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[1.12.X] Feline Utility Rovers v1.3.4 (28. April 2022)


Nils277

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2 minutes ago, Sebra said:

I understand this is hovercraft.

Would you add other type of hovercraft, more known as air pillow in my language?

 

Fengist over at The Maritime Pack (check the bottom of the page I linked)is working on exactly that, even looking for beta testers, if it isn't something Nils277 is looking to add in at the moment.

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@Sebra i'm afraid adding custom code for a "real" hovercraft functionality is currently out of scope. To be honest, finishing the code for the hover-engines was quite exhausing :wink: 

But, if the code from the Maritime Pack works reasonably well and it is fully released, i will consider adding a part that supports this feature when the Maritime Pack is installed. 

Edited by Nils277
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Looks fantastic, sir. Well done. Eagerly looking forward to this update.

Couple questions, if I may:
1. The one I recall irritates you to no end, but someone will inevitably ask, so let's just get it out of the way now: That body-mounted rear fan. Is that going to be available only as a rear-end part, or will we also see a mid-body version as well?

2. Slightly less obvious question: We'll probably find out the hard way when it's released and we test it, but what is the handling like with these hover rotors? One of my biggest issues with the Kerbal Foundation anti-grav pads was always how you had zero lateral control; once you started moving in a certain direction you just kept going, making steering and fine control almost impossible. Will these rotors have any sort of inertial compensation to them, like putting out some counter-thrust when you release the turn/strafe key so you don't just keep going? Or will this be up to the skill of the pilot?

3. Again, something I'm expecting to remain secret until release, but what's the fuel consumption on these rotors like? Will the built-in solar panels normally cut it, or should we expect to be building rovers with extra generators to provide enough power to not fall into the sea?

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4 hours ago, sirrliv said:

Looks fantastic, sir. Well done. Eagerly looking forward to this update.

Couple questions, if I may:
1. The one I recall irritates you to no end, but someone will inevitably ask, so let's just get it out of the way now: That body-mounted rear fan. Is that going to be available only as a rear-end part, or will we also see a mid-body version as well?

2. Slightly less obvious question: We'll probably find out the hard way when it's released and we test it, but what is the handling like with these hover rotors? One of my biggest issues with the Kerbal Foundation anti-grav pads was always how you had zero lateral control; once you started moving in a certain direction you just kept going, making steering and fine control almost impossible. Will these rotors have any sort of inertial compensation to them, like putting out some counter-thrust when you release the turn/strafe key so you don't just keep going? Or will this be up to the skill of the pilot?

3. Again, something I'm expecting to remain secret until release, but what's the fuel consumption on these rotors like? Will the built-in solar panels normally cut it, or should we expect to be building rovers with extra generators to provide enough power to not fall into the sea?

1. I don't have plans for an inline version of the rear part as of now. I will consider adding it if many wish to have such a part.

2. By default the engines are configured to counteract any lateral speed and rotation when the user is not actively steering/drifting (lateral movement is done with the 'Translate left/right' keys for RCS). Those who want to drift or rotate continuously can disable these features. The lateral speed however cannot be compensated instantaneous so it will gradually slow down when you rotated while moving forward. So it stays physically correct. The engines will also cancel any movement when the brakes are enabled to enable a safe landing.

3. When hovering the engines will consume about the same as the wheels. Keep in mind however that they need to run continuosly to hover while the wheels need less power when they reached max speed. The rover seen in the last screenshot needs around 2.5 EC per second when standing still in the air but needs more EC when moving faster or throttled to max. At max the rover needs around 25-30 EC. Don't worry though, at 30ms the consumption is at about 3 EC/sec for the rover. 50m/s will need significabtly more though. 

 

Ps: All the values and curves are derived from real world values. 

