right? If not, you can always ask me the questions later, so have the album and DL link already!

 

IMGUR ALBUM:

 

DOWNLOAD:

https://kerbalx.com/Rune/SSTO-Mk-LXXX-Arrow

*Many kudos to my testing crew for this project, @castille7 and @PointySideUp, for helping me put this thing through its paces. I myself would have never have found the time to properly test it, so if you see it here now it is thanks to them, give them a like somewhere on my behalf. I have LS installed, so I can't do it there and would have to make another install, which is a big bother and has killed many projects before. Besides having a ton of fun during the last couple weeks, we came up with more ideas that you will see elsewhere soon™!

 

Rune. I have been know to be a tad too verbose at times...

Edited March 24, 2016 by Rune

[RocketSquid]

Nice! I tried something like this before, but smaller. It did not end well. Or start well, for that matter. It seemed to really enjoy swimming.

[Majorjim!]

Just now, Rune said:

I have been know to be a tad too verbose at times...

A tad? Joking aside it looks cool man. What cockpit is inside?

[Mad Rocket Scientist]

Amazing.  And I thought my Jool-5 design was fairly efficient.

[SingABrightSong]

Aha! I've been keeping an eye on this project, and I had suspected that its designation would be "Arrow". Well done.

 

I wonder if it might be able to return from Eve with some manner of drop tank.

[Rune]

4 hours ago, RocketSquid said:

Nice! I tried something like this before, but smaller. It did not end well. Or start well, for that matter. It seemed to really enjoy swimming.

Thanks! Well, now you can dissect this one and know what makes it tick. Or take it for a ride and find out what it takes to pilot it!

3 hours ago, Majorjim said:

A tad? Joking aside it looks cool man. What cockpit is inside?

Mk1 lander can.

43 minutes ago, Mad Rocket Scientist said:

Amazing.  And I thought my Jool-5 design was fairly efficient.

Thanks! Now I only have to actually fly the challenge myself one of these days...

37 minutes ago, SingABrightSong said:

Aha! I've been keeping an eye on this project, and I had suspected that its designation would be "Arrow". Well done.

 

I wonder if it might be able to return from Eve with some manner of drop tank.

Well, you nailed it... I must be running out of pointy objects, mustn't I?

 

Rune. Holy crap that "mustn't" looks weird when written. But if autocorrect will allow it...

[Majorjim!]

14 minutes ago, Rune said:

Now I only have to actually fly the challenge myself one of these days...

Damn straight! especially after our conversation earlier!

Gauntlet well and truly thrown down.

Edited March 24, 2016 by Majorjim

[Majorjim!]

Even starting the grand tour in this would be really fun man. The pilot can hang out on the first port of call for a while too. I would love to see it, take many pics! I have always been wary of visiting all Jools moons at once. Just thinking about The planning makes my head spin!

Edited March 24, 2016 by Majorjim

[Rune]

54 minutes ago, Majorjim said:

Even starting the grand tour in this would be really fun man. The pilot can hang out on the first port of call for a while too. I would love to see it, take many pics! I have always been wary of visiting all Jools moons at once. Just thinking about The planning makes my head spin!

Yup, it can be a very tortuous route to navigate at times. I would do it Kerbin->Laythe->Bop->Tylo->Pol, if I wanted to have the least refuels possible.

