sojourner Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Hell, the crew of Challenger survived most of the way down after the explosion. And that was a Hydrogen/Oxy explosion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leszek Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Sigh, No One has claimed that it survived the impact with the water.And that "big Explosion" takes place long after the possibly sighted capsule has left the area.Besides, it seems very obvious to me that the explosion pushed the capsule past warp 1, I am getting ready for the Vulcans to land tonight. Seriously though, it is too early to know anything at this point. Even the early reports that there was a pressurization issue in the second stage is suspect just because it is too soon. This could have just been a more visible symptom of something more convoluted. Yes I know I am stretching it a bit, I am just making an observation.Once we have that point out of the way any speculation is just fine.Currently my money is on a manufacturing defect in the second stage tanks and that the Dragon was destroyed at altitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
v8Dave Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 That's why crewed rockets have those massive escape towers, with thrusters that pull the capsule up and away in case this happens. No tower, no escape.I thought Dragon was going to have the escape system built into the capsule once man rated, so no escape tower for Dragon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clockwork13 Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 I guess they forgot the SAS module. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frybert Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Hell, the crew of Challenger survived most of the way down after the explosion. And that was a Hydrogen/Oxy explosion.There was actually very little combustion of the hydrogen/oxygen. The orbiter itself was actually destroyed by the aerodynamic forces. If that tank had actually exploded due to combustion the fireball would have been much bigger! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wingman703 Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 I thought Dragon was going to have the escape system built into the capsule once man rated, so no escape tower for Dragon.Dragon V2 does not use an escape tower, it uses 8 SuperDraco engines in the event of a RUD. Escape towers were used on just about every manned pod I can think of however(Apollo, Orion). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frybert Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 I thought Dragon was going to have the escape system built into the capsule once man rated, so no escape tower for Dragon.This is correct. The LES and the landing thrusters are going to be the same unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ansaman Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Here is 116 frames of the explosion in an IMGUR album. Thought maybe some might like to play in-house sleuths.http://imgur.com/a/FLNmqYou have done us all a service, sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kartoffelkuchen Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 @v8dave: That's in that point the same. Integrated or not, it is used to get the spacecraft away. I hope they will find new information quickly and share them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberion Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 I don't need to prove a single thing, my statements align with what NASA and SpaceX said, and what we see on the video, a rocket exploding and leaving only a disparate cloud of small debris pieces. No obvious signs of any substantial objects falling away in any camera shot.You are basing your "speculation" on two things, and 2 things only; 3 seconds of a roughly trapezoidal shadow flickering in front of the exhaust plume, well before the rocket broke up in a meaningful way.Gwynn Shotwell saying they had contact with Dragon "after the event" - nevermind that she also said they had contact with the 1st stage after the event too; why are you claiming it survived to fall into the ocean as well?As for why I am trying to "prove" it; Look back through the thread and find all the comments about it "surviving" or having aborted or anything of the sort, there was far too much of it. There's no use abiding misinformation, whether intentional or just via mis-interpretation.It is a sure thing that Dragon was destroyed because of this accident. It it only slightly less likely that dragon was destroyed in the atmosphere along with the rest of the rocket. It's possible it COULD have detached and fallen into the ocean to its demise, but we have no evidence of that and plenty of the other.And that is reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wingman703 Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Scott Manley put forth his thoughts: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kryten Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Again, the rocket didn't explode, it was merely torn to bits by aerodynamic forces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanamonde Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 More threads merged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frybert Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 More threads merged.Dang dude! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PakledHostage Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Scott Manley put forth his thoughts:And? Should we be interested because he's Scott Manley! Or because he has access to information that we don't have access to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ansaman Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 And? Should we be interested because he's Scott Manley! Or because he has access to information that we don't have access to?It's all about the accent ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K^2 Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Again, the rocket didn't explode, it was merely torn to bits by aerodynamic forces.Define "explode," then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignath Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Via nasaspaceflight.com:"The research payloads that were onboard the CRS-7 included a JAXA experiment to investigate combustion in microgravity; a high resolution Earth-facing camera to watch for meteors entering the atmosphere in an attempt to study their compositions; Veg-03, a cabbage growth experiment; a bioscience investigation to study the effects of spaceflight on telomeres in the crew’s DNA and an array of student experiments.All were lost, despite the Dragon falling clear of the failing Falcon 9. However, she was not designed to recover from such an incident and was lost when she impacted the water."http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2015/06/falcon-9-crs-7-dragon-commute-orbit/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borisperrons Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 It didn't explode in the sense that it wasn't torn to pieces by a big boom from the fuel. After the Dragon had been detatched, the rocket ended up having exposed to airflow a lot of surface that wasn't expected to be exposed. So, everything start to tear apart, tanks ruptured and lox escaped, with some mixing (hence the flames) but not deflagrating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
softweir Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 And? Should we be interested because he's Scott Manley! Or because he has access to information that we don't have access to?Because he presented a concise, coherent, well-informed and well-argued analysis of the current situation. He doesn't say anything anybody else has been saying, but he said it better than anybody else I have read so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 The crew compartment of Challenger was largely intact when it hit the water, I can't imagine Dragon is any different. Both were falling at terminal velocity, well within stresses they could handle. It's the sudden stop that is the problem, after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PakledHostage Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Because he presented a concise, coherent, well-informed and well-argued analysis of the current situation. He doesn't say anything anybody else has been saying, but he said it better than anybody else I have read so far.Well I guess that's a good reason then. Forgive my skepticism. There's just too much Manley fanboyism around here. A couple of sentences about why we should want to watch the video would have helped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hcube Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Well I guess that's a good reason then. Forgive my skepticism. There's just too much Manley fanboyism around here. A couple of sentences about why we should want to watch the video would have helped.The fanboyism exists because this is a KSP forum and Scott Manley is non-arguably amazingly good at the game.Back on topic, what could cause this kind of overpressure ? maybe the pressurization helium accidentally leaked into the LOX tank ? I'm not sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frida Space Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 what could cause this kind of overpressure ? maybe the pressurization helium accidentally leaked into the LOX tank ? I'm not sureMy bet is on a tank rupture. Obviously as the result of some other kind of structural collapse/damage elsewhere (trunk section maybe?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wingman703 Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 I still point my accusing finger at that IDA bashing stuff in, but only the after action reports will tell the tale for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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