RoverDude

[1.7.x] - Modular Kolonization System (MKS)

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I'm having some trouble understanding how the Akademy (Academy) is supposed to work.

I have it landed on a Mun base (picture: https://i.imgur.com/p7RQAws.png ) with a level 3 teacher. I have a student on the same base (picture: https://i.imgur.com/UTaj2mV.png ) who I wished to train. Activating the akademy once produced an on-screen message "Recorded Phildock Kerman's experience". Hrm. No change in exp that I could see.

I switched active vessel and switched back. I tried loading the KSC and then back to my base... I tried activating a pioneer module. I tried re-activating the akademy. Nothing actually effects any change in the experience or level of the students. Furthermore, any attempt since then to activate the akademy no longer produces a message about "Recorded [Kerbal's] experience". So it seems to think it's done something, but as far as I can tell it hasn't.

I re-read the part's description, and checked out the part's code at https://github.com/UmbraSpaceIndustries/MKS/blob/master/Source/KolonyTools/KolonyTools/SpaceAcademy.cs

Nothing I can see that's the problem, although I grant my understanding of the code is limited. I do see that the teacher needs to be "higher level" than the student. I'm not sure if that means initially or after training (e.g. a level 3 teacher can only train to level 2)

Am I missing a step? How is this part supposed to work?

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You need a more experienced teacher to advance further.  The code checks for flights that the teacher has done and the student has not, then copies the equivalent level of experience to the student.  It takes a certain amount of experience before a Kerbal gets a new star, so if the difference between teacher and student is, say, only one flag planting then the student will not get very much new XP.

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7 minutes ago, Friznit said:

You need a more experienced teacher to advance further.  The code checks for flights that the teacher has done and the student has not, then copies the equivalent level of experience to the student.  It takes a certain amount of experience before a Kerbal gets a new star, so if the difference between teacher and student is, say, only one flag planting then the student will not get very much new XP.

Well the teacher is 3 stars, having flags from Mun+Minmus and a sun orbit. The student is a mere 1 star, recruited at that level straight from the astronaut complex.

If you look at the second image I posted (which was taken after using the akademy) you'll see that no experience at all has been granted to the student. In fact they only have experience for the flyby, which is strange given they are currently landed on the Mun.

 

If even 50% experience had been granted I would expect to see that the student would now be level 2. That is not the case.

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3 hours ago, johnnstokes99 said:

Well the teacher is 3 stars, having flags from Mun+Minmus and a sun orbit. The student is a mere 1 star, recruited at that level straight from the astronaut complex.

If you look at the second image I posted (which was taken after using the akademy) you'll see that no experience at all has been granted to the student. In fact they only have experience for the flyby, which is strange given they are currently landed on the Mun.

 

If even 50% experience had been granted I would expect to see that the student would now be level 2. That is not the case.

IIRC flag planting does not get transferred.

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On 3/29/2019 at 11:02 PM, Danilo Coelho said:

Is the karbonite converter and distiler still working? I'm playing on a fresh instalation, with the latest versions of mks and ksp 1.6, and either the distiler or converter aren't working anymore. In the VAB, the parts doesn't show any information from the converters, and on game, there aren't any option available to convert anything.

This was fixed in PR 273 which has been merged but there has not been a new release yet that includes the fix. 

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2 hours ago, Fizbanger said:

Just wanted to confirm this MOD works with KSP 1.6?

is this a question? Indeed it works, even in 1.6.1 .. unsure if a recompile will appear or happen soon before any KSP main updates. *slurps coffee*

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Posted (edited)

I still keep struggling with the breaking changes introduced some time ago. I'm not a modder myself, but since a lot of mods use MKS modules, I wanted to ask if there is a changelog about modules somewhere, and a guide on what needs to be changed. There's some info in this thread, but it's incomplete and very hard to find.

Edited by infinite_monkey

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2 hours ago, infinite_monkey said:

I still keep struggling with the breaking changes introduced some time ago. I'm not a modder myself, but since a lot of mods use MKS modules, I wanted to ask if there is a changelog about modules somewhere, and a guide on what needs to be changed. There's some info in this thread, but it's incomplete and very hard to find.

There is a big colorful link to the entire changelog on the OP.

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1 hour ago, goldenpsp said:

There is a big colorful link to the entire changelog on the OP.

I know. What exactly does that tell me about modules and what changes modders need to make? And with which version have the the modules been changed anyway?

