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Development Update for Consoles!

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You make some good points there, @jake867. But I would imagine that a release date would only increase the likelihood of another stress-botched release.

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Yea i guess thats alot worse than no release date

Edited by jake867
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8 hours ago, Deddly said:

You make some good points there, @jake867. But I would imagine that a release date would only increase the likelihood of another stress-botched release.

"Stress Botched Release"? I don't remember console gamers in an frenzied uproar about KSP coming to console.

In fact, I seem to be very surprised when KSP made it to console when it did. Console gamers weren't frothing at the mouth demanding KSP come to console. 

Bottom line is that the horrible release version is solely Squads fault. Console gamers had nothing to do with it. And now we're suffering the consequences of something we had no part of.

Edited by LegendaryAce
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News from today's Weekly is encouraging.

5 hours ago, SQUAD said:

In other news, console testing continues with daily builds from Blitworks being put through their paces on both platforms, and now we’re more able to concentrate on the refinements in controls and general gameplay rather than outright bugs. Many long hours are being dedicated to getting all things ready for the inevitable releases of each project. An example of the testing our QA team has been busy with are the console achievements system, which took longer than what we expected due to the thoroughness of the team. A good thing is that during all this testing, we still haven’t had any save files blow up on us yet either.

Now that we’re getting closer to the release date of the console build, we’ve been also very busy preparing the communication materials. That includes updating videos and images for the respective stores of each console, among other things.

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25 minutes ago, jake867 said:

Whats Q4?

Fourth quarter, the last three months of the year, October-November-December.

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Yep. Though even that's optimistic in my opinion. One can only hope though.

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So are refunds possible for the game? Im past done with it, biggest mistake of my life buying a console

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4 minutes ago, jake867 said:

So are refunds possible for the game? Im past done with it, biggest mistake of my life buying a console

If it's past 48 hours since your purchase, no. That's why almost all console owners are beyond liquided at this game. Not only is it broken, but we can't even have our money back.

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Isnt that technically false advertisement theve known it is broken but they’re still selling it to people on the ps store i mean i just bought mine like 2 months ago and had i known it was broken i wouldnt have wasted my time/money

Edited by jake867

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It is exactly. Now you see why me and everyone else is so upset? How this game EVER passed Cert testing is beyond me. For a game to pass Cert testing, it needs to work, not crash, and not have stability issues. This game has all of them.

Most people didn't get refunds because the game save issues usually happened after the refund period was over. So the fact that we've been waiting almost a year for a fix is absolutely ridiculous.

Not to mention that PC got their update and maybe another while we suffered.

Edited by LegendaryAce
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15 minutes ago, jake867 said:

Isnt that technically false advertisement theve known it is broken but they’re still selling it to people on the ps store i mean i just bought mine like 2 months ago and had i known it was broken i wouldnt have wasted my time/money

It's arguably unethical, unprincipled, unprofessional, and any number of other negative things, but "false advertisement" has a very specific definition that most likely is voided by the EULA you agreed to when you purchased. The phrase "not guaranteed suitable for any particular purpose" is common language in such documents, which means SQUAD isn't legally claiming that their product does anything at all, a standard below which it is hard to fall.

tl;dr: Go after the simple things you can prove, not arcane legalese that would require help from a lawyer to confirm.

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13 minutes ago, HebaruSan said:

It's arguably unethical, unprincipled, unprofessional, and any number of other negative things, but "false advertisement" has a very specific definition that most likely is voided by the EULA you agreed to when you purchased. The phrase "not guaranteed suitable for any particular purpose" is common language in such documents, which means SQUAD isn't legally claiming that their product does anything at all, a standard below which it is hard to fall.

tl;dr: Go after the simple things you can prove, not arcane legalese that would require help from a lawyer to confirm.

Doesn't matter. When you upload something on Microsoft's or Sony's online store, you're giving those companies your word that the product works. Devs have to agree that the product doesn't suffer from any game breaking issues. I know this because I've seen how the Apple Store works.

Also, why should they get to keep our money for a product they've yet to fix? They have my $40, as well as the $40 of every other console player.

Now let's be generous and say that 2 million console owners bought the game (1 million for Xbox, 1 million for PS4). Now let's pretend that both companies took away 20% from each game they sold for a publisher's fee. That means that in this hypothetical scenario, Squad made $64,000,000! With all that money, they still haven't released a patch! And you're telling me that it's not their fault?

