# [1.6.1] Realism Overhaul v12.7.2 [17 July 2019]

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7 hours ago, Briso said:

Apparently the thrust force on the Falcon 9 Full Thrust Interstage RCS Unit is too small (0.4). If you look at the video from SpaceX you can see that the RCS after the separation of stages provides more traction. Does anyone know the real traction figures issued by the RCS ?

When you say interstage I interpret that to be the RCS for the first stage. SpaceX has not released specific numbers that I'm aware of but those are nitrogen cold gas thrusters and they would have an isp of 73 tops (I think RO assigns them 70). Thrust of 0.4 (400 newtons) seems overpowered for N2 gas thrusters and sounds more like the Dracos that are used on the second stage (and also on the cargo Dragon and Crew Dragon)

Back to the N2 thrusters, RO gives them a thrust of 250 Newtons; again, not sure if that is accurate or not but IRL it wouldn't be any higher than that.

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What is the best way to scale the positions of stack nodes? I experimented with size of some parts

MODEL
{
scale = 1.5, 1.5, 1.5//1.6, 1.6, 1.6
}
%rescaleFactor = 1.0
@node_stack_bottom = 0.0, -0.64, 0.0, 0.0, -1.0, 0.0, 4
@node_stack_top = 0.0, 1.328, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 2
@mass = 1.88

(set scale to 1.5)

In which unit are they and what is rescaleFactor in this context?

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On 3/4/2019 at 6:47 AM, New Horizons said:

What is the best way to scale the positions of stack nodes? I experimented with size of some parts

MODEL
{
scale = 1.5, 1.5, 1.5//1.6, 1.6, 1.6
}
%rescaleFactor = 1.0
@node_stack_bottom = 0.0, -0.64, 0.0, 0.0, -1.0, 0.0, 4
@node_stack_top = 0.0, 1.328, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 2
@mass = 1.88

(set scale to 1.5)

In which unit are they and what is rescaleFactor in this context?

Unit is in meters. rescaleFactor defaults to 1.25 - it's typical to set it to 1 before using scale, otherwise you have to keep track of that 1.25.

changing rescaleFactor automatically changes attach node position (rescales the position) - using scale in a MODEL node does not. So you have to adjust position by exactly the amount that you adjust MODEL scale by.

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Was something changed to the Version of RO that Ckan tries to install? I am running KSP 1.3.1, but Ckan shows RO as only being compatible with KSP 1.4.5

Just yesterday I still saw it in the list of available and compatible mods, but no more. Only when including the incompatible mods in the list it is shown, but not installable.

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nothing changed and it's still available and compatible and installs fine, it's just you.

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Okay, I'll try and figure it out then

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Posted (edited)

I recorded this epic RSS/RO video this weekend. I'm using here RO master branch compiled for KSP 1.6 (plus all the RO dependencies).

Edited by jrodriguez

1.6?

Interesting.

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1 minute ago, Theysen said:

1.6?

Interesting.

Yeah

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BerthNerd I have the same problem but I think I've figured it out. Under the CKAN setting tab there called compatible KSP versions. Just select the right versions and it will allow you to download the mod. I will say I did this and installed it willy nilly and broke the game so its probably going to require some tinkering

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Working RO under 1.6? Where can I get one?

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1.3.1 or 1.4.5 as the title indicates for now.

There are too many dependencies not there yet for 1.6+ so there also is no version of RO for it.

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Getting update message for V12.6. But there is none...

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16 minutes ago, New Horizons said:

Getting update message for V12.6. But there is none...

that is my fault I accidently included my .version file when i updated the dll in the master, it shouldn't be there yet as it's not ready to release. I'll fix it.

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Hey. I have a problem. I do a configuration of RO and at me it is impossible to make something. Namely, I'm trying to do the configuration of the RCS. In short

Here is how it looks in the standard config. https://pastebin.com/na4cunmF  Here's my ro config. https://pastebin.com/c1fuBiVa  The result is that each module RCSFX control its engine. If you explain it in detail here.

This config applies to these engines

Accordingly, my task is to prescribe a config for each side. If I once prescribe a config

@MODULE[ModuleRCSFX*]
{
@thrusterPower = 3.5
!resourceName
PROPELLANT
{
name = MMH
ratio = 8.17
}

PROPELLANT
{
name = NTO
ratio = 13.48
}
}

I get

When I duplicate this config two or more times I get

What needs to be done to fuel consumption the engine of was have all MMH+NTO ?

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Is the Mk1-2 (4m) rescaled capsule supposed to have an IVA model? It seems to be broken on my 1.3.1 install of RSS.

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Install the mod correctly as indicated but when entering I find that I have no propulsion system to assemble a rocket, the game I have it clean without mods except for the Real Solar System, any help?

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Hey guys! I'm having an issue with rss ro and I'm not sure this is the mod that's effecting it. I'm pretty sure it is. This is only true of Mars...at least that I have attempted, moon is great. My atmosphere distance is incorrect. Meaning after I crash into the ground I still am like 8000m above the surface according to the altimeter at the top of my screen. I also crash into the surface way to fast and I enter the atmosphere so late I'm passing through it at like 20000m above the surface... Seems way off.