This includes:

  • Thrust dependent of atmospheric pressure
  • Thrust dependent of air speed
  • Relation between power consumption and throttle setting (derived from electric motors)

 

Edited by Nils277
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Update to 1.0.0 The legend of the flying Lynx
Finally after a long time the lynx now has everything i wanted it to have. It is not officially out of development!**

 

New Features:

7qzAOJD.png

Changelog:

Quote

Enhancements:

  • Extended KSPedia entries to explain the latest features (needs translation)
  • Rebalanced the fuelcell for the roof
  • Added airlocks to the Docking Module for rescue contracts

New Parts:

  • Added Hover-Engines
  • Added Boat-Engine
  • Added Skids

Bug Fixes:

  • The Engine Category is now available for the engines
  • The adapters for the rover types are now passable for CLS
  • Fixed compatibility issues with KJR

Download:

oYvtZpW.png UVVt0OP.png lMOxt2k.png

**This does not mean that there won't be new things added

Control of the Engines:

To find out how to control the engines, please take a look at the new KSPedia entry for them. I hope it explains everything of importance.
In short:

  • Wheel Conrols (typically W, A, S, and D) are used for steering, acceleration and deceleration.
  • RCS Controls (Up, Down, Left and Right) are used for lateral speed, as well as changing the hover height.

Hover mode can be enabled/disables either with the right click menu of actions.

 

Help needed:
The new parts as well as the new texts for the engines need translation into Chinese, Russian, Portuguese and Spanish. If anyone wants to help, let me know! :) 
 

Edited by Nils277
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9 minutes ago, Starslinger999 said:

Holy crap! HOVER ENGINES?!?!?!?! FOR A ROVER MOD?!?!?!?

Does it need Kerbal Foundries? or the continued mod for that? 

Also it better not be like the "Hover" Boards we have in real life... 

[SKIP]

*Cough Cough* False Advertising *Cough Cough* 

Nope it does not need Kerbal Foundries or any other third party mod for that. The hover engines are 100% self-made :wink: 

Edited by Nils277
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29 minutes ago, mostlydave said:

What does toggle modes do? Is it possible to hover at over 4 meters? I'd like to be able to land on one of the helipads in hover mode

"Toggle Mode" changes whether the hover engine uses EC or Liquid Fuel to run.

No it is not possible to hover higher than 4 meters. And the reason for this is exactly that landing on or flying over Buildings in the KSC would not work . This is due to the problem that all the buildings use the same collision layer as the terrain. This is good for the models of the KSC that form the  ground but bad for the buildings. Because when you fly over a building suddenly the engine thinks that the ground just came closer a few meters and tries to counteract that...meaning you would make a backflip(or frontflip) everytime you fly over a building. (It is not possible to distinguish between the buildings and the ground) I also tried to work with altitudes instead of the distance to the ground but that causes the reverse problem with all parts of the KSC that are used as ground. They would be ignored too which means you would crash into the Runway when you try to fly onto it from normal terrain.
The first method results in much fewer crashes and behaves as one would expect it to.

Maybe i can find a way to use a hybrid of both systems in the future but for now this limitation has to stay.

Edited by Nils277
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11 minutes ago, SpaceMouse said:

Never understood the obsession with 'hover' everything. If you have the power to hover, you have a aircraft. your going to fly over things cuz its faster and more efficient.

Technically you are completely right :wink: For me it was just that i wanted to have something in KSP that resembles the Hammerhead from ME2. Although many hated this vehicle.

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22 minutes ago, SpaceMouse said:

Never understood the obsession with 'hover' everything. If you have the power to hover, you have a aircraft. your going to fly over things cuz its faster and more efficient.

True... But sometimes you don't want the speed of flying (because you're going shorter distances, and need more precise locations) and hovering does offer advantages in not having to deal with every little imperfection from smooth in the ground.  (Or to tear up the ground.)  Also, hovering doesn't really care what type of surface you're over - so the same drive system can handle hard concrete, loose sand, wet bogs, and open water with equal efficiency.

I think in real life skirted hovercraft are more efficient than flying craft, because they can take effect of ground-effect situations and contain their lift air some.  In KSP, it's a way to avoid some of the wonkyness with wheels and helps to deal with uneven terrain.

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I just executed my first hoverfan orbital recovery. (used the kpbs base hub and 4 lift fans) Unfold at about 5000 agl and start decelerating, great for pinpoint landings on atmosphere worlds.  As a side note the lift fans were not recognized by mechjeb as engines, so landing guidance does not work, it is totally manual landing.

vNIeJ1N.jpg

 

Edited by Rafael acevedo
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1 hour ago, Rafael acevedo said:

I just executed my first hoverfan orbital recovery. (used the kpbs base hub and 4 lift fans) Unfold at about 5000 agl and start decelerating, great for pinpoint landings on atmosphere worlds.  As a side note the lift fans were not recognized by mechjeb as engines, so landing guidance does not work, it is totally manual landing.

vNIeJ1N.jpg

 

OMG you've just got me wanting a hover-base!

