blackheart612

[1.4.x-1.4.4] Airplane Plus - R23.0 (Full 1.875m parts, CRJ series, New jet engine, Fixes) (Jul 20 2018)

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, TeslaPenguin1 said:

Questions: 

1. Do any of the propellers not need liquid fuel?

2. Do the propellers work on any planet with atmosphere, or just Kerbin or Laythe?

No on both counts. You would need to get Kerbal Aircraft Expansion, which has an electric propeller.

 

On a slightly different note, any chance of adding a CF-34-ish pod engine? SOmewhere in the 0.935m diameter range... Seems to be somewhat lacking for making business and regional jets.

Edited by MaverickSawyer

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31 minutes ago, MaverickSawyer said:

No on both counts. You would need to get Kerbal Aircraft Expansion, which has an electric propeller.

 

On a slightly different note, any chance of adding a CF-34-ish pod engine? SOmewhere in the 0.935m diameter range... Seems to be somewhat lacking for making business and regional jets.

Oo, I like that, a smaller turbofan engine. I tried making a CRJ-900 replica the other day, and realized that the engines are not mounted on a long "stick" out the back, like most under wing engines are nowadays. To add more flexibility to the parts it would be nice if the mounting pylon was a separate part, so you can either make your own out of wing and structural parts, or there could be 2 or 3 to choose from, essentially making a modular system. The engine it self would be able to surface attach radially, or connect to the pylons through a node or something like that. Or maybe just have 2 or 3 models for the same engine with different mounting arrangements, to keep part counts down.

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Stock part switch, perhaps? Certainly could use B9... One part, two (maybe three?) models... Inline, under wing, rear fuselage.

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15 hours ago, TeslaPenguin1 said:

Questions: 

1. Do any of the propellers not need liquid fuel?

2. Do the propellers work on any planet with atmosphere, or just Kerbin or Laythe?

1. they all need it
2. just like stock jets, because piston and turboprop

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Bobby Kerman the head of R&D department in UVM Corporation was very pleased with himself. The contract for a light MD 500 helicopter with the Ministry of Defense brought a small amount of money and Bobby was able to make the first installment on a loan for a new bicycle. In just 10 years, this loan will be paid in full.

Hm. It was necessary to earn more money to repay the loan ahead of time. And the way-out was found quite simply. Kerbin needs light regional aircrafts – they are popular both in the army and among civilian companies. UVM already had a small utility aircraft An-14. So, light changes to wing’s geometry, tail, add new engines and more space for the load…

In one evening the brainstorming session was held, drawings were drawn and given for an assembly to the SPH. Day after 2 new aircrafts stood on the runway near the hangar.

The first one - Antonov An-28 a twin-engined light turboprop transport aircraft that was a little bigger than previous An-14. And Antonov An-38 as the eldest brother in this three light turboprop aircrafts family that should be ideal choice for regional commercial airlines.

“If enough units are sold, I could pay off a couple of bike payments ahead of time. Life is a damn cool thing” - Bobby thought.

wVJkWF2.png (1920×1200)

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I made some mock-up models for possible passenger cabin configurations. https://imgur.com/a/fAViy

ziPfywF.pngwOOiEIH.png

That is one example, but I made them in all the standard sizes including 1.85m. The chair with cylinder is a simple stand in for what I think is the right size for a passenger. It is 0.41x0.41x0.8m, which seem to be the size of a kerbal in a seat without back pack and helmet. Seat row spacing is 0.8m as well, so the kerbals can actually get in and out, and with a few exceptions the aisles are ~0.4m.

I think I might be slipping into the deep end, and start making mod parts my self. I would like to know is this should be a separate mod pack or if @blackheart612 would like to have something like this in APP.

And in case anyone asks, I did the models in Autodesk Fusion 360,  which is a CAD type parametric modeling software, but I can export the models into poly models at the desired resolution if need be. 

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13 hours ago, neistridlar said:

I made some mock-up models for possible passenger cabin configurations. https://imgur.com/a/fAViy

ziPfywF.pngwOOiEIH.png

That is one example, but I made them in all the standard sizes including 1.85m. The chair with cylinder is a simple stand in for what I think is the right size for a passenger. It is 0.41x0.41x0.8m, which seem to be the size of a kerbal in a seat without back pack and helmet. Seat row spacing is 0.8m as well, so the kerbals can actually get in and out, and with a few exceptions the aisles are ~0.4m.

I think I might be slipping into the deep end, and start making mod parts my self. I would like to know is this should be a separate mod pack or if @blackheart612 would like to have something like this in APP.

And in case anyone asks, I did the models in Autodesk Fusion 360,  which is a CAD type parametric modeling software, but I can export the models into poly models at the desired resolution if need be. 

