[0.17] Crew-able empty pods 0.3.1

[exegesis]

Downloaded it a dozen times, it says its corrupt. Can someone just upload it as a .zip without a password? This is silly.

Here is the link to a .zip for everyone who couldn\'t get the other link working: http://www./?5rfdjb10dv8xazn

[Pablock]

I don\'t think Squad\'s 'intellectual property' should be mirrored outside their own forums. (official word on this?)

[talktalktalktalk]

I might use this for taking lots of Kerbals TO the moon. Mun*. =P

[PLB]

I have made a part that works just like this, looks like a Mk 3 fuselage, but doesn\'t have a hatch for crew, and therefore cannot be accessed by Kerbals. if someone could figure out how to make the downloadable below have a crew hatch, then I will give them 500 Kerbucks. (When your 172)

[willow]

Downloaded it a dozen times, it says its corrupt. Can someone just upload it as a .zip without a password? This is silly.

Here is the link to a .zip for everyone who couldn\'t get the other link working: http://www./?5rfdjb10dv8xazn

Thanks, I can try it out thanks to you!

His idea was better by a wide margin than his distribution method... >

[Pablock]

Well, I updated the file in the OP to be a passwordless standard old zip.

Nothing more to add.

[claypigeon]

So I\'ve been playing with using these in an Apollo-style munar lander (with MechJeb). Unfortunately, lack of any built-in steering makes these hard to pilot as separate craft.

Is there any way we can 'recast' these parts as RCS blocks? I tried making them SAS modules, and the results were ugly. Making them RCS blocks (with appropriately defined thrusters) would as least give the pod steering ability (while the fuel held out).

[Pablock]

My first approach was also having them being SAS modules, and as you said it doesn\'t work. I\'ll look into making them 'huge rcs thrusters' after I clean update my operating system today/tomorrow.

[nubeees]

so if you want debris to be controllable, use mechjeb, but can you plz make crew pods that com with kerbals inside them? so instead of taking off with 3 kerbals, you have 6 during takeoff.

[iffy]

can you plz make crew pods that com with kerbals inside them? so instead of taking off with 3 kerbals, you have 6 during takeoff.

Simple, build a crew bus in the SPH and launch, then start your half crewed rocket at the pad but don't launch it- Switch to your bus and drive/fly/crash over to the pad and fill your rocket

[nubeees]

Simple, build a crew bus in the SPH and launch, then start your half crewed rocket at the pad but don't launch it- Switch to your bus and drive/fly/crash over to the pad and fill your rocket

well, that would work too, but what if your rocket is tall? Also this would save time and be much simpler (if thats even a word )

[claypigeon]

so if you want debris to be controllable, use mechjeb, but can you plz make crew pods that com with kerbals inside them? so instead of taking off with 3 kerbals, you have 6 during takeoff.

The problem is that while MechJeb keeps the debris active, your ability to pilot is greatly reduced because the "pod" doesn't have built in attitude control like actual pods. RCS and vectoring thrust gives you some ability, but it's a very imperfect solution. You can't turn with RCS without giving yourself some horizontal momentum.

[One01x]

I don't know if this has been asked already, but can you make a Mk.3 Fuselage with space for 3 Kerbals, as I need to rescue a pilot but I want to use a plane with only one pod, and If we could use Mk.3 fuel tank sized storage, then We could make airliners (and also rescue stranded pilots with my B-17.) Thanks!

[MrMoog]

The problem is that while MechJeb keeps the debris active, your ability to pilot is greatly reduced because the "pod" doesn't have built in attitude control like actual pods. RCS and vectoring thrust gives you some ability, but it's a very imperfect solution. You can't turn with RCS without giving yourself some horizontal momentum.

I discovered a way around this problem.

You first need to make sure that the name of the empty pod folders end up alphabetically after the real pods in the parts folder. It is not the case with the Mk1-2 pod.

Like this:

mk1pod

mk1podEmpty

Then, in the .cfg files, you need to make sure that the part type is Strut, and that the names (this is the important part) are exactly the same as the real command pods (ex.: mk1pod).

For reasons that are beyond me, this results in the empty pods to be recognized as real pod, with the correct icon in the staging list (not in the VAB), and attitude/torque control of the real pod when decoupled.

It's like the game detect a module with the name of what is supposed to be a command pod, and treat it as such.

Big problems happen when the empty pod is loaded before the real pod when the game is loading, hence the need to make sure that the folder name of the empty pod comes after the folder of the real pod. Otherwise you will see weird behaviors in the VAB.

The only problem right now is that MechJeb's WASDQE inputs are inverted on a decoupled stage equipped with a MechJeb, which renders it uncontrollable. I also strongly suggest using MechJeb 1.9, since version 1.9.1 is currently broken for use on multiple decoupled stages.

[claypigeon]

Wow...it works...sort of

The controls seem worse than inverted. I feel like I'm playing a carnival game.

[Ekku Zakku]

Wow that is an amazing fix! Seriously, I couldn't even get separated parts to control even with MechJeb, but now I'm able to, and I can even control gear and such, this is perfect! Not a single problem either, not inverted or anything, and I'm using 1.9.1 of MechJeb. Now I just need to see if I can decouple stuff while I'm using the pod XD

It also allows you to see all your Kerbonauts even if one is in an "empty" pod, whereas before they would just disappear from the crew list on the bottom-right. I haven't tested it with more than 3 crew members though, so I'm looking forward to hearing about that as well.

[MrMoog]

Glad to hear it worked. But you are lucky, I have a plethora of game-breaking problems with MechJeb 1.9.1.

