[1.4.5] HullBreach - Making things Sink

[Guest]

@CVerts Kinda off topic, but aren't those my configs I made?

Idk if I still have them on github, but if I do, I might have some time later to fix them. Right now I'm gonna play some ksp.

[Guest]

Mind if I bump this?

[gomker]

9 hours ago, Murican_Jeb said:

Mind if I bump this?

I don't know whats going on  

Prepping for beta release of BDA - Will be releasing compatible HullBreach version at the same time as the damage model has changed.

[Dragonwarp]

Is this a RAM heavy mod? I don't want to destroy my computer

[Kerbal Gamer]

Hello. I am having problems with this mod. The parts fill up with sea water, but do no sink. I am using the large boat parts mod and it is not sinking even though it has max sea water. Is there any remedy for this problem? I tried increasing the seawater density to 2 but it didn't work. Please help.

[HorizonFulcrum]

@gomker

Quick question, are you planning on implementing/implementing compatibility with updated BDAc? As I know they switched to the HP system not far long ago.

 

EDIT 1: Never mind, just understood the meaning of your last post.

Edited January 4, 2018 by HorizonFulcrum
See above

[gomker]

On 1/3/2018 at 11:31 PM, HorizonFulcrum said:

@gomker

Quick question, are you planning on implementing/implementing compatibility with updated BDAc? As I know they switched to the HP system not far long ago.

 

EDIT 1: Never mind, just understood the meaning of your last post.

This dev version should work with Pre-Release BDA 1.1 if you are using that - https://www.dropbox.com/s/54s7i9s2vtk2hy9/HullBreach.0.1.6.2_12022017.zip?dl=0

On 12/24/2017 at 1:00 PM, Dragonwarp said:

Is this a RAM heavy mod? I don't want to destroy my computer

So in of itself no - but the explosions created _could_ slow things down say if a very large boat sank with lots of parts. But that is kind of the point, to clean up parts after a boat is destroyed and show the effect.

On 1/3/2018 at 5:01 PM, Kerbal Gamer said:

Hello. I am having problems with this mod. The parts fill up with sea water, but do no sink. I am using the large boat parts mod and it is not sinking even though it has max sea water. Is there any remedy for this problem? I tried increasing the seawater density to 2 but it didn't work. Please help.

Spanner just released another update with tweaks to SeaWater amounts.  Can you tell me which parts you are using or give me a link to your craft file.
Also be sure to clear your MM Cache and part database file when updating SM Mods, we make lots of changes to MM configs that sometimes need refreshing.

[b0ss]

Super cool mod, can't believe I haven't seen this before  Any way to make this work with Kerbal Krash System?

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

47 minutes ago, b0ss said:

Super cool mod, can't believe I haven't seen this before  Any way to make this work with Kerbal Krash System?

Hi, not so far as i'm aware, the mod now uses links to BDA in order to manage/measure damage and create appropriate sinking effects . It'd seem more appropriate if KKS could be made to work on BDA damage as a whole, this mod simply allows BDA damage to cause flooding. The dents and scrapes have to be done on a part level and be caused by something KKS recognises as damage.  I'm aware that some members of the BDA team have attempted to get something going in that direction, in relation to KKS and BDA working together  but i don't recall anything coming of it.

[b0ss]

Damn, yeah I've wanted BDA + KKS compatibility for a long time now haha. Heat-based damage seems like such an odd and conflicting system to use

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

14 minutes ago, b0ss said:

Damn, yeah I've wanted BDA + KKS compatibility for a long time now haha. Heat-based damage seems like such an odd and conflicting system to use

Thats NOT how BDA works anymore, Damage is proportional to impact/and or explosion, parts do not get hot any longer.

Every part has an assigned hit point and armor value, each hit removes X hit points . At Y  remaining hit points ( around 70-80% depending on craft)  Hullbreach triggers the hullbreach and sea water flows,  and at Z damage ( 10-20% remaining)  , as most ships can survive a small breach for a while , so receive further damage, the critical hull breach is triggered finally sinking the ship fairly quickly .

It's not all over till it's over and a strategy of using resource convertor based sea water pumps, triggered at launch by AG (supplied here and SM Marine)  can keep a ship suffering minor damage , in the fight for a good while.

