Jump to content

NASA SLS/Orion/Payloads


_Augustus_

Recommended Posts

12 minutes ago, Canopus said:

Salyut is a Space station though not a service Module i don't see the connection there. About the delta v, i guess not they don't need that much for the Missions planned with the Orion. It seems like it doesn't take as much fuel to get to the Distant Retrograde Orbit or near rectilinear Halo orbit as opposed to low Lunar Orbit.

It has second port to insert a booster.

Edited by kerbiloid
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, kerbiloid said:

It has second port to insert a booster.

Yeah but sending an entire space station with even less Delta v every time you fly an Orion doesn't sound like a reasonable alternative to the ESM.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, kerbiloid said:

It has second port to insert a booster.

How would this give Orion a reasonable dv alone, much less combined with Salyut?

Apollo CSM was 2800 m/s (unsure if this figure includes mission segments with the LEM or not). Orion is ~1800. 

Saltut and Soyuz only have <400 m/s, right, and that's moving themselves, not more massive craft.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, kerbiloid said:

The entire space station weights less than Orion itself (even equipped) and can stay in orbit till the next occasion.

Orions mission is to reenter from high orbits as to enable human exploration beyond low earth orbit. I don't see how an old Russian Spacestation could fill that role unless itself was equipped with a big service module to break into LEO and meet with a Soyuz. Orion (the Capsule only) weighs 10 tons. Salyut 7 was 20 tons.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, tater said:

Saltut and Soyuz only have <400 m/s

With the fuel in their inner tanks. That's why I mention the second port  - for an external booster.

2 minutes ago, Canopus said:

Orion (the Capsule only) weighs 10 tons.

With not only capsule ~20.
Salyut ~19.

Edited by kerbiloid
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Canopus said:

Yes it weighs more with Service module, but it also has way more Delta V.

Than a 20 t external fuel tank with an engine, attached to the opposite Salyut docking port?

("Old" - that's funny. What can be "old" in an aluminium can, especially compared to another aluminium can - ATV?)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, kerbiloid said:

Than a 20 t external fuel tank with an engine, attached to the opposite Salyut docking port?

("Old" - that's funny. What can be "old" in an aluminium can, especially compared to another aluminium can - ATV?)

So instead of just making a SM that isn't useless, Orion should dock to a station almost its own mass with SM, then design a new docking SM upper stage and dock that to the station docked to Orion?

Seems even less likely than a decent SM.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, tater said:

Orion should dock to a station almost its own mass with SM

 

14 minutes ago, Canopus said:

Orion (the Capsule only) weighs 10 tons.

As after connecting to Salyut, Orion no longer needs its own SM, then total mass is just 1.5 times greater than a single Orion and more or less the same as for Orion with extended SM..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, tater said:

it's also power and life support.

Salyut is this. No need to launch it every time, it just waits for you in LEO.
With a booster attached from the opposite side.

Edited by kerbiloid
Link to comment
Share on other sites

25 minutes ago, kerbiloid said:

Salyut is this. No need to launch it every time, it just waits for you in LEO.
With a booster attached from the opposite side.

So you are proposing a reusable shuttle that flies from leo to lunar orbit and back? If that was an option we wouldn't need the Orion Capsule anyway. I don't really see why it would have to be a Salyut though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, Canopus said:

If that was an option we wouldn't need the Orion Capsule anyway.

Why not. CST-100 is enough to deliver the crew to Salyut and back.

14 minutes ago, Canopus said:

I don't really see why it would have to be a Salyut though.

It also doesn't have to be ATV. Salyut just has two docking ports.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, kerbiloid said:

It also doesn't have to be ATV. Salyut just has two docking ports.

Well the ESM is only loosely based on the ATV anyway so it has no docking ports. Docking Ports aren't the point of the Service module

 

Edited by Canopus
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, kerbiloid said:

(Offtopic here, but just by the way.
2-3 months ago I have suggested in SpaceX thread to make a Dragon-v1+ATV TKS-style ship...
I'm really frightened now. Do they get ideas from a game forum?..)

ESM was devised in 2013 so i guess not. You also seem to be missing the point a little. The ESM will have no pressurized space so its not an equivalent of the whole TKS situation, it provides only life support, power and propulsion.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Salyut is dead. There are no DOS hulls left and the last FGB module is Nauka, which has been delayed mostly because of aging problems (cracks and contamination). Russia has no production lines for building new modules. The tooling and supply chains are gone. Building a new Salyut would be like building a new Skylab. You would be better off starting from scratch. 'Tis a silly idea.

 

Edited by Nibb31
Link to comment
Share on other sites

@kerbiloid's choice of mission vehicle is amusing in its unfeasibility, but he's not too far off a certain train of thought. The Augustine Commission recommended Orion/Constellation (by then close to current configuration) to be restricted to spaceflight only, with launch and reentry carried out by Commercial Crew. Yeah... it already had a working RV by then.

Which brings us back to the elephant in the room.

Orion delenda est.

Edited by DDE
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...