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26 minutes ago, infinite_monkey said:

I know. What exactly does that tell me about modules and what changes modders need to make? And with which version have the the modules been changed anyway?

Presumably it has every change made, at least any change @RoverDude felt was important enough to note.  If it wasn't deemed important enough to log there I doubt you will find it anywhere else.  At least not without going through this thread post by post looking for any small detail.

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5 hours ago, infinite_monkey said:

I still keep struggling with the breaking changes introduced some time ago. I'm not a modder myself, but since a lot of mods use MKS modules, I wanted to ask if there is a changelog about modules somewhere, and a guide on what needs to be changed. There's some info in this thread, but it's incomplete and very hard to find.

I've made quite a few posts about this in this thread (probably easier to just look at my posts via my profile rather than trying to find them in this monster thread). All of the MKS parts have been updated to use the new modules and I also submitted a pull request to Kerbal Planetary Base Systems to partially update its USI compatibility. (That link is to the diff for the PR which will show you what I changed in KBPS compared to what was there before). So these are places one could look for examples of how to update a part to use the new modules. If you can be more specific about what information you feel needs to be provided to complete the picture, that would help me help you.

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3 minutes ago, DoktorKrogg said:

I've made quite a few posts about this in this thread (probably easier to just look at my posts via my profile rather than trying to find them in this monster thread). All of the MKS parts have been updated to use the new modules and I also submitted a pull request to Kerbal Planetary Base Systems to partially update its USI compatibility. (That link is to the diff for the PR which will show you what I changed in KBPS compared to what was there before). So these are places one could look for examples of how to update a part to use the new modules. If you can be more specific about what information you feel needs to be provided to complete the picture, that would help me help you.

Thanks for your reply. I appreciate your effort to submit pull requests, and your answers here in this thread. My current problem is the drill from @Nils277's FUR, it's still using ModuleResourceHarvester_USI, while MKS uses USI_Harvester. Planetary Base Systems has a drill as well, I couldn't find a any change for the drill in your PR, though.

There are A LOT of mods out there, and no one can expect you to write PRs for every single one. RoderDude didn't even update his own Karbonite mod. I just think it would make life a lot easier for everyone if these infos could be found on the wiki. Yes, one can reverse-engineer it from the configs in MKS (which is what I'll do). But you find out that this needs to be done only after you realize that some part doesn't work anymore. And you need to find the correct part in MKS or USI-LS, find the module (maybe it's not even in the part config, but in a patch), understand it, change your part config, relaunch KSP, curse, change again... And you probably miss out on capabilities that are not used in the part you copied your info from.

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@PotatoAndBeanHarvester and others interested in the "perform maintenance" bug. The part module involved in this feature is USI_ModuleFieldRepair, as you correctly discovered. This module is supposed to be added to parts via a ModuleManager patch though so that it does not need to be manually added to the part config for each part. So it's possible that changes in ModuleManager broke the patch. I am nearly useless when it comes to MM unfortunately (read: I'm too lazy to learn the syntax and keep up with its development). The related MM code is:

@PART[*]:HAS[!MODULE[USI_ModuleFieldRepair],RESOURCE[Machinery|EnrichedUranium|DepletedFuel|Recyclables]]:FOR[USITools]
{
    MODULE
    {
        name = USI_ModuleFieldRepair
    }
}

If some MM guru spots any issues with that and can provide me with a fix, I'll be happy to update the code and submit a PR.

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12 minutes ago, infinite_monkey said:

Yes, one can reverse-engineer it from the configs in MKS (which is what I'll do). But you find out that this needs to be done only after you realize that some part doesn't work anymore. And you need to find the correct part in MKS or USI-LS, find the module (maybe it's not even in the part config, but in a patch), understand it, change your part config, relaunch KSP, curse, change again... And you probably miss out on capabilities that are not used in the part you copied your info from.

I mean... you basically just described modding in KSP. :lol:

I feel it's worth pointing out that Squad hasn't exactly set a good example with their own documentation for KSP's API. This is their documentation for ModuleResourceHarvester (which USI_Harvester is based on):

https://kerbalspaceprogram.com/api/class_module_resource_harvester.html

If you scroll down thru there, you'll see that there are a ton of public attributes that can be configured for a harvester but the overwhelming majority of them have absolutely no description for what they actually do. So the only way to figure out what they do is to look at existing stock parts to see what options they have set, play around with different settings to see what effects they have and ask questions in the forums to see if any other modders have experience with the thing you're trying to do. To make matters worse, many options seem to have absolutely zero effect and there may be half a dozen options that all sound the same but only one of them actually does the thing you think it should. And this is something we paid for. Modders don't get paid. So I can't really fault them for not providing documentation when Squad can't even provide adequate documentation!

