Li0n

[Released][1.3.1] Antenna Helper [v0.90] (27 Feb 2018)

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Pretty much, in some cases due to the alignment of the bodies these situations don't occur too much and also highly inclined bodies throw a spanner in the works when considering it simply like this as you're not dealing with a planar situation.

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I have that issue in GPP range calculations because almost every single planet has a slightly different inclination...

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Meh.  As long as they are close to the same plane, you'll at least be within an order of magnitude...  :D

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hehehe...yeah.  I haven't done the math yet.  The greatest single possible variance in inclination would be when Icarus (nearest planet to Ciro @ 6o) and Leto (farthest planet from Ciro @ 10o) are at opposition and I don't know what 16o of inclination difference over that kind of extreme range (539m Km difference in SMA) will do.  This is just the most extreme example and likely to never have an actual application in game but I'd still like to know the numbers for my own curiosity's sake.  Like I said...I need to sit down and do the math but I've been putting it off as I get my other ducks in a row... :P

 

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11 hours ago, Li0n said:

I don't think I'm at this point yet, before I can use those formulas I need an equation of the form "ax^3 + bx^2 + cx + d = 0". Here is the closer I get :

  Reveal hidden contents

cW28FRW.jpg

Where "d" is the distance (the "x" of the above equation)

"m" is the max range of the antennas

"s" is the signal strength

 

 

you did it: :P

olSXB97.png

or you could have kept x , solve it, then find d=m*x

11 hours ago, Li0n said:

So, it make me re-think about this "Max Distance For 100% Strength" feature. It may be better to let the user enter the distance he wants to check and calculate the signal strength based on that. It will be like the "Enter Required Range" in @Poodmund 's Calculator. What you think of it ?

 

Maybe not now, but later when with multiple relay? how far should i put this relay to get a minimum of 50% signal strength for my rover ,etc...

11 hours ago, Li0n said:

You mean as a feature of the mod or just for helping with the development ? I will add a flight display at some point, as I like building stuff with KIS it will help.

For the Dev actually, so we could compare accurately the game things vs. your mod.

@Poodmund, it will always give a complex number to calculate,  there is a [ (y-1)y] and  because 0 < y < 1  (y-1)y<0 ( i don't know too if unity can do complex)

 

Edited by Skalou

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Wow lots of answers today :) Thanks guys.

14 hours ago, rasta013 said:

Just a curiosity question...are the planet names hard coded in your DLL?  I've currently got this installed under a Galileo Planet Pack setup which completely replaces the stock solar system (including the sun) but not a single planetary or lunar body shows up on the per planet list.

Strange, I thought it will work. I use "Planetarium.fetch.Home" and "Planetarium.fetch.Sun.orbitingBodies" to populate the list, I'll try @Poodmund way ("FlightGlobals.Bodies").

 

14 hours ago, Poodmund said:

I may be able to help you here. The values on the 'System Stats' page on my Google Sheets doc show the min max distance between Kerbin and the other bodies up to the game year 1000 (if I remember correctly). If I have permission from the original author I may be able to share the calculation document I used to get these figures.

That would surely be useful. I imagine the math you have used will work with any solar system (planets pack) ?

 

11 hours ago, Skalou said:

you did it: :P

... facepalm ... Thanks again :) I'll look into it. @Poodmund I'll try your formulas too.

 

11 hours ago, Skalou said:

For the Dev actually, so we could compare accurately the game things vs. your mod.

It will be in the next version.

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20 hours ago, Li0n said:

Strange, I thought it will work. I use "Planetarium.fetch.Home" and "Planetarium.fetch.Sun.orbitingBodies" to populate the list, I'll try @Poodmund way ("FlightGlobals.Bodies")

Reporting back tonight - apparently something was borked with my install (was seeing some other strange things going also).  I cleaned everything out and reinstalled it all and now all seems to be well.  If Pood's way doesn't work out for you though the original should.  Not being a coder I have no idea of the significant differences between the two methods or what their use may mean in any way. LOL...

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Hey guys. Sorry for the long time between updates, without further delay :

Version 0.3 is up, on Github !

Quote

* massive rewrite : fix exception when adding/removing part, antenna on root part are now properly accounted for, and other very cool stuff I forget
* add a status display explaining which antennas are used for calculation (useful when a non-combinable antenna is more powerful than a set of combinable antennas)
* add home-planet 's moon to the "signal strength / distance" window
* add an input field in the "signal strength / distance" window to check the signal strength at a given distance

Most important for this update is a massive rewrite of the code, it should be more modulable now and easier to add new functionality.

I updated the OP, add a road-map / to-do list.