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Just now, LegendaryAce said:

And you're telling me that it's not their fault?

No, I haven't said anything remotely similar to that. You can scroll up and re-read to confirm, if you like.

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Maneuver node adjustment sans cursor looks great in the dev notes, er, weekly update.  Having watched a number of console players struggle with the game on twitch.tv, manipulating the maneuver node system was one of the most egregious offenders.   Seems to me to be decent evidence that the update is going to be a good one.  

My guess is that it is taking longer than hoped (theres not much time left to release it before the halfway point in the year, after which any release cant be seen as "early 2017") because they know they cant afford any more ill will another botched console release would bring.  My hope is theyve learned their lesson and Blitzwork has been tasked to make their build as solid as possible. 

 

Regarding refunds, you guys should be taking it up with your respective console stores.  Explain to them in no uncertain terms the situation, and if you can send them links and evidence to support, perhaps you still have some daylight to get a refund.  I think the tactic of "how could you let this game pass your QA review, Sony/MS?" Is the best angle.  Certainly the lack of any updates yet (ps4) or the failed-to-fix-the-problem-update would be another great point. Squad having switch console port teams would be yet another.  

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10 hours ago, jake867 said:

Isnt that technically false advertisement theve known it is broken but they’re still selling it to people on the ps store i mean i just bought mine like 2 months ago and had i known it was broken i wouldnt have wasted my time/money

Unfortunately this would fall under Caveat Emptor (let the buyer beware). A little time checking out consumer (not website/magazine reviews, this forum may have been the best bet) would have revealed the issues to you, to make an informed choice. I waited to hear how it was working for others, before deciding not to let my boys buy it (yet).

As for the Sony and Microsoft stores not flagging it or pulling it, that's a different story, and I have no idea why they continue to let it sell as normal. Which should be grounds for refunds, IMO.

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2 hours ago, klesh said:

(theres not much time left to release it before the halfway point in the year, after which any release cant be seen as "early 2017")

Well, I suppose that's one way to interpret that phrase. What about this: "early- 2017?"

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14 hours ago, HebaruSan said:

No, I haven't said anything remotely similar to that. You can scroll up and re-read to confirm, if you like.

I was being facetious. My point being that no one has accountability for this issue, when it's so easy to see whose fault it is.

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16 hours ago, LegendaryAce said:

when it's so easy to see whose fault it is.

Well, who's fault is it?

  • Squad, making a bad decision choosing the porting company?
  • Squad, for deciding to port to console at all?
  • Squad, not being able to force FTE to do proper work, be it due to insufficient contract power or FTE not being able to do better?
  • FTE, for miss-representing their capabilities?  If someone says "We are going to make a hash of it", who would hire them?  So either FTE was deluded or lying (or both)
  • FTE for making a hash out of it?
  • FTE for not saying earlier "Sorry, cannot do ..." and ending the contract?
  • Squad for not testing the port properly?
  • Squad for giving some sort of OK (maybe in the contract) for the result to be uploaded?
  • The console stores for not properly vetting the stability and usability of the game?
  • The console stores for still not flagging these kind of in-dev games as "buggy, may crash often, you may not enjoy it ..."?
  • The buyers who did not read about the port before buying?
  • Squad for not taking the time out and hiring a lot of developers who get to learn how to do things properly on consoles for the first 3 years before porting the game in-house?
  • Blitworks for not having already pulled a miracle?
  • Some Large Publisher for not buying Squad and/or KSP outright, slapping an "always internet, never works" Digital Restriction Management on it, remove all modding ability and let it collect dust in the attic?
  • The console makers for not making the consoles to be "just like PCs", so stuff has to be ported beyond keyboard+mouse to controller UI?
  • something or someone else?  Say, the modders for modding or the FPS players for making FPS games to block busters, instead of KSP?  Von Neumann for the architecture?  Physics/Maths for not having solved the 3 body problem yet?  Intel, for not having brought out quantum computers as commodity hardware and in a way that makes KSP be easy to do everything in parallel?

So, who's fault is it?  And why not anybody else's fault?  And how is that easy to see?