As to the pics... well, what the heck, I guess it's going to be public real soon. I have been coaching PointySideUP through the trickiest part of the testing, and thanks to a brilliant suggestion by castille, we decided to create  C̟͇̜̟̗̠̙͚̺͉͓͍͈̻̝̣̼͓̥ͨͣ̓̑ͧͬ̑̍̎̐̅͜͠h̓ͦ̀̽ͤ̍̐͐ͭ̑ͤ̅́ͮ҉͏̹̮̖̗̝̖͔͈̭͈̤̤ȁ̧̝̺͈͍̩͚͔̩̞͙͔̬̞̦͕̮ͣ͐ͭ͜͡ļͮ̊̒̈́̂ͯ̀͡͡͏̠̞̻͔͓̜̭͉͕̜̤͞ͅͅl̮͖̲͈̣̪̳̙̲ͮ̈ͥ̓͛ͨ͒̓̐͋̒ͣ̒ͫͬͪ̍͘͞ͅȩ̵̧͍̲͎̯̭̩̮̞͉͔̜̘̍͑̉ͫ͆͒ͨ͌͋ͨͯ̔̉ͫ̚͘͠ṋ̵̨̡̮̩̯͙̘̞̠̙͎͎͕̮̹͇͓̍͐͂ͣ̒̐͂ͥ̿ͬ̅̀ͯͩ̔̎͘͡ͅg̶ͥͣ́̍͛ͥ̉͟͟҉̰̮̻̘̯̕e̷̤̳͖̟̥̙̫̞͇̹̙͍͖̳̠͎̺̼̰̯̳̤̻͍͙̬̞͉̘̦͓̬ͪ̄ͨͦ̄͑̄̽ͩͥ͐ͣͥ́̇ͯ̏͛̒̀̕͠ͅ  

something else this forums are known to have, other than craft exchanges, where you will be able to find plenty of pictures and  a̡͖̲̣̟̱ͭ͆̏̈́̒̓̾̇ͣ̿͑̂̀ͤ͌̓̇̋͗͘͢ ͭ͐̔̉̎ͤͦ̑ͤ̎ͯ̍͊͒͊͏̷͙͕̦̘́́͠h̩̣͕͍̱̫̺̝̟͓̜ͪ̈̈̈ͪ̈́̎͑̕ͅa̝̟̺̱̹̍ͥͦ͌̽͗ͫ̋͌ͤ̽͑ͮ͐̇ͮ͋̎̀͞n̡̧̢̖̙̪̺̺͕̲͙̗̰̯̼̱̻̮̩͈̮̙ͤ̉̑̂̊̌̌ͫͧ͆͟͟ḍ̶̡̩͚̠̘̰̟̰̘͓͕̖͚̜̉͒̂ͧ̑̑͘͜͞ŷ̧̻͕̯̺̗͎̫̙̤̹ͬ̿̈́ͧ̃ͥ́̿̌͌̈̉̄ͪ̕ ̷͕͖̼̲̞̩̤͎͙̞̝̠̉͋ͨm̷̡͕̯͍̗̯̪͇͔̺̤̰͙̦̌̆ͭ͌̽̌ͥ̎̆̾̅̓́̀͝a̷̧̳̤͖̪̓ͦ̀ͯ̍̂̃́́̅̋ͫ́̋͞͠n̶̫̙͓̤̮̳̩̻̮̳͙̳̙͍̻͔̼ͨ̐ͧ͛̌̌̾̓̈̀ͅṵ̵̳͇̣̖̤̻̪̯̲̯̮͇̖̺̥̟̿́̈̐̏ͤͨ̑̀ͥͬͤͫ̆͂̚̕͞͝a̽̍̿́̐̈͐ͤ̍̍ͤ͢҉͚̻̼̗̩̰̺̤l̴͆̾̽̽ͪ̽̊ͯ̓ͪ͋̆̋ͣͭ҉̤̬͈̜͇̲̯̗̮̺̙̗̥    something like an explanation, but not quite.

 

Rune. Dammit, the censorship elves strike again.

Edited March 24, 2016 by Rune

[Majorjim!]

Just now, Rune said:

Yup, it can be a very tortuous route to navigate at times. I would do it Kerbin->Laythe->Bop->Tylo->Pol, if I wanted to have the least refuels possible.

