What Facts Do We Know About The Devs Leaving?

[Gojira1000]

The only person in this thread with any first hand experience in the situation is RoverDude. Be smart and listen to him.

Primary source, people.

[metl]

@RoverDude If you're a puppet, can you be Walter, or Hose Halepeno? Is Jeff Dunham really controlling you? It's okay, you can tell us the truth. 

[Camacha]

1 hour ago, RoverDude said:

I am speaking for myself, so take that how you will.  Though the implication that I am some kind of 'puppet' is kinda nuts.  I do this because it's fun and I enjoy the folks I work with (by the way, there are more than two developers left, so that fact is incorrect).  And I respect the folks that moved on to other things (or back to modding).  I also respect that their views and experiences may be very different than mine.  Or exactly the same, but their great grand uncle left them all a sack of solid gold ingots.  Or that what I find reasonable they find unreasonable.  Or any number of reasons that they alone know.  But given how much grief I've gotten today (being called a liar and worse), I don't blame them one bit for sitting this one out.

 

Why do you gather this many people left in such a short time span?

 

6 minutes ago, Gojira1000 said:

The only person in this thread with any first hand experience in the situation is RoverDude. Be smart and listen to him.

Primary source, people.

The Iraqi Minister of Information says nothing is wrong. Please, people, nothing to see here. Return to your houses that are only slightly on fire.

Don't take this too seriously, it is just a joke.

Edited October 6, 2016 by Camacha

[Francois424]

Very good "Short version" of the whole thing.

Thanks !

[Mjp1050]

2 hours ago, Mycroft said:

Fact: Very few of these developers, if any, work or live anywhere near SQUAD headquarters in Mexico City, Mexico.

I hate to poke holes in what is otherwise a very nice debunk of conspiracy theories, but can I have a source on that? I don't think SQUAD would release that kind of information...

2 hours ago, Mycroft said:

Fact: The moderators have said they would resign if asked to delete posts for reasons other than rule violations. 

Not quite true. @Red Iron Crown actually said:

Quote

No moderator touched any posts on this subject. Our job is to enforce the forum rules and nothing more; if asked to censor for an agenda I think half or more of the mod team would resign, frankly speaking I would if so asked.

He's simply speculating for the other moderators, but he can't speak on their behalf.

[Camacha]

2 minutes ago, Mjp1050 said:

I hate to poke holes in what is otherwise a very nice debunk of conspiracy theories, but can I have a source on that? I don't think SQUAD would release that kind of information...

If a developer lives and works in another country, which is known in a number of cases, you can be pretty sure they do not work and live in Mexico.

2 minutes ago, Mjp1050 said:

Not quite true. @Red Iron Crown actually said:

He's simply speculating for the other moderators, but he can't speak on their behalf.

Also note that the rules are very broadly stated. There are plenty of rules in there that can be applied if the need is there. For instance:

Quote

Messages deemed to be rude, confrontational and otherwise disrespectful to staff may be removed immediately.

Disagreeing can be considered confrontational.

[wired2thenet]

What worries me the most?  If my 101-ton Duna mining operation can be landed in one trip successfully, which I finally succeeded in testing tonight (with my son staying up late to watch it happen live ... cheering and laughing when just about everything went wrong, but I still managed to land the ungainly beast intact, to many high-fives and dances).

(If you don't understand that statement, you need to take a break and go outside for a few hours and play in the rain).

Edited October 6, 2016 by wired2thenet
Fact-check

[Fred Cop]

Food for thought: Maybe SQUAD had planned this whole thing as a form of retirement in advance, and placed the barrier at the top of the fourm's home page in order to get new developers to take their place.

 

Just a thought.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Mycroft said:

Fact: As of today, there are only two developers left, according to the SQUAD staff lists on the forums.

Fact: No developer who left, except maybe one, have posted anywhere since, although all have been online since said incident.

Yep. We dun goofed.

Meet the 1.2 Update; the last KSP update to ever be released.

[Andem]

7 minutes ago, wired2thenet said:

What worries me the most?  If my 125-ton Duna mining operation can be landed in one trip successfully, which I finally succeeded in testing tonight (with my son staying up late to watch it happen live ... cheering and laughing when just about everything went wrong, but I still managed to land the ungainly beast intact, to many high-fives and dances).

(If you don't understand that statement, you need to take a break and go outside for a few hours and play in the rain).

Well that's great for you. Great for your son too. Now, please don't take this the wrong way, but why should we care?

[max_creative]

What do we know? The devs are leaving and I'm sad.  I'm even more sad because they removed the crying kerbal and now only have the sad kerbal. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Andem said:

Well that's great for you. Great for your son too. Now, please don't take this the wrong way, but why should we care?

PLEASE don't create reasons to close down this thread.

Just keep it civil. Please edit your post or something.

