Good planes for learning to fly in FAR?

[Gordon Fecyk]

So I learned how to fly in stock KSP 1.0.5 and enough of it translated to 1.1.2 that I could limp along, wheel issues aside. To try to build smarter rockets and planes, I'm trying again with FAR 0.15.6.3 installed. Rockets are fine, but I'm having trouble getting a basic plane design that worked in 1.1.2 to behave with FAR.

I figured I should learn how to fly planes that work well with FAR first. The Stock Aeris 3A so far is OK, but I need to learn to use flaps and air brakes so I can land, and none of the stock craft have those enabled by default. Rather than mess with the stock craft, is there a selection of planes with flaps and such made by others? I think that would help me learn to fly properly, using flaps and air brakes, then I can start building planes properly.

(Edit: Found this afterward. Suggestions still wanted, but hey, this is a start.)

--

Edited June 1, 2016 by Gordon Fecyk
Found something

[Space Cat]

Flying aircraft is very easy, you just have to patient. Learning how to fly before you start building is stupid imo. The main differences in flight from stock to FAR from a pilots perspective is the relative lack of drag, the need for airbrakes, and needing to be more careful at higher speeds. There is also the fact that stalling is actually a thing, but this just means that stupid things that did not work very well in stock wont work at all. Once you figure out how to read the Data+Stability derivatives screen, you have figured most of it out. Reading the Wikipedia articles on different wing shapes and mach effects will teach you the rest.

[Nightside]

I don't think its stupid to look at existing designs, to find out what set ups work well before attempting to design your own.

[Raptor831]

There's a number of designs that come with FAR. I presume those would be the best to learn, since they've been designed specifically to showcase what FAR does and how to build planes for FAR.

You should also at least understand the "how to build planes" thread, and maybe a bit of aero engineering (i.e. a delta wing is good at high speeds but poor on landing and at low speeds), just so you have a nice foundation to build from. Learning to fly them isn't all that hard in KSP if you know how to make them stable, though. If you want to really fly planes often in KSP, use a joystick. It's gonna be a lot easier that way. And make use of the control aids in FAR to make sure you don't overcorrect or put yourself in a 20G turn and rip your wings off.  

[Nightside]

4 hours ago, Raptor831 said:

There's a number of designs that come with FAR. I presume those would be the best to learn, since they've been designed specifically to showcase what FAR does and how to build planes for FAR.

You should also at least understand the "how to build planes" thread, and maybe a bit of aero engineering (i.e. a delta wing is good at high speeds but poor on landing and at low speeds), just so you have a nice foundation to build from. Learning to fly them isn't all that hard in KSP if you know how to make them stable, though. If you want to really fly planes often in KSP, use a joystick. It's gonna be a lot easier that way. And make use of the control aids in FAR to make sure you don't overcorrect or put yourself in a 20G turn and rip your wings off.  

I should probably set up a game with just FAR. FAR + RO resizes a bunch of parts and messes up the planes.

[Gordon Fecyk]

Thanks for the replies so far.

I'm finding flying is the "easy" part. Landing is harder; I've either broken the landing gear from excessive speed, or I bounced too hard on the ground and can't right the craft quickly enough to try again, or something. The one thing that consistently works is adding radial parachutes at the centre of mass and just falling vertically.

I'll check the FAR download for example craft files. I'm trying to learn how to fly with flaps, which should help with my approach speeds and maybe shorten the takeoff distance.

I did manage to land the Aeris 3A only losing some control surfaces once, and I can fly the 4A to LKO and re-enter, but lost control after dropping below 100 m/s on approach. Finally, I have a Sidewinder Precision 2 joystick from my X-Wing Alliance days, and that works in KSP on Windows 10 without difficulty.

--

[Enceos]

@Gordon Fecyk There's a very good thread with links:

 

[Wjolcz]

Better build yourself something that resembles a real life plane. The stock crafts are nowhere near flyable with FAR.

Start with something simple: one or two engines in the fuselage, simple tail, a pair of wings.

Something that resembles Mig-9 should be OK for a FAR beginner. Just remember to keep the CoL behind CoM.

Edited June 12, 2016 by Veeltch

[Gordon Fecyk]

11 hours ago, Veeltch said:

Better build yourself something that resembles a real life plane. The stock crafts are nowhere near flyable with FAR.

Something that resembles Mig-9 should be OK for a FAR beginner. Just remember to keep the CoL behind CoM.

This was the end result of that:

Thanks for the tip! I at least have a place to start, now.

--

[Alias72]

That was really neat. A few things you may want to consider.

1. fix the landing gear (though you already know that)

2. Ideally you should be able to fly without SAS. Actually it would be better if you can fly without SAS as SAS is giving you all the vibration. To do this you will need to set aircraft trim so that you can fly straight and level

3. FAR has built in flight assistance to replace SAS. the most important is Dsomething. it scales control input with velocity to help prevent things from going pearshaped, followed by missile shaped as your wings rip off and you smash into the dirt.

4. You may want to consider adjusting your control surfaces. You appear to have way more authority than you need and this may make flying difficult.

5. I suggest adding the procedural wings mod from BAC 9. All it does is add wings and control surfaces that you can scale and shape yourself. I consider it a requirement when designing FAR craft (though judging from the planes I have seen not everyone agrees.)