As to the pics... well, what the heck, I guess it's going to be public real soon. I have been coaching PointySideUP through the trickiest part of the testing, and thanks to a brilliant suggestion by castille, we decided to create  C̟͇̜̟̗̠̙͚̺͉͓͍͈̻̝̣̼͓̥ͨͣ̓̑ͧͬ̑̍̎̐̅͜͠h̓ͦ̀̽ͤ̍̐͐ͭ̑ͤ̅́ͮ҉͏̹̮̖̗̝̖͔͈̭͈̤̤ȁ̧̝̺͈͍̩͚͔̩̞͙͔̬̞̦͕̮ͣ͐ͭ͜͡ļͮ̊̒̈́̂ͯ̀͡͡͏̠̞̻͔͓̜̭͉͕̜̤͞ͅͅl̮͖̲͈̣̪̳̙̲ͮ̈ͥ̓͛ͨ͒̓̐͋̒ͣ̒ͫͬͪ̍͘͞ͅȩ̵̧͍̲͎̯̭̩̮̞͉͔̜̘̍͑̉ͫ͆͒ͨ͌͋ͨͯ̔̉ͫ̚͘͠ṋ̵̨̡̮̩̯͙̘̞̠̙͎͎͕̮̹͇͓̍͐͂ͣ̒̐͂ͥ̿ͬ̅̀ͯͩ̔̎͘͡ͅg̶ͥͣ́̍͛ͥ̉͟͟҉̰̮̻̘̯̕e̷̤̳͖̟̥̙̫̞͇̹̙͍͖̳̠͎̺̼̰̯̳̤̻͍͙̬̞͉̘̦͓̬ͪ̄ͨͦ̄͑̄̽ͩͥ͐ͣͥ́̇ͯ̏͛̒̀̕͠ͅ  

something else this forums are known to have, other than craft exchanges, where you will be able to find plenty of pictures and  a̡͖̲̣̟̱ͭ͆̏̈́̒̓̾̇ͣ̿͑̂̀ͤ͌̓̇̋͗͘͢ ͭ͐̔̉̎ͤͦ̑ͤ̎ͯ̍͊͒͊͏̷͙͕̦̘́́͠h̩̣͕͍̱̫̺̝̟͓̜ͪ̈̈̈ͪ̈́̎͑̕ͅa̝̟̺̱̹̍ͥͦ͌̽͗ͫ̋͌ͤ̽͑ͮ͐̇ͮ͋̎̀͞n̡̧̢̖̙̪̺̺͕̲͙̗̰̯̼̱̻̮̩͈̮̙ͤ̉̑̂̊̌̌ͫͧ͆͟͟ḍ̶̡̩͚̠̘̰̟̰̘͓͕̖͚̜̉͒̂ͧ̑̑͘͜͞ŷ̧̻͕̯̺̗͎̫̙̤̹ͬ̿̈́ͧ̃ͥ́̿̌͌̈̉̄ͪ̕ ̷͕͖̼̲̞̩̤͎͙̞̝̠̉͋ͨm̷̡͕̯͍̗̯̪͇͔̺̤̰͙̦̌̆ͭ͌̽̌ͥ̎̆̾̅̓́̀͝a̷̧̳̤͖̪̓ͦ̀ͯ̍̂̃́́̅̋ͫ́̋͞͠n̶̫̙͓̤̮̳̩̻̮̳͙̳̙͍̻͔̼ͨ̐ͧ͛̌̌̾̓̈̀ͅṵ̵̳͇̣̖̤̻̪̯̲̯̮͇̖̺̥̟̿́̈̐̏ͤͨ̑̀ͥͬͤͫ̆͂̚̕͞͝a̽̍̿́̐̈͐ͤ̍̍ͤ͢҉͚̻̼̗̩̰̺̤l̴͆̾̽̽ͪ̽̊ͯ̓ͪ͋̆̋ͣͭ҉̤̬͈̜͇̲̯̗̮̺̙̗̥    something like an explanation, but not quite.

 

Rune. Dammit, the censorship elves strike again.

Ooh what are those images? They are so tiny! Is it some elaborate planning tool? Reveal your secrets gypsy!

[Rune]

6 minutes ago, Majorjim said:

Ooh what are those images? They are so tiny! Is it some elaborate planning tool? Reveal your secrets gypsy!

 

#booming voice# A MAGICIAN NEVER REVEALS HIS SECRETS! #booming voice#

 

... but then again, a scientist always does: That is zalgo text at size 8 and scratched, so I could play at being my own censor, and drum up the hype a bit.

 

Rune. Was it working?