[Fred Cop]

7 minutes ago, Andem said:

Well that's great for you. Great for your son too. Now, please don't take this the wrong way, but why should we care?

I think what he (wired2thenet) is trying to say is that this isn't as big a deal as we think. Sure the 1.2 update may or may not be on the line, but we still have KSP and, of course, an extensive modding community to keep the game going for maybe a few more years.

 

At least, that is how I interpret his message.

[wired2thenet]

Just now, Andem said:

Well that's great for you. Great for your son too. Now, please don't take this the wrong way, but why should we care?

 

10 minutes ago, wired2thenet said:

(If you don't understand that statement, you need to take a break and go outside for a few hours and play in the rain).

^

It's a game.  Game companies have a history of Rapid Unexpected Disassembly.  They also have a history of multiple employees leaving at once for no good reason and for very valid reasons.  I've been a gaming insider since 1999, and have watched probably 2 or 3 dozen implode, and fans going nuts over it.  99% turned out to be for BS reasons, not wild speculation from fans.  I've seen a couple irritated devs post openly about bad experiences, but those are few and far between (and generally have more to do with employee performance than anything else).  Not saying that's the case here.  I've also seen a few companies implode for something similar to this, but once you're on the inside, you realize that it's not quite as complex, or if it is, it's not quite what you think it is.

For me, I read over the reddit and the various posts here.  Then when I went to tuck my son in bed while still reading about it, I said, "Hey, let's see if I can land this Kerbal contraption safely."

Get some fresh air.  For the moment, there's nothing to see here.

I'm going back to the GAME to land the lander again, just to prove I can do it reliably before converting it to my career game.  Because that's what is most important for this game right now ... having fun.  Why is everyone so wildly speculating over something that's an internal matter, instead of getting in the game and doing the impossible  most kerbal thing they can do?

5 minutes ago, Fred Cop said:

I think what he (wired2thenet) is trying to say is that this isn't as big a deal as we think. Sure the 1.2 update may or may not be on the line, but we still have KSP and, of course, an extensive modding community to keep the game going for maybe a few more years.

 

At least, that is how I interpret his message.

^^^^

[Mjp1050]

Also,  @max_creative, the crying Kerbal emoticon is still there. Click "Categories" in the top right corner of the emoticon window, then click "Emoticons", and the full list will appear.

[Mycroft]

Somebody made an opsie. 

 

[Bandus]

2 hours ago, RoverDude said:

Probably because when people asked for confirmation of horrible working conditions, but instead got an honest accounting of my interactions, it did not fit the torches and pitchforks narrative.

I work reasonable hours.  I get reasonable, agreed to compensation for that time.  I have been doing dev a long time, not the first rodeo.  I find the management reasonable, and they have repeatedly expressed that we were not to work ridiculous hours or weekends, etc. and have been reasonable when adjusting priorities, offering additional time as needed and only dictating the order of the business needs.  i.e. rational, reasonable stuff that I would expect from an employer.

I have seen teams flee from horrible employers.  I have seen teams move from reasonable ones for better opportunities.  I've lost engineers because the fit was not right, and I've walked away from jobs that were handing me sacks of cash with dollar signs on them.  People move on, and they usually do so in waves.  I've been the leader on more than one of those waves myself (one company lost their entire IT and engineering staff in less than three months... they rehired, and are fine now), and have had to mitigate damage from mutinies and make sure the business was solid because one guy got grouchy and took half a dozen buddies with him to a new job.

But one common thread in all of that - I respected the wishes of my coworkers and employer, and respected people's privacy. 

I am speaking for myself, so take that how you will.  Though the implication that I am some kind of 'puppet' is kinda nuts.  I do this because it's fun and I enjoy the folks I work with (by the way, there are more than two developers left, so that fact is incorrect).  And I respect the folks that moved on to other things (or back to modding).  I also respect that their views and experiences may be very different than mine.  Or exactly the same, but their great grand uncle left them all a sack of solid gold ingots.  Or that what I find reasonable they find unreasonable.  Or any number of reasons that they alone know.  But given how much grief I've gotten today (being called a liar and worse), I don't blame them one bit for sitting this one out.

 

Thank you for making this post. Hearing your perspective is enlightening and appreciated. 

[Andem]

2 minutes ago, Fred Cop said:

I think what he (wired2thenet) is trying to say is that this isn't as big a deal as we think. Sure the 1.2 update may or may not be on the line, but we still have KSP and, of course, an extensive modding community to keep the game going for maybe a few more years.

 

At least, that is how I interpret his message.

I can get that, but the fact that he is having fun with his son isn't exactly a great reason for why I should be concerned when a company loses nearly all of it's developers.