I have less free time at this moment but keep the suggestions coming :wink:

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Thanks for the update!  I'll be throwing this back on to play with some more since I highly value the info you're providing.  I would like to add my request - which you already have on the road map - for in flight displays and a massive request for relay transfer stats, preferably in flight but at this point I'll take them any way I can get them... :D Thanks again!

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13 hours ago, rasta013 said:

a massive request for relay transfer stats, preferably in flight but at this point I'll take them any way I can get them... :D Thanks again!

This is planned, I have tried to access in-flight vessel while in the VAB/SPH but can't find them so it will most likely start as an in-flight display (when I have done the "main" in-flight display). Thanks for the support :)

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Ok so quick question and at least one, probably two bug reports...

Question: Don't antennas of the same kind e.g. 2 DTS-1 or 2 Comm-16 stack together?

Spoiler

iMU1FW9.png

DZ6KJsG.png

Bug Report(s): So, provided the above is true, notice the first image states "2 of 6" antennas can be combined?  There's only a total of 5 antennas on the craft.  The 2 DTS-1s and 2 Comm-16s (VSR models) and the probe core.  The craft originally had 6 including the core when I first opened Antenna Helper.  No matter how many I add or remove it always shows 6 - unless I remove all antennas in which case it shows 5 as in the second image.  The second report of course is the non-stacking multiple antennas as reported.  In game, unless I'm very mistaken, antennas of the same type will stack with each other.

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  • The Communotron 16 has a Comb. Exp. of 1
  • The Communotron 16S and the built-in Command Cores have a Comb. Exp. of 0
  • All others have a Comb. Exp. of 0.75
  • For a direct connection direct and relay antennas will combine for the power rating.
  • For a relayed connection only the relay antennas will combine for the power rating.

I hope those points confirm a few pointers discussed above.

Edited by Poodmund

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7 hours ago, rasta013 said:

Question: Don't antennas of the same kind e.g. 2 DTS-1 or 2 Comm-16 stack together?

Not necessary, some do other don't, as Poodmund said. The only one that never combine are the internal one (include in probe / pod). And for the record : rcpsqhT.png

 

7 hours ago, rasta013 said:

The craft originally had 6 including the core when I first opened Antenna Helper.  No matter how many I add or remove it always shows 6 - unless I remove all antennas in which case it shows 5 as in the second image.

I can't reproduce this on a stock install. Is it something happening to all your crafts ? If you can reproduce it please send me your log.

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Well this is why text conversations get confusing sometimes...LOL.  Never wanted anything for non-combinable antennas to show up properly...

If you review the images that are in my post you will see that I have 2 Comm-16 and 2 DTS-1 antennas, not the 16S  The quote from me "2 DTS-1s and 2 Comm-16s" is confusing because I'm trying to make 16 plural.  So, NOT COMM-16S but rather 2 Comm-Sixteens and 2 DTS-Ones...

Here's my log.  Please don't mind the contract errors on Field Science from Contract Configurator...I'm working on that independently in my install to get it running under GPP.  Just for info's sake...I double checked and the antennas are stacking properly as far as the game is concerned.  It's just the antenna helper window that's not reporting it...

Here's my log...

EDIT: UPDATE

Ok, so I've been doing more testing of course and have more info.  Interesting it is actually...

I cannot replicate the above instance...exactly.  BUT...I think the two things I reported may actually be one and the same thing.  Here's what I've noticed.  When I open the AH window the first time after I have attached antennas it will show everything that is attached properly and correctly combine all the antennas it should be.  However, once I start swapping things around the reported antennas in the AH window don't match up from then until I save and reload the craft at which time the window catches up and displays everything properly again.  In the original report above I had already been swapping antennas around and I'd been opening and closing the AH window most likely leading the the picture above that seemed like it wasn't properly stacking the antennas. 

If this description is unclear in any way I'll be happy to document how I'm seeing this and replicating it in my game with screenshots.  Thanks for the help!

Edited by rasta013
Updates

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@rasta013 thanks for the details. The issue come from the symmetry, AH will add only one antenna at a time, no matter how many are really added to the craft via symmetry. I should have a fix soon. In the meantime, if you want AH to recalculate just close / re-open the main window, no need to re-load the craft.

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That was quick :

Version 0.4 is up on Github

Quote

* fix for antennas not accounted for when added via symmetry

Thanks again to @rasta013 for finding this.

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Hey guys

I haven't got time lately to continue working on this, but I still think of it. One thing that 's bothering me in the current state of Antenna Helper is the numbers, they don't mean much as is. It's hard, for me at least, to tell what are the capacity of the probe, how far it can goes. The signal strength per body helps but it's not enough. So I like to make a more visual read out of those numbers : a map of the solar system with a display of the available signal.