But not always

[b0ss]

Aha, so there is a way to make KKS work with BDA's "hitpoint" system? (And what about modded parts?)

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

36 minutes ago, b0ss said:

Aha, so there is a way to make KKS work with BDA's "hitpoint" system? (And what about modded parts?)

Not that I'm aware of,  as it requires the author of KKS to actively take an interest in making the changes needed, BDA code is unlikely to change to suit, i doubt very much whether the team would be happy dumping almost a years intensive, hair pulling,  work in order so that players can have a dent or two .

A part is a part modded or not the game doesn't care if it was made by squad or Bob.  99% of mods can affect other mods or parts via MM patches, and as always it would be completely up to the part creator if they wanted to adopt the KKS system, much like I have with SMM and LBP using Hullbreach. From my understanding of what KKS does that would seem to be either an inclusion or exclusion patch, fit this module or exclude this part for example  Which is a lot easier than setting something up to get good, feels right ,  results with hullbreach

However, this all seems like more a subject for the KKS thread rather than this one. As that's the avenue for change, there are a few mods now that link into BDA damage or other systems in order to add more to the combat immersion,  so there are working methods in use that would allow KKS to talk to BDA

[b0ss]

1 hour ago, SpannerMonkey(smce) said:

...there are a few mods now that link into BDA damage or other systems in order to add more to the combat immersion,  so there are working methods in use that would allow KKS to talk to BDA

Alright, sounds rad, I wasn't aware of such addons! What would I need to look up to find those? Thanks man

Edited February 6, 2018 by b0ss

[Warth_IX]

I think I need assistance with this mod.

I have been experimenting with the mod and I have a bit of a problem. In general the breach process is too fast and exacerbates too quickly. for example I am using large boat parts as my ship pieces and from that i am using a simple 2 hull part destroyer for my testing.
The breach first occurs at around 70% hull damage, however as soon as the the hull starts taking on water the in flow of water accelerates insanely fast. The sea water resource goes from 0 to 10K in less than a second and this causes the front half of the ship to be ripped off and sent to the depths with a speed as if a fist from god had smashed down on it.

I tried reducing the hull breach flow values in the LBP_MM config file down to 1 for hull breach and 10 for critical breach. This slowed the process down a bit but the whole ship still sinks in only a few seconds.
even with nearly 20 water pumps on the ship it can not counter this process. only by cranking the pumps up to 10x their original output is the system able to keep up with the water and even then it requires multiple pumps.

So here are my questions.
I have noticed that in the LBP_MM config file the "breachTemp" value is set to 0.8  and the critBreachTemp=0.5 
however in the settings config file these values are set to breachTemp = 0.59999999999999998 and critBreachTemp = 0.90000000000000002

What impact do any of these values have on the actual sinking rate/progression?

I have tried tests, changing these values does not seem to have any definable effect.
in almost every case that I have tested once the ship starts sinking a little bit, it instantly goes catastrophic 

Any help with this would be great.
Ideally I would like to be able to customize when the Breach and critical breach happen,
if for example, the actual breach event took place around 50-60% and the Crit Breach around 15%
likewise the actual sinking rate on a normal breach should be way slower, Like something that might be recoverable from and the breach should not go critical until the the hull reaches 15% 

if I can't get these issues resolved I will have to pull this mod from my next video series.

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

H

1 hour ago, Warth_IX said:

I think I need assistance with this mod.

HI the problem is not with the HB mod but with the patches that control how it functions, and that my friend has little or nothing to do with Hull breach.
I suspect you are running fairly early HB patches, so the flood etc is quite fast, we don't do it that way now, plus all the armor was weak on the last few releases because it was all in development . time has passed and gun damage is sorted so  we now have a better idea of whats needed . 

As always with mod difficulties try the mod concerned that being in this case LBP, as that is where the rectification will come from.

Breach temp is now linked to BDA damage directly and your comment about the patch values confirms that the HB patches you currently use are way out of date, breach now occurs at between 10/20%   of damage occurring  being 80% of total,  hence  breachTemp = 0.8      and critical breach at about 60-80% damage , so critBreachTemp = 0.4. 