I feel your pain. I was really frustrated when I first got into KSP modding. Things aren't well documented, a lot of information is tucked away deep inside monster forum threads that take hours to sift through and there's conflicting information at times. I agree that it would be great if there was a "modder's guide" wiki page for each of the USI mods that explained each PartModule and its config options. It would have been a huge help for me when I was first trying to wrap my head around the USI collection. It takes time a lot of time and effort to make that kind of high quality documentation though. 

The great thing about wikis is that anyone can update them. So if you'd like to start a new wiki page for this, I'd be happy to help fill in blanks. Here's the first challenge... the majority of the stuff you're looking at actually lives in USITools. In fact, most stuff lives in USITools. So that's really where this kind of documentation should go, which would be here:

https://github.com/UmbraSpaceIndustries/UmbraSpaceIndustries/wiki

MKS and USI-LS do have some PartModules of their own, so they would need their own modder's guide wiki pages as well, probably with lots of links back to the USITools modder's guide for all the things folks think are part of MKS or USI-LS but are actually part of USITools. ^_^

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11 hours ago, DoktorKrogg said:

@PotatoAndBeanHarvester and others interested in the "perform maintenance" bug. The part module involved in this feature is USI_ModuleFieldRepair, as you correctly discovered. This module is supposed to be added to parts via a ModuleManager patch though so that it does not need to be manually added to the part config for each part. So it's possible that changes in ModuleManager broke the patch. I am nearly useless when it comes to MM unfortunately (read: I'm too lazy to learn the syntax and keep up with its development). The related MM code is:


@PART[*]:HAS[!MODULE[USI_ModuleFieldRepair],RESOURCE[Machinery|EnrichedUranium|DepletedFuel|Recyclables]]:FOR[USITools]
{
    MODULE
    {
        name = USI_ModuleFieldRepair
    }
}

If some MM guru spots any issues with that and can provide me with a fix, I'll be happy to update the code and submit a PR.

ooo I thought it's just my save that is screwed up!

it seems that after mks last updated it stopped performing maintenance(oddly enough it does continue on doing maintenance on the nuclear fuel plant)

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17 hours ago, DoktorKrogg said:

@PotatoAndBeanHarvester and others interested in the "perform maintenance" bug. The part module involved in this feature is USI_ModuleFieldRepair, as you correctly discovered. This module is supposed to be added to parts via a ModuleManager patch though so that it does not need to be manually added to the part config for each part. So it's possible that changes in ModuleManager broke the patch. I am nearly useless when it comes to MM unfortunately (read: I'm too lazy to learn the syntax and keep up with its development). The related MM code is:


@PART[*]:HAS[!MODULE[USI_ModuleFieldRepair],RESOURCE[Machinery|EnrichedUranium|DepletedFuel|Recyclables]]:FOR[USITools]
{
    MODULE
    {
        name = USI_ModuleFieldRepair
    }
}

If some MM guru spots any issues with that and can provide me with a fix, I'll be happy to update the code and submit a PR.

I'm no MM expert, but I saw in another thread (on SCANsat IIRC) that there have been some changes in MM syntax and some commas had to be replaced with colons. So perhaps this is where I'd start looking.

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20 hours ago, DoktorKrogg said:

@PotatoAndBeanHarvester and others interested in the "perform maintenance" bug. The part module involved in this feature is USI_ModuleFieldRepair, as you correctly discovered. This module is supposed to be added to parts via a ModuleManager patch though so that it does not need to be manually added to the part config for each part. So it's possible that changes in ModuleManager broke the patch. I am nearly useless when it comes to MM unfortunately (read: I'm too lazy to learn the syntax and keep up with its development). The related MM code is:


@PART[*]:HAS[!MODULE[USI_ModuleFieldRepair],RESOURCE[Machinery|EnrichedUranium|DepletedFuel|Recyclables]]:FOR[USITools]
{
    MODULE
    {
        name = USI_ModuleFieldRepair
    }
}

If some MM guru spots any issues with that and can provide me with a fix, I'll be happy to update the code and submit a PR.