Edited March 24, 2016 by Rune

[Majorjim!]

Just now, Rune said:

 

Rune. Was it working?

Too well my friend!

Edited March 24, 2016 by Majorjim

[Rune]

3 hours ago, SingABrightSong said:

I wonder if it might be able to return from Eve with some manner of drop tank.

Crap, I forgot to address that! Yeah, no freaking way. Eve can be SSTOed, but not with meaningful payload. It would require like, another whole stage a couple of times the mass, and with huge TWR to boot, and mating both on the ground would be a nightmare². Besides, it doesn't have TWR >1 on Eve, and still you wouldn't be able to make it to Gilly to refuel afterwards so... sorry, but nope, if you land it on Eve I hope you like purple because you are staying.

 

Rune. Probably not doable in stock.

Edited March 24, 2016 by Rune

[RocketSquid]

Hmm... I think I need to make a gigantic drop tank/boost stage hybrid for use on eve.

[SingABrightSong]

2 hours ago, Rune said:

Crap, I forgot to address that! Yeah, no freaking way. Eve can be SSTOed, but not with meaningful payload. It would require like, another whole stage a couple of times the mass, and with huge TWR to boot, and mating both on the ground would be a nightmare². Besides, it doesn't have TWR >1 on Eve, and still you wouldn't be able to make it to Gilly to refuel afterwards so... sorry, but nope, if you land it on Eve I hope you like purple because you are staying.

 

Rune. Probably not doable in stock.

Ah well. SSTO from Eve will remain the elusive ideal for the foreseeable future. Until that day, conquering Tylo is good enough.

 

Well, took the Arrow out for a spin. I kept tail-striking on the runway, until I finally got liftoff, upon which I suffered aerodynamic failure from travelling at 270 m/2 at sea level. Seems to want to veer into the spaceplane hanger during liftoff.

 

ADDENDUM: Yeah, the wheels keep buckling on me. I assume I'm doing something wrong, but for now I'll wait to see if the new 1.1 wheels fix anything.

 

Edited March 25, 2016 by SingABrightSong
Addenda

[PointySideUp]

45 minutes ago, SingABrightSong said:

Seems to want to veer into the spaceplane hanger during liftoff.

@SingABrightSongMake sure you control from the front docking port before takeoff, nice smooth pull up to 45° at the end of the runway or it'll break up!

[Majorjim!]

5 minutes ago, SingABrightSong said:

 Yeah, the wheels keep buckling on me.

 

I think pulling up too early will buckle the gear too.

[SingABrightSong]

1 hour ago, PointySideUp said:

@SingABrightSongMake sure you control from the front docking port before takeoff, nice smooth pull up to 45° at the end of the runway or it'll break up!

I can confirm that that was indeed what I was doing wrong.

[Castille7]

I have to admit this project was fun and there was a lot of first for me, the pilot testing was 95% @PointySideUp on this project and he was always amazing me with his knowledge of navigation as well as @Rune. I found myself missing out on a lot of work covered by Rune and PointySideUp but did manage to help a little. It was fun being a part of the project and seeing it come together. Also this craft is an Amazing one and packs a lot of punch for such a small about of parts being used, I hope to see more Kerbonauts getting their hands on this craft and to hear their responses.

Edited March 25, 2016 by castille7

[Exothermos]

Simple is beautiful.  There are lots of neat little design decisions on this one.  I DO think that Jeb might be radioactive for the next 10,000 years after being sandwiched between all those RTGs, though. 

The delicate takeoff isn't that bad.  I only blew up once.  Those vector engines are outrageously OP of course, but hey, might as well take advantage of it while you can!

[kiwi1960]

I have one complaint..... "Arrow"..... should be reserved for the real Arrow... the Avro Arrow, a canadian plane from the 1950's that was killed before its time....

But it matters not... the Avro Arrow will make a return... I swear it....

[Rune]

6 hours ago, SingABrightSong said:

I can confirm that that was indeed what I was doing wrong.