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4 hours ago, Nils277 said:

Technically you are completely right :wink: For me it was just that i wanted to have something in KSP that resembles the Hammerhead from ME2. Although many hated this vehicle.

One of the few that hasn't played ME so can't comment.

*edit* Looks cool. I approve. :D

4 hours ago, DStaal said:

True... But sometimes you don't want the speed of flying (because you're going shorter distances, and need more precise locations) and hovering does offer advantages in not having to deal with every little imperfection from smooth in the ground.  (Or to tear up the ground.)  Also, hovering doesn't really care what type of surface you're over - so the same drive system can handle hard concrete, loose sand, wet bogs, and open water with equal efficiency.

I think in real life skirted hovercraft are more efficient than flying craft, because they can take effect of ground-effect situations and contain their lift air some.  In KSP, it's a way to avoid some of the wonkyness with wheels and helps to deal with uneven terrain.

Cannot argue with the multi-surface logic, although something amphibious is probably more practical. I am aware of the niche market for hovercraft.

Ground effect Is definitely more efficient than standard flight, I can't imagine a hovercraft would beat a normal fixed-wing plane.

I should note when I'm talking about hovering it's normally in the Sci-Fi sense and is almost always over solid ground. Your too 'cool' for wheels? :D

Edited by SpaceMouse
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2 hours ago, SpaceMouse said:

Cannot argue with the multi-surface logic, although something amphibious is probably more practical. I am aware of the niche market for hovercraft.

Ground effect Is definitely more efficient than standard flight, I can't imagine a hovercraft would beat a normal fixed-wing plane.

I should note when I'm talking about hovering it's normally in the Sci-Fi sense and is almost always over solid ground. Your too 'cool' for wheels? :D

I'm not sure it's actually easier to make a multi-surface amphibious craft that's not a hovercraft than it is to make one that is.  Well, true multi-surface - if we limit it to 'roads' and 'water' or something like that then you can constrain the design choices.  And I think a hovercraft would beat a fixed-wing plane in certain roles - short distance, larger loads, lower speed.  (Though usually for a bit more infrastructure cost a car or train is more efficient yet in those roles.  There has to be something prohibiting the infrastructure.)

(BTW: Russia did experiment with some large fixed-wing ground effect craft...)

But yeah, the hovering in Sci-Fi sense makes *no* sense.  Put it on wheels or wings, people!  :wink:

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46 minutes ago, DStaal said:

I'm not sure it's actually easier to make a multi-surface amphibious craft that's not a hovercraft than it is to make one that is.  Well, true multi-surface - if we limit it to 'roads' and 'water' or something like that then you can constrain the design choices.  And I think a hovercraft would beat a fixed-wing plane in certain roles - short distance, larger loads, lower speed.  (Though usually for a bit more infrastructure cost a car or train is more efficient yet in those roles.  There has to be something prohibiting the infrastructure.)

(BTW: Russia did experiment with some large fixed-wing ground effect craft...)

But yeah, the hovering in Sci-Fi sense makes *no* sense.  Put it on wheels or wings, people!  :wink:

The Ekranoplan was a crazy thing. The amount of weight it was designed to move quickly is insane. A a380 probably looks like Solar Impulse by comparison. :D I think there have been a few other Wing in Ground effect concepts as well.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a7329/curtiss-wright-air-cars/

 Two 180hp aircraft engines and 3800lbs. Sounds like a helicopter would be more efficient.

Edited by SpaceMouse
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Val complained a little bit, that she must test a new Hover Lynx at night, but after a few flips and curses addressed to the engineering department, because they forgot to balance COM and thrust, she managed to do a flight around KSC and landed with a huge smile.

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Update to 1.0.1 Fixing the wings
It seems that i always need one more day to find and fix the last bugs :rolleyes:....so here is a fixed version 

Changelog:

Quote

Bug Fixes:

  • Fixed engine categories (this time really)
  • Removed debug info from right click menu of the hover engines
  • Fixed inconsistens behaviour when hover mode cannot be enabled
  • Fixed headlights of the Cockpit

Download:

oYvtZpW.png UVVt0OP.png lMOxt2k.png

Edited by Nils277
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