By the way, I filed a bug on the MKS Github for this issue: https://github.com/UmbraSpaceIndustries/MKS/issues/1449. If you want to tag that bug in your pull request.

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On 4/6/2019 at 10:26 PM, DoktorKrogg said:

The great thing about wikis is that anyone can update them. So if you'd like to start a new wiki page for this, I'd be happy to help fill in blanks. Here's the first challenge... the majority of the stuff you're looking at actually lives in USITools. In fact, most stuff lives in USITools. So that's really where this kind of documentation should go, which would be here:

https://github.com/UmbraSpaceIndustries/UmbraSpaceIndustries/wiki

MKS and USI-LS do have some PartModules of their own, so they would need their own modder's guide wiki pages as well, probably with lots of links back to the USITools modder's guide for all the things folks think are part of MKS or USI-LS but are actually part of USITools. ^_^

Take a look at the MKS Mod Support wiki page for starters and update/amend as needed.

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Posted (edited)

does anyone else has the problem where the "lights" button in the ui disappear for some reason in the ranger agriculture module?

(it is maybe related to moving it around with kas but I'm not sure)

also I noticed "uiWriteLock" is True  in  "ModuleLight" even if I change it to False manually it changes back

-edit-
it got even weirder: pressing "make plant growth study" returns the light button so I guess there's kind of a fix for the bug
I just wondered if anyone else got this bug so we can figure out what's causing it

Edited by alien_wind

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Posted (edited)

hello people

 

I'm back to KSP and MKS. Just been trying to make a base on the mun but I cant link flexotube like I use to. No option to link at all...

Im on 1.6.1 KSP and 1.1 MKS and using KAS/KIS

Are flexotube broken in this release? or am I suppose to know something else that has changed in the last year?

 

EDIT: KAS was the culprit. the latest version 1.2 doesnt work, using version 1.1 and everything working as intended.

Edited by merlinux
found fix

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4 hours ago, merlinux said:

hello people

 

I'm back to KSP and MKS. Just been trying to make a base on the mun but I cant link flexotube like I use to. No option to link at all...

Im on 1.6.1 KSP and 1.1 MKS and using KAS/KIS

Are flexotube broken in this release? or am I suppose to know something else that has changed in the last year?

 

EDIT: KAS was the culprit. the latest version 1.2 doesnt work, using version 1.1 and everything working as intended.

KAS has had a major redesign recently, which dropped the ports that the flexotube was based off of.  They were made legacy in KAS 1.0, and dropped entirely in 1.2.

The author of KAS is working on a replacement setup designed especially for crew tunnels, but it's not in place yet.

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5 hours ago, DStaal said:

KAS has had a major redesign recently, which dropped the ports that the flexotube was based off of.  They were made legacy in KAS 1.0, and dropped entirely in 1.2.

The author of KAS is working on a replacement setup designed especially for crew tunnels, but it's not in place yet.

Hi and thanks DStaal, found that the hard way :) Its been a couple of years that I haven't played. Anyways looking at the KAS thread, they say the legacy stuff shouldnt be used as it is known to not work well in recent KSP versions. I plan to use KAS just for MKS's flexotubes. Are they still safe ? or Am I placing a timebomb on my base?

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4 hours ago, merlinux said:

Hi and thanks DStaal, found that the hard way :) Its been a couple of years that I haven't played. Anyways looking at the KAS thread, they say the legacy stuff shouldnt be used as it is known to not work well in recent KSP versions. I plan to use KAS just for MKS's flexotubes. Are they still safe ? or Am I placing a timebomb on my base?

I'd say: Timebomb, with a short fuse.  KAS may need a recompile under KSP 1.7, so upgrading any base past 1.6.1 will not be possible - and I’m not sure if the KAS 1.2 converter scripts would work with flexotubes.  My suggestion would be to use Tundra Trusses instead, personally.

I’m not sure what RoverDude's plans are here - there are a couple of ways to handle the transition.  Since KAS has shown video of WIP for a replacement, likely he's just waiting.  There's also a couple of ways to hack the current system onto the current tubes.  (Either by making two different tube parts, or by allowing each end to in theory have two tubes.)  Until this fully shakes out, I’d be staying away from KAS-related parts in other mods.  (This has also affected KPBS, Pathfinder, and SEP that I know of.)

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