Not sure this is readable/understandable so here is how I want it to look :

Available signal now (circle's color reflect the color use in KSP to display the signal strength) ::

aUlDFaF.png

Potential available signal as Kerbin moves on its orbit :

Xt8MfVm.png

How it look with a relay satellite :

Spoiler

RwOA0Oi.png

9i3bQ8s.png

This should be a lot more helpful and intuitive.

BUT there is a lot of work to be done to achieve this and my free time is limited now, should have more around July/August. So don't expect it any time soon.

One big task will also be to make the map available in the editor, with a way to display the connection at a given time in the future.

Also, I haven't reverse the formula for the signal strength per distance, which is mandatory for this feature, yet. The in-flight display isn't done neither, I gave it a quick try some times ago but realize it's more complicated than it looks to get the distance between two ships orbiting different bodies as KSP uses different coordinates references for them.

So be patient :wink: and please share your thought / suggestion about this idea.

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@Li0n, not to bother you, but are you still working on this? I really miss it in 1.3

Edited by Nansuchao

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Hello, @Li0n

I wonder, do you plan to work further on this mod? If so, can you make not only DSN, but also all relay antenna (with quantity selector) as a target?

By the way, great mod, considering total lack of info in stock (including the fact part info doesn't account for antenna range and DSN range modifiers in settings)

Edited by evileye.x

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Sorry, again, for the delay. I didn't get as much free time as I hoped this summer, but I'm still working on this mod (well, at least I'm thinking about it).

 

On 20/07/2017 at 9:54 PM, Nansuchao said:

@Li0n, not to bother you, but are you still working on this? I really miss it in 1.3

I try on KSP 1.3 (with Antenna Helper 0.4) and it seems to work fine. KSP-AVC will complain but it should be OK, if you have a specific issue please report it.

 

On 24/07/2017 at 0:14 PM, evileye.x said:

I wonder, do you plan to work further on this mod? If so, can you make not only DSN, but also all relay antenna (with quantity selector) as a target?

Never thought about that, not a bad idea. It should be easy enough to add it. My original plan was to add all the in-flight relay as targets but I had trouble getting access to in-flight vessel from the editor.

 

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Version 0.5 is up, on Github ! (for KSP 1.2.2 and 1.3)

Quote

* Add a display of the distance to expect per signal strength

Finally !

After I've almost give up on "reversing" the formula to get the max distance for a specified signal strength I tried an easier approach : two version ago I added an input field to check the signal strength at a given distance. I used this to find the maximum distance for a signal of 100%, then divide the maximum range by it. With this ratio I can now divide any maximum range to determine the maximum distance achievable with a signal strength of 100% :confused:

A pic of how it is implemented :

6tZpr21.png

I add some color but I'm not sure it is very intuitive...

  • The number in yellow is the distance at a 75% signal strength
  • The number in orange is the distance at a 50% signal strength
  • The number in red is the distance at a 25% signal strength

How to read-it ?

  • Between 0m and 375 993 918m you will have a signal of 100%.
  • Between 375 993 918m and 9 474 608 547m the signal will decay from 100% to 75%.
  • Between 9 474 608 547m and 14 508 773 073m the signal will decay from 75% to 50%.
  • Between 14 508 773 073m and 19 545 589 163m the signal will decay from 50% to 25%.
  • Between 19 545 589 163m and 28 998 214 001m the signal will decay from 25% to 0%.

 

This solution isn't 100% precise, but in the stock solar system the numbers should check, no guarantee for bigger solar system tho...

For info here are the ratios I used :

  • 100% : 77.124 156 900 215 5
  • 75% : 3.060 623 967 191 712
  • 50% : 1.998 667 554 768 621
  • 25% : 1.483 619 335 214 967

 

Thanks to @Skalou and @Poodmund and my cousin who tried to help me, even if I didn't do it the way you suggested I appreciate.

 

Enjoy :) and please report any bug

 

PS : I've found a bug, when you detach a set of part containing an antenna the Antenna Helper window doesn't catch up, I'll look into it, in the meantime closing / opening the Antenna Helper window will force it to re-calculate.

Edited by Li0n

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Hey

Just a little "quality of life" update :

Version 0.6 is up, on Github ! (for KSP 1.2.2 and 1.3)

Quote

* Fix for antennas not being accounted for when added / removed in a set of parts
* Add a close button to every windows (" X ")
* Windows position are now saved

 

Have fun :)

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Is this mature enough to be put on CKAN (only with your permission, of course) ?

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1 hour ago, linuxgurugamer said:

Is this mature enough to be put on CKAN (only with your permission, of course) ?

Not enough to my opinion. It is stable but it lacks a few "major" features I'd like to add before unleashing it to CKAN.

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