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Just now, Beccab said:

I'd put my money on either a 3 raptor or 9 raptor static fire, it seems too early for a 29 raptor one. But we'll see!

I have to agree with you - but that did not stop me from confirming that it was 8 days between SN-15's static fire and flight. 

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39 minutes ago, Beccab said:

I'd put my money on either a 3 raptor or 9 raptor static fire, it seems too early for a 29 raptor one. But we'll see!

Yeah, I doubt the orbital launch table can handle 29 Raptors without a water deluge. Of course, that doesn’t mean we can’t have a water deluge installed in the next week. 

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Just now, sevenperforce said:

Yeah, I doubt the orbital launch table can handle 29 Raptors without a water deluge. Of course, that doesn’t mean we can’t have a water deluge installed in the next week. 

As they has so much LN2, I wonder if they plan to use this for cooling during takeoff? Its free as they get it then they extract oxygen. 

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Just now, sevenperforce said:

Yeah, I doubt the orbital launch table can handle 29 Raptors without a water deluge. Of course, that doesn’t mean we can’t have a water deluge installed in the next week. 

They were actually testing the system some weeks ago (only the deploymeny, no water involved) so at least on the OLM they are already installed, though wether it's connected to the water tank and it is ready for even a static fire is or not is unknown (probably unlikely)

Just now, magnemoe said:

As they has so much LN2, I wonder if they plan to use this for cooling during takeoff? Its free as they get it then they extract oxygen. 

They have a water tank too, no need to

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5 hours ago, magnemoe said:

As they has so much LN2, I wonder if they plan to use this for cooling during takeoff? Its free as they get it then they extract oxygen. 

Probably no. Water has more than 10 times higher heat of vaporization which is the most important energy absorbing phenomenon in cooling. Very cold nitrogen would also cause worse heat shocks and make many materials brittle. As far as I know one of the most important reason for use of stainless steel in rockets is its ability to keep its mechanical properties at -200 C.

Nitrogen can be sold or be used to keep stored propellants cold. It is not much compared to overall costs of rocket launching but maybe they get back energy cost of liquefaction process.

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The thing is, they have a point:

Quote

On Wednesday, Amazon fired back, accusing Musk of openly defying lawful regulations time and again. “The conduct of SpaceX and other Musk-led companies makes their view plain: rules are for other people, and those who insist upon or even simply request compliance are deserving of derision and ad hominem attacks,” Amazon said in its filing with the agency.

I've mentioned this before, but SpaceX really has consistently projected an attitude that rules and regulations are for other people.

I don't know if it has any bearing on this particular case, but it is an attitude (or at least, the projected image of an attitude) that could really come to cost them dearly.

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Looks like the Inspiration 4 launch will be Sept 15/16 (15th here in the US, 16th UTC).

Looks like the total sats on the Starlink launch is 51. The laser equipped (I almost typed "armed," lol, too many wargames) sats are likely slightly heavier.

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15 hours ago, mikegarrison said:

The thing is, they have a point:

I've mentioned this before, but SpaceX really has consistently projected an attitude that rules and regulations are for other people.

I don't know if it has any bearing on this particular case, but it is an attitude (or at least, the projected image of an attitude) that could really come to cost them dearly.

I ran into several Army Staff NCOs on Fort Knox who had discovered the power of using regulations to stop innovation and trying to do new things.  Regulation had given the guy who's usual job is to figure out 'how' the ability to just say no. 

It was maddening.

At the time, I was a young Captain tasked with teaching newly minted Army Lieutenants how to wage war professionally.  It was a subject I took a lot of pride in and was enthusiastic about the opportunity of sharing my experience and my Service's approach with these guys.

The Marine Corps has a very different philosophy from the Army when it comes to training.  We know the stuff in the manuals, and we teach to that - but then we go out in the field and create our own scenarios - which can look like 'winging it' - especially because we embrace chaos (no plan survives first contact etc.).  We expect our officers to know what is inside the box - and then we deliberately throw them into a situation where they have to think for themselves - including sometimes thinking or doing something outside of the box. This key to our success was something I  Iooked forward to doing with these young lieutenants - who had thus far only been taught in classrooms by Army Staff NCOs. 

 

We got going and were finally getting to the good stuff - when things go wrong and the lieutenant is forced by circumstances to make decisions on the fly.  This is a key factor in how we do what we do.  We actually let the officer and troops experience a helmet fire in peacetime training so that they are prepared for when stuff hits the fan in the real world. 

 

The Army SNCOs called the entire training evolution to a halt - because we had gone off script.  (The Army, at least at the time, trained to 'standards' and ran set piece Tables) ... There was no room for innovative thinking - going off script was a safety violation.  They got range control to shut us down.  Despite fact that we were not running a table in the first place. The lieutenants learned nothing - except, perhaps, that strict adherence to regulation is the only way forward. 

So - I have some appreciation for Musk and SX's opinions. Regulation is a good starting place - but its use by spoilers who want nothing more than comfort and conformity is the literal death knell of innovation. 

Bezos may succeed in taking the wind out of SX's sails - but will anyone benefit if he succeeds? 

Edited by JoeSchmuckatelli
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2 hours ago, JoeSchmuckatelli said:

So - I have some appreciation for Musk and SX's opinions. Regulation is a good starting place - but its use by spoilers who want nothing more than comfort and conformity is the literal death knell of innovation. 

 

I think the issue here is not that Musk and co. oppose regulations, more that he moves shockingly fast (despite ElonTime) in industries where progress is typically glacial—at best, and regulations simply cannot keep up. They need reforming to better fit the modern world that SpaceX and others are finally ushering in.  I mean, seriously, at the start of the year there was no orbital launch pad in Boca, and now they’ll very likely be ready to launch within the year.  Possibly more than once. Contrast.. those other guys, who’ve been building their own pad for a couple years now? In a place with much better infrastructure?

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5 hours ago, CatastrophicFailure said:

think the issue here is not that Musk and co. oppose regulations, more that he moves shockingly fast in industries where progress is typically glacial—at best, and regulations simply cannot keep up.

Absolutely agree. 

I've not heard him oppose - but chafe?  Yeah. 

.. And I absolutely agree that the purpose is to force SX to become as glacial and typical as the other players in the industry - where their contacts will be once again king in who gets the manna from the congressional teat 

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5 hours ago, StrandedonEarth said:

Needs a big butterfly net? Maybe left over from MS. Tree?:cool:

For clarity, that's not the QD arm extention: what you're seeng there is going to be part of what will try catching Superheavy

Edited by Beccab
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