Jump to content

[1.11.2] Whirligig World Planetary System: An Absurd Homeworld In An Alien Solar System. Moon revamps! 0.12.4 3.28.2021


Recommended Posts

On 4/22/2019 at 3:21 PM, GregroxMun said:

Thanks, I'll look into it.

 

EDIT: it's in the next version. Not sure if I'll end up with a 0.9.2 or a 0.10.0 next, but either way the next version should have fixed this.

Thank you very much! I am definitely going to start a full career mode playthrough soon!

Edited by Mangu
I’m new and goofed up
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/22/2019 at 3:21 PM, GregroxMun said:

Thanks, I'll look into it.

 

EDIT: it's in the next version. Not sure if I'll end up with a 0.9.2 or a 0.10.0 next, but either way the next version should have fixed this.

Thank you for the quick reply! I am definitely going to play this pack in career soon!

Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a few announcements.

1: I have a Patreon now.

https://www.patreon.com/Gregrox

I enjoy creating the art, configuration, and writing that goes into my Kerbal