For the inverted commands, do you have two or more MechJebs installed, one on the main and one on the decoupled part? What MechJeb model did you use (1m, rad, etc...)? What is the order you installed them on the ship (main pod first, escape pod first, etc...)? The problem does not happen when using a single MechJeb.

There's still the issue of kerbal portrait being overexposed, but it's only a cosmetic problem. Kerbals inside a pod can still be accessed directly by clicking on the hatch, so no problem when using more than 3 kerbals.

As for decoupling on the escape pod, it is currently not possible, for decoupling activates all part on the stage. Any decouplers would be activated at the same time. I hope this changes someday though!

[Ekku Zakku]

@MrMoog, going up, I have a Mk1-2 Command Pod, a stack decoupler, MechJeb fuel pod + engines + legs, Mk1 Command Pod (empty) with your changes, then a "Mechanical Jeb" module (the one that fits on top of the Mk1 pod)

What I also did was make sure to move one of my Kerbals up to the Mk1 Pod that starts out empty, then decouple, and then switch to the correct part (as you might know, there are two "parts" you can switch to if you use MechJeb with these crewable empty pods), and I have full control as if it was a normal command pod, and nothing is inverted.

Also 1.9.1 of MechJeb fixed the issue of decoupling all of the decouplers, so that isn't a problem now, but I also just did a test with the new large decouplers (the ones you can decouple by right-clicking) and I was able to successfully decouple things from my separated pod! Which means my dream of an Apollo-style lander where you leave the landing engine/legs/etc module on the moon (while the crew pod gets back into orbit) is finally possible! Although the only problem is that it seems like I can't resize the new decouplers; they'll be smaller in the VAB, but once I launch the vehicle, they'll go back to their original size. I think it might be that the configs for the new decouplers don't have the "scale = ..." line in them, but I haven't tested it yet (am about to though).

[Ekku Zakku]

(I would edit my last post, but there isn't an edit button, my apologies in advance)

Stupid me, I forgot to change the name from the original large decouplers, so they were just being replaced by the original ones instead of staying as the smaller ones that I edited. Fixed that, so now I can finally prepare my Apollo-style lander for a moon landing XD

Also yes it does seem like the portrait of a kerbal in another pod is overexposed, but it is very minor compared to trying to right-click an empty pod to do an EVA, definitely took some finicking to get to where you could right-click it sometimes.

[MrMoog]

Thanks for the answer. I didn't know about the manual decoupler, I'll have to try this out. Are those the radial, rectangular decoupler, or the 2m linear decoupler?

As for the "two parts" you can switch to, is one of them centered on the decoupled ship, but without any parts? This is the bug I was talking about for 1.9.1. If you try to end flight on this part, you'll see weird stuff. The "ghost part", like I call it, causes many problems in my case. You might see them if you play around the 2 ships, and try to land using the MechJeb for example. The ghost part is not present in 1.9.

I can't wait for Squad to include all those functionality in the vanilla game.

[CrashnBurn]

Ekku, you can copy the decoupler1-2 folder rename it decoupler1-2small, change the name = decoupler1-2small in the part.cfg, and change the rescaleFactor = 0.5 and you will have a new 1m decoupler that is right-clickable to decouple, as well as keeping your stock 2m decoupler part.

[Ekku Zakku]

It's the 2m one, the large sized stack decoupler for the new fuel tanks and stuff.

Yeah, the ghost part shouldn't be a problem for me as I'm planning on leaving that part in orbit, so it shouldn't be a big deal. It's kind easy to tell when you're on the right part to end the flight, so hopefully it'll just be something you can avoid.

And I know, I've been wanting to do this for a while, and I originally thought I would have to wait for docking or something. I'm only just now able to do what I wanted to do, despite the fact that I already should have had the ability with MechJeb and such XD I can't thank you enough for posting about that command pod fix.

Edit: @CrashnBurn yeah I figured it out, can't believe it took me that long to realize why it was changing back to the large one though lol. It's working fine for me now =D

Edited August 16, 2012 by Ekku Zakku

[MrMoog]

@Ekku: I would suggest you to do more testing with the ghost part. What I saw was that this "part" is in fact a buggy copy of the decoupled stage, without any part attached to it. You can see in the save file that it has exactly the same general attributes as the decoupled ship, but with no part list. The ghost part is "connected" to the decoupled ship and cannot be left in orbit. I would also suggest to test a landing of the decoupled ship, the ghost part have unwanted effects and can lead to the game being stuck and needing a Alt+F4 to close.

If it's not the case, it's great for you and that means I need to find a way to also avoid this issue. And thanks for the decoupler pointers, it will be very useful

[Ekku Zakku]

Oh yeah, I have had the problem once where I couldn't end a flight and ended up having to delete my save to get rid of the bugged parts. And I'm planning on leaving the decoupled part in orbit so it'll stay with that, hopefully at least XD but yeah, I think my Mun landing will be enough of a test to see if I can work around the bugs or not. I'm just about done with the ship actually, so I'll give an update in an hour or so.

Edit (way longer than an hour later, had to go somewhere): Well I ran into the inverted controls problem in my Mun mission... Of course it's just fine when I test it, then when I get to the Mun with the whole shebang, it's all messed up. I even went into Kerbin orbit with my original small launch pad test vehicle (where I determined the controls were perfectly fine) and it still controlled correctly, but that was with just the pod and a few small bits added on. I guess it's when I add more parts? Could be something else, but I'm gonna have to wait until tomorrow to test it.

Edited August 17, 2012 by Ekku Zakku

[KospY]

It's possible to include the "control" of the pod directly ? Some sort of plugin that will add the controlable possibilty to the pod (like mechjeb)