I'm not quite sure about the seats and I can't remember if I crammed as much as I could on the S2 Passenger Cabin but I probably did. The stock seat dimensions aren't big enough for the kerbals, even if you could put them side by side, their hands overhang the armrests and clip with each other leading to a lot of adjustments removing a few seats completely. That's my guess from how it looks right now, but sure, I'm interested in adding more passenger cabins of course, doesn't stop you from making your own, though. I certainly am not stopping you.

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6 hours ago, blackheart612 said:

I'm not quite sure about the seats and I can't remember if I crammed as much as I could on the S2 Passenger Cabin but I probably did. The stock seat dimensions aren't big enough for the kerbals, even if you could put them side by side, their hands overhang the armrests and clip with each other leading to a lot of adjustments removing a few seats completely. That's my guess from how it looks right now, but sure, I'm interested in adding more passenger cabins of course, doesn't stop you from making your own, though. I certainly am not stopping you.

I have done some more testing now, and gotten some models in to the game. My stand in models seem to be pretty much exactly the space that a seated kerbal needs without a helmet. And yes you did cram in as many as possible, while still making it possible for kerbals to get inn and out. The S2 cabin looks kind of roomy, but there is only space for 0.5 more seats width wise, and none length wise. Also, just to clarify, I was wondering if you would be interested in having my models in APP, If not I will start something of my own. I have a few things to learn before I can make anything to the standard of APP though.

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@neistridlar I find myself lost whenever I have a work not started by me (I know because I help a few people fix their stuff). It's difficult for me if I haven't started the workflow, so it would be best for you to use your models to contribute. Plus you'll get the well deserved credit. More often than not, the Original Post Author gets credited for most of the things in a mod if it's a collaboration. :wink: Don't hesitate to ask me if you need anything.

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Posted (edited)

@blackheart612 I can totally see how working on other peoples models would be challenging, no one thinks quite the same. I will try to figure out as much as possible of this stuff on my own then. I'm not to worried about who gets the credit. Are there any collections of up to date documentations that I should know about? It seems all I can find is random and mostly outdated info scattered about everywhere.

@theonegalen Nice. What should the interiors contain, and what should be props? it seems seats and instruments would be placed with props. Is there an easy way of placing props in a pattern? like for the biggest mock up I made I only placed 6 of the seats manually, then used 4 patterns and a mirror command in fusion to place the remaining 202 seats exactly where they needed to be, which took probably 20 seconds. Placing them all manually seems like a lot of work, though I suppose 200 is still within what can be done by a determined individual. And how would you prefer files be shared?

I have started working on 1.875m parts. A cocpit, modeled after CRJ900 and a passenger cabin in the same size as the FL-TX1800 with 4 rows of 1+1 seats. Trying to figure out how to get IVA to work now. This is what it looks like so far. And don't worry, the art work is very much place holder work for now. I'm following this video currently, but it does not seem that this is the method squad currently use for IVA.

7c0gne9.png

Edited by neistridlar

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2 hours ago, neistridlar said:

Nice. What should the interiors contain, and what should be props? it seems seats and instruments would be placed with props. Is there an easy way of placing props in a pattern? like for the biggest mock up I made I only placed 6 of the seats manually, then used 4 patterns and a mirror command in fusion to place the remaining 202 seats exactly where they needed to be, which took probably 20 seconds. Placing them all manually seems like a lot of work, though I suppose 200 is still within what can be done by a determined individual. And how would you prefer files be shared?

I have started working on 1.875m parts. A cocpit, modeled after CRJ900 and a passenger cabin in the same size as the FL-TX1800 with 4 rows of 1+1 seats. Trying to figure out how to get IVA to work now. This is what it looks like so far. And don't worry, the art work is very much place holder work for now. I'm following this video currently, but it does not seem that this is the method squad currently use for IVA.

7c0gne9.png

I would recommend the seats themselves be part of the IVA model, unless you intend them to be interactive and animate in some way. My SR-71 style IVA for Warbird Cockpits has 804 manually placed props and that took me basically all my free time for about three or four weeks, including missing quite a bit of sleep. You don't have to go that far. 

KSP uses the .mu format for models, and the inestimable @taniwha has created a plugin for Blender to allow us to import and export the format. It's quite good. I'm not a modeler myself so I am of limited help there.

Once you have your model ready, make an internal config (krjCabinInternal.cfg or something). Base it off of one of the configs in GameData/SQUAD/Spaces. Just make sure you put it in the same folder as your model somewhere in GameData and give the internal an unique name. Then KSP PartTools should be able to load it, and you can start placing props.

The best way to place props in a pattern is by using the parent-child functionality in Unity. If you have four seats in a row, for example, you can set the leftmost one as a parent to the rest, then use ctrl+d to duplicate all of them together, including the parent-child relationships. Then by moving the parent, you move all the children together with it. Rinse and repeat.

Have you tried a 2+1 seat arrangement for the CRJ? Might look cool.

Here's a couple of more recent videos on placing props.