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Is there any news on the European ps4 release. I have KSP on my laptop but it won't run at the moment. And it would just be easier to start up on PlayStation. Been KSP dry for a year or two now and started getting the shakes

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7 hours ago, weissel said:

Well, who's fault is it?

  • Squad, making a bad decision choosing the porting company?
  • Squad, for deciding to port to console at all?
  • Squad, not being able to force FTE to do proper work, be it due to insufficient contract power or FTE not being able to do better?
  • FTE, for miss-representing their capabilities?  If someone says "We are going to make a hash of it", who would hire them?  So either FTE was deluded or lying (or both)
  • FTE for making a hash out of it?
  • FTE for not saying earlier "Sorry, cannot do ..." and ending the contract?
  • Squad for not testing the port properly?
  • Squad for giving some sort of OK (maybe in the contract) for the result to be uploaded?
  • The console stores for not properly vetting the stability and usability of the game?
  • The console stores for still not flagging these kind of in-dev games as "buggy, may crash often, you may not enjoy it ..."?
  • The buyers who did not read about the port before buying?
  • Squad for not taking the time out and hiring a lot of developers who get to learn how to do things properly on consoles for the first 3 years before porting the game in-house?
  • Blitworks for not having already pulled a miracle?
  • Some Large Publisher for not buying Squad and/or KSP outright, slapping an "always internet, never works" Digital Restriction Management on it, remove all modding ability and let it collect dust in the attic?
  • The console makers for not making the consoles to be "just like PCs", so stuff has to be ported beyond keyboard+mouse to controller UI?
  • something or someone else?  Say, the modders for modding or the FPS players for making FPS games to block busters, instead of KSP?  Von Neumann for the architecture?  Physics/Maths for not having solved the 3 body problem yet?  Intel, for not having brought out quantum computers as commodity hardware and in a way that makes KSP be easy to do everything in parallel?

So, who's fault is it?  And why not anybody else's fault?  And how is that easy to see?

So, let's get this rebuttal done then, shall we?

•Yes, because if they did their job properly, they would've vetted FTE and found them incompetent.

•Possibly. I'd rather have no release than a release that doesn't function.

•Blame goes to both here. Squad should've dropped them long ago and FTE shouldn't have lied about their abilities.

•That's Squads fault, again, because they should've vetted them. Basically FTE even touching the game is Squads fault. 

•Yep. Squads fault too. In the credits for the game there are QA credits. So these people either A. we're sleeping on the job. B. Are completely inept at game testing. Or C. Were just lazy.

•Squads also. It's the job of the game developers to make sure their build runs, not the publisher. So if Battlefield 4 has a game breaking bug, you'll blame EA, not DICE?

•That's actually true here. The Console stores should've taken down KSP long ago and refunded players who bought it in the first week.

•I can't be placed in that category because I bought it the day after it was released in Xbox One.

•Possibly. Game devs should never overestimate their work. Valve used to only do Steam games, but they did their research on consoles and now many of their games have been ported.

•I don't blame Blitworks. They're working their a55es off trying to fix the game that two other groups couldn't get right.

•No, but maybe a collaboration with Microsoft would've mitigated these issues.

•Nope. Why should consoles have to conform to PC equipment? How would you like it if I said that PC needs to ditch the mouse-keyboard and become like consoles and use controllers? PC and console are different on purpose. I can't stand using a keyboard because I play Ace Combat and Battlefield, and a keyboard would suck on it for me.

•Now you're just being ridiculous...

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I'm here out of slight frustration, so I didn't read all the posts. PS4 will not play career mode, I keep losing my sandbox saves to corruption....

I realise that it'll be done when it's done. I hope they do a good job.

I'd play this game even if it was scaled back a bit on total planets, and even if they scaled back the parts list...

Is there any hope for a mouse and or keyboard driver for PS4 Kerbal?

I would buy a Flash drive/mouse/keyboard specifically for this game if it would make it work.

I will probably eventually buy a laptop and the PC version of this game, and give PS4 away to some kid.

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Speaking from experience. My PSN account was banned for demanding a refund of a broken/buggy game. I had proof. Oh I got my money back, an apology and a day later a ban too. They are a very understanding and compassionate company.

So please think twice before taking on PlayStation over a $40 refund. Its against the terms you agree to. I don't want to see this happen to others.

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