 

1 minute ago, wired2thenet said:

It's a game.  Game companies have a history of Rapid Unexpected Disassembly.  They also have a history of multiple employees leaving at once for no good reason and for very valid reasons.  I've been a gaming insider since 1999, and have watched probably 2 or 3 dozen implode, and fans going nuts over it.  99% turned out to be for BS reasons, not wild speculation from fans.  I've seen a couple irritated devs post openly about bad experiences, but those are few and far between (and generally have more to do with employee performance than anything else).  Not saying that's the case here.  I've also seen a few companies implode for something similar to this, but once you're on the inside, you realize that it's not quite as complex, or if it is, it's not quite what you think it is.

I've watched plenty of game companies fall apart. And I've been extremely upset that games I loved suddenly died between major patches. So forgive me for being passionate about Squad's future and not liking things that don't look good for the company's future.

6 minutes ago, wired2thenet said:

Get some fresh air.  For the moment, there's nothing to see here.

Having only two developers on the dev team right now is concerning, and is most certainly something to see. Allegations of poor workplace conditions, true or not, are definitely something to see, and pretending that it isn't is absurd.

9 minutes ago, wired2thenet said:

I'm going back to the GAME to land the lander again, just to prove I can do it reliably before converting it to my career game.  Because that's what is most important for this game right now ... having fun.  Why is everyone so wildly speculating over something that's an internal matter, instead of getting in the game and doing the impossible  most kerbal thing they can do?

Good for you, you don't have to care. No need to passively insult the people who do care, though.

[Camacha]

2 minutes ago, Andem said:

Good for you, you don't have to care. No need to passively insult the people who do care, though.

It does not seem to be intended as an insult. It is logical tempers will get a bit heated, but I see nothing wrong here.

[Kerbal Kommander]

I wish all this speculation would stop, and people just wait for the announcement next week.  My thought is they intend to release 1.2 as stated, and maybe we will get some delicious morsels of information as to the future of KSP, and what updates/expansions lay ahead.  I don't see KSP coming to an end with all the doom and gloom talk that seems rampant on the forums.  There is a strong community, they have stated there are plans for more KSP to come, and with the two of those the future of KSP seems bright for certain.

I am sorry that the dev team has to even hear all this crying about KSP being over when it seems they have so much more in store for us.  I don't know about the rest of you, but I can't wait to see what 1.3 has in store for us!

[severedsolo]

7 minutes ago, Kerbal Kommander said:

I am sorry that the dev team has to even hear all this crying about KSP being over when it seems they have so much more in store for us.  I don't know about the rest of you, but I can't wait to see what 1.3 has in store for us!

Ah I'm sure they are used to it by now. This happens regularly around here (not the devs leaving, but there is always some controversy).

As for 1.3, I'm not confident there is going to be one, but as you said, let's wait and see. I'll be happy if 1.2 is the final version.

[Mycroft]

52 minutes ago, Mjp1050 said:

I hate to poke holes in what is otherwise a very nice debunk of conspiracy theories, but can I have a source on that? I don't think SQUAD would release that kind of information...

I heard it from the other forum, but after slogging through ten pages, I couldn't find it. I think @RoverDude confirmed it. 

55 minutes ago, Mjp1050 said:

Not quite true. @Red Iron Crown actually said:

He's simply speculating for the other moderators, but he can't speak on their behalf.

Noted and changed. I've heard at least two other moderators say similar things, though, so I'll downgrade it a bit.

[Argyle MHF]

10 minutes ago, severedsolo said:

As for 1.3, I'm not confident there is going to be one, but as you said, let's wait and see. I'll be happy if 1.2 is the final version.
 

I am not confident there will be another 1.x version. I think 2.x is the road they are about to go down. with small updates/fixes & DLC as bait for us to follow them.

My big fear is that road will be paved courtesy of Ubisoft. Or worse: EA. Now. if Microsoft were to pick up Squad, that's a different story.

Edited October 6, 2016 by Argyle MHF
incorrect quoting/formatting

[mcirish3]

 There are a few promises left unfulfilled.
 Chief among it is multiplayer which has been promised repeatedly for 1.3 or 1.4. Is that to no longer be a thing?  I don't have a list of other promised features handy at the moment but I am guessing most of that does not matter now?

There is talk that there will be expansions.
 Will the promise made to me and many others who purchased early development be kept, namely that all expansions will be given to those early account holders free of charge?

I am just asking... not sure anyone can answer.
 

[neamerjell]

41 minutes ago, wired2thenet said:

It's a game.  Game companies have a history of Rapid Unexpected Disassembly.  They also have a history of multiple employees leaving at once for no good reason and for very valid reasons.

 

Perhaps someone remembers the game publisher Interplay or the development company Volition? They made awesome  (now classic) games such as Descent 1,2 and 3, Descent: Freespace and Freespace 2. They just up and vanished one day. Back then, the Internet was far from what it is today (Geocities was still new - that's how far back then), so few if any knew why the creators of Descent, et al were no more. I believe the historical records say they ran out of money and were bought by other companies.