 

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@theonegalen Cool, I will have to look into those. I Will have to see if there is a clever way to do patterns in Blender then. Exporting from fusion with all the seats means I have to do all the UVs for each chair individually, that is just not happening. I have gotten the configs working, so now I have an almost completely functional passenger cabin. They can even look out the window, though the window is opaque, so there is not much to see yet. Need to have the windows be a separate mesh it seems.

pWan6Ji.png

Does this look good for a cockpit model? There should be plenty of space for a kerbal in a chair in each of the two spaces.

5U4VLmr.png

As for the 1+2 1.85m cabin (just realized that this one was the wrong size), In the mockup I made there is not enough space in the aisle for a kerbal to walk.  I am starting to think that 0.1m is too thick for the walls though. With 0.05m, and 1.875m there is just enough space though.

WcG3H0O.png

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@neistridlar The cockpit and 2-1 seat arrangement looks good! Make sure to give the Kerbs a way out, whether it's a separate airstairs or airlock part, like this:

An integrated door would be good too.

We should probably move this discussion to a new thread in Add-On Developments, we're starting to crowd @blackheart612's thread.

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1 hour ago, theonegalen said:

We should probably move this discussion to a new thread in Add-On Developments, we're starting to crowd @blackheart612's thread.

Alright, here is a thread:

 

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On 4/21/2018 at 11:55 PM, neistridlar said:

Alright, here is a thread:

 

Best of luck! There's an awesome journey ahead. Meanwhile I'll be returning from my short break hopefully soon. Maybe a little more than a week.

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aside of 1.875  modern airliner parts, what if we also make the 1.875 old plane parts like the An-2?we can make them with the available engines and wings
like this

Spoiler

Antonov_An-2_SP-AIN_(8440879513).jpg

23867382634_1fa51d03b4_b.jpg

 

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Posted (edited)

 

6 hours ago, [INDO]dimas_1502 said:

aside of 1.875  modern airliner parts, what if we also make the 1.875 old plane parts like the An-2?we can make them with the available engines and wings
like this

  Reveal hidden contents

Antonov_An-2_SP-AIN_(8440879513).jpg

23867382634_1fa51d03b4_b.jpg

 

I feel like Kerbonov has the AN-2 covered already. I'd prefer DC-3 parts myself.

Edited by theonegalen
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17 hours ago, [INDO]dimas_1502 said:

aside of 1.875  modern airliner parts, what if we also make the 1.875 old plane parts like the An-2?we can make them with the available engines and wings
like this

  Hide contents

 

 

My god -- is that a *modern* An-2? That's amazing! I'm far more used to seeing the oldie version!

Are you familiar with this little gem?

It's labeled as a 1.2.x mod, but it worked fine in 1.3* and I've got it running in 1.4.2, no problem. Even has a nice internal props integration thanks to that guy right above this post. :)

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Beetlecat said:

My god -- is that a *modern* An-2? That's amazing! I'm far more used to seeing the oldie version!

Are you familiar with this little gem?

*old mod*

It's labeled as a 1.2.x mod, but it worked fine in 1.3* and I've got it running in 1.4.2, no problem. Even has a nice internal props integration thanks to that guy right above this post. :)

yep, it's the new An-2, i was quite surprised when seeing it on youtube

yes i've seen that mod, but i think 1.25 is too smol for this plane, SXT also have a An-2-ish cockpit, but it's in 2.5, too big for this plane too

 

I'd prefer DC-3 parts myself


u can make it with the airbuscockpit, like this

 

Spoiler

LCGkSSI.png

i also built the gunship version with this

Edited by [INDO]dimas_1502
add c-47

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Hi people! I'm encountering some issues with landing gear from this mod. Some of the landing gear parts clips trough . the plane just cant take off because it's like the plane has no landing gear. Anyone have an a idea how to fix this?

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On 4/19/2018 at 8:13 PM, blackheart612 said:

wOOiEIH.png

@neistridlar loving the look of that massive cabin so far! definitely would use when its finalized, especially if Blackheart takes a deep look into it

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@blackheart612 I am curious if you have some logic behind the weight and price behind the Size 2 passenger cabin of yours? Compared to the stock parts it seems incredibly light. It is the same weight as the Mk2 cabin, which only holds 4 kerbals, is 1/2 the length and 1/2 the height. Granted the Size 2 passenger cabin probably does not have all the "space features" like heat shields and heating/cooling systems. Still I kind of think that 3 or 4 tonnes seems more reasonable. That is still ~1/2 of the Mk3 part with the same passenger capacity.

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That's it, though: it's both dimensionally smaller and not at stoutly built. That results in some pretty impressive weight savings irl.

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Posted (edited)

it would be cool if you could add  a 1.25m 2 seat inline cockpit were one kerbal is facing backwards.

Kind off like a stuka cockpit

 

Edited by N7_aerospace
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