Currently dealing with a HD failure , so PM me and i'll send you some updated patches for armor and flood settings etc

[Warth_IX]

Ok Just to clarify I am using the following versions
HullBreach.0.1.6.2_12022017
BDArmory.1.1.0.23471_12292017
Large_Boat_Parts_Pack-v3.9.2

I just want to verify that these are indeed outdated/invalid/misbehaving version

also I seem to not have enough post on the forum site to be allow to send you a direct message

Edited March 12, 2018 by Warth_IX
Hit submit on accident

[Warth_IX]

On 3/11/2018 at 3:05 PM, SpannerMonkey(smce) said:

HI the problem is not with the HB mod but with the patches that control how it functions, and that my friend has little or nothing to do with Hull breach.
I suspect you are running fairly early HB patches, so the flood etc is quite fast, we don't do it that way now, plus all the armor was weak on the last few releases because it was all in development . time has passed and gun damage is sorted so  we now have a better idea of whats needed . 

As always with mod difficulties try the mod concerned that being in this case LBP, as that is where the rectification will come from.

Breach temp is now linked to BDA damage directly and your comment about the patch values confirms that the HB patches you currently use are way out of date, breach now occurs at between 10/20%   of damage occurring  being 80% of total,  hence  breachTemp = 0.8      and critical breach at about 60-80% damage , so critBreachTemp = 0.4. 

Currently dealing with a HD failure , so PM me and i'll send you some updated patches for armor and flood settings etc

ok do you know if Hull Breach would have a problem with the UbioZur Welding Ltd. Continued Mod? would it still recognize a welded hull as a hull part and thus have it be subject to breach?

[XOC2008]

7 minutes ago, Warth_IX said:

ok do you know if Hull Breach would have a problem with the UbioZur Welding Ltd. Continued Mod? would it still recognize a welded hull as a hull part and thus have it be subject to breach?

I can't tell you for sure but I have to imagine that there may be some problem with having enough seawater for sinking or it just might not work at all.

[Warth_IX]

Ok I will try it out as a test and report back

[Dimas152]

i have a suggestion
the damaged part should be the fisrt one to get flooded, after it's full of water, it continues to flood the nearest part, after the next part gets full, it continues again to the next nearest part, so the ships will sunk realistically
not like getting hit in one part and all of the ship sinks simultaneously

Edited March 13, 2018 by [INDO]dimas_1502

[jack gamer]

Mine just explodes the entire ship when I hit it.

Nvm, the ship sunk when I shot it with a missile twice, its kinda sad that the parts explode when the depths crush them, it should've got crumbled when it reaches the depths.

Edited April 5, 2018 by jack gamer

[cdough]

Im also having an issue with the sinking time on ships, they instantly sink. I have the bdarmoury update that has hp instead of temperature damage. What is the compatible Hullbreach update that goes with it. My version of BDarmoury is v1.1.0

[Dimas152]

bumping this thread hoping OP notices it

[SpannerMonkey(smce)]

On 3/13/2018 at 7:58 AM, [INDO]dimas_1502 said:

i have a suggestion
the damaged part should be the fisrt one to get flooded, after it's full of water, it continues to flood the nearest part, after the next part gets full, it continues again to the next nearest part, so the ships will sunk realistically
not like getting hit in one part and all of the ship sinks simultaneously

Hi it's already been suggested,  I recall that without reworking the whole structure that it was not easily achievable . 

On 5/29/2018 at 11:51 PM, cdough said:

Im also having an issue with the sinking time on ships, they instantly sink. I

The hullbreach patches  within the HB folder itself and those accompany whatever mod parts you use for ships are responsible for the sinking speed and behavior . They can be finitely tuned to a particular behavior however it takes a considerable time, and requires that every KSP update that every part is rechecked and re balanced to suit.   Also sinking behavior is constantly being tweaked for better results, so make sure you have the most up to date HB patches available .

The last group set available for SM mods are linked below,  be aware that certain SM ships and parts have internal custom settings which will over ride anything here
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fu2obl8awx70phv/HullBreach latest patches for SM Mods 010618.zip?dl=0

Simply unzip and overwrite the Hullbreach patches contained with the Hullbreach  mod
 

18 minutes ago, [INDO]dimas_1502 said:

bumping this thread hoping OP notices it

The OP is aware and  currently buried in real life, recovering (ironically enough ) from a large flood