Glad to see you solved your first problem! Yeah, the landing gear can buckle if you keep 'S' pressed during takeoff, meaning it loses alignment and you swerve to one side. If you want to rotate on the runway, I'm afraid it's unavoidable... it's not that the landing gear is placed in a weak spot, it's attached to the main tank, but the Vectors give such a big torque, that you can bend them anyway. And the Vectors can't be more gimbal-limited, because then you wouldn't rotate on flat ground and would have to wait for thelip of the runway (the original idea, BTW, before I found out the Vectors gave enough torque). And of course, you need such a high torque to rotate it because the lading gear is back, so you can actually land on kerbin's gravity as a tailsitter and let it fall without breaking stuff. Still, with a bit of practice, the takeoff is perfectly doable, and very FUN! The best results I get waiting until I have about ~70m/s of speed to start the rotation looking north so I can put some AoA in there without tailstriking, then pull up more (gently!) just as soon as I see the gear leave the ground (~100m/s or so). By the time I finish the gentle pullup (tap, don't press, 'S'), I'm doing about ~200m/s at ~45º.

6 hours ago, castille7 said:

I have to admit this project was fun and there was a lot of first for me, the pilot testing was 95% @PointySideUp on this project and he was always amazing me with his knowledge of navigation as well as @Rune. I found myself missing out on a lot of work covered by Rune and PointySideUp but did manage to help a little. It was fun being a part of the project and seeing it come together. Also this craft is an Amazing one and packs a lot of punch for such a small about of parts being used, I hope to see more Kerbonauts getting there hands on this craft and to hear their responses.

Well, you did your part, and we get to see that soon. I'm just glad people are enjoying our efforts!

3 hours ago, Exothermos said:

Simple is beautiful.  There are lots of neat little design decisions on this one.  I DO think that Jeb might be radioactive for the next 10,000 years after being sandwiched between all those RTGs, though. 

The delicate takeoff isn't that bad.  I only blew up once.  Those vector engines are outrageously OP of course, but hey, might as well take advantage of it while you can!

Thanks for the kind words! And yeah, that is a lot of RTGs surrounding the cabin. But even in RL that shouldn't be so scary... Pu₂₃₈ decays emitting mostly alphas, and alpha radiation can be stopped by a piece of paper, or your own skin, so it is only dangerous if it gets under it (i.e: you shallow or breathe particulates of the stuff). So don't lick them or you'll die horribly! But other than that, they should just be slightly warm to the touch.

Edit. Actually, just loook at this pic. Awesome, isn't it? It's still up there!

And yeah, I have always been the first to say that the Vectors are OP... but strictly for TWR reasons, aerospikes actually have higher vacuum Isp... I really think that this whole thing could be done even smaller with spikes, because the surface TWR on this is really high, at 1.45. Somewhere around TWR 1, if you can solve the control issues (and there will be many, with a rocket's fuel flow and mass), is the ideal minimum size for this, methinks. And in fact, you could make it a true tailsitter while you are at it...

2 hours ago, kiwi1960 said:

I have one complaint..... "Arrow"..... should be reserved for the real Arrow... the Avro Arrow, a canadian plane from the 1950's that was killed before its time....

But it matters not... the Avro Arrow will make a return... I swear it....

Yeah, sorry about that, I know that bird evokes a lot of feelings, especially among Canadians... But if you take it as an homage, the big vertical stabilizer has some resemblance, doesn't it?

 

Rune. Wow you guys really like this, quirks and all!

Edited March 25, 2016 by Rune

[ryan234abc]

Hey again! Love that RTG pic btw.

Well, when I saw TAL's video I thought it would be a step too far, but I apologise for ever doubting you! Nonetheless, the sideways cargo bay draws my eye every time - I just love it! I'm not in the habit of making my own craft, and although I've made quite a few successful launchers, I can never find the patience for the low G burns the nuke gives out. However, I doubt anyone enjoys those long but necessary burns, but you never fail to make it seem less like an electric car and more like a Ferrari with a Saturn V engine on the back. As always great craft, and probably (if you don't mind me saying) one of your best achievements to date! Keep it up!

Srsly tho, more sideways cargo bays! They RULE!