What's the best way to go about fixing this? Anyone else have this issue?

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Philaphlous said:

Hey guys! I'm having an issue with rss ro and I'm not sure this is the mod that's effecting it. I'm pretty sure it is. This is only true of Mars...at least that I have attempted, moon is great. My atmosphere distance is incorrect. Meaning after I crash into the ground I still am like 8000m above the surface according to the altimeter at the top of my screen. I also crash into the surface way to fast and I enter the atmosphere so late I'm passing through it at like 20000m above the surface... Seems way off.

What's the best way to go about fixing this? Anyone else have this issue?

The altimeter reports altitude above sea level, and even though Mars is a waterless planet, the concept of 'above sea level' still applies but with different meaning. On Mars, 'sea level' is the lowest altitude found on the planet and it is the only altitude at which the altimeter will read 0.

The atmospheric pressure at sea level on Mars is only 0.6% of the sea level pressure on Earth.  It is a very thin atmosphere and braking can be challenging.

Edit: This is why IRL we target deep craters and basins for our missions. Highland landings are going to be very challenging requiring either HIAD (inflatable shields/aero decelerators) or retropropulsion or for very heavy payloads it may require both.

Edited by Starwaster

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Posted (edited)

Is there anything in RO preventing scaled solar panels from receiving a chargeRate multiplier? I noticed that 2x sized panels didn't produce 2x as much electricity; at first I thought it was due to the KopernicusSolarPanel module replacing the stock one, so I added the following config to Tweakscale:

// ** Kopernicus **
TWEAKSCALEEXPONENTS:NEEDS[Kopernicus]
{
name = KopernicusSolarPanel
efficiencyMult = 2
chargeRate = 2
}

And it still didn't work. Every single solar panel module has exponents for its chargeRate and efficiencyMult fields, but scaled up panels keep their "default" charge rate.

And yes, this question also concerns Tweakscale and possible Kopernicus; I just wanted to confirm RO isn't somehow overriding my patch.

Edited by Tonas1997
Minor change

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Posted (edited)
On 4/24/2019 at 12:12 PM, Tonas1997 said:

Is there anything in RO preventing scaled solar panels from receiving a chargeRate multiplier? I noticed that 2x sized panels didn't produce 2x as much electricity; at first I thought it was due to the KopernicusSolarPanel module replacing the stock one, so I added the following config to Tweakscale:

Tweakscale is generally regarded as being incompatible with RO.  It breaks stuff.

I was under the impression that RO actively disables Tweakscale if you try to use it, but I could be mistaken.

Edited by RoboRay

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4 hours ago, RoboRay said:

Tweakscale is generally regarded as being incompatible with RO.  It breaks stuff.

Bad patches break stuff. It's some time since a bug on TweakScale was doing breakage. All the bugs I'm detecting were being Induced by mistakes on patches (or plain rogue ones, doing blind changes).

4 hours ago, RoboRay said:

I was under the impression that RO actively disables Tweakscale if you try to use it, but I could be mistaken.

Since V 2.4.0 TweakScale is doing Sanity Checks on startup to detect situations that would cause catastrophics failures on KSP, some of them somewhat nasty.

When something is detected, Tweakscale withdraws support for the offendig parts. Check the KSP.log for messages, every offenfing part is listed, with the issue where the reason is explained.

So it's more likely the other way around - it's TweakScale that must be detecting problems and mitigating them.

Send me the KSP.log of a run where you think this is happening and let me check it. I already have some tasks for Kopernicus on the backlog, by the way.

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Posted (edited)

Regarding TweakScale and RO. I usually remove the disabling TweakScale patch that RO includes and I added one to enable TweakScale on every engine.

However I have seen strange behaviours when I try to tweakscale a RO patched engine. Magic forces appear on the vessel!

Edited by jrodriguez

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57 minutes ago, jrodriguez said:

However I have seen strange behaviours when I try to tweakscale a RO patched engine. Magic forces appear on the vessel!

Blind guess, but perhaps some extra modules added by RO need to be patched too. TweakScale knows nothing about what it's doing, it mechanically applies "receipts" into GameData: "here, take that datum called mass and multiply it for this scale".

You tell it to scale mass to a small enough factor,  you got a number being rounded to zero and then something blows somewhere inside the physics engine.

You tell it to scale to a negative scale, you get a craft thinking it's a nuclear reactor going China Syndrome at room's temperature.

You forget to add a receipt for something else, this something else is not scaled at all and Krakens count the deads.

The solar panels on Kopernicus apparently are suffering from this last problem. They had to switch the generator module for another one that finds the nearest star for light,  and nobody told TweakScale about this new module.

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Engine TweakScaling is not and will probably never be supported for a very simple reason: this is Realism Overhaul. The RO engines have the exact stats, including dimensions, as the IRL counterparts. I do not think that  TweakScaling an F-1 engine to have the size of an LR91 would be a very...realistic thing to do.

For generic/structural parts then sure. In fact, it would help immensely since RO creates multiple part clones to cover these gaps, creating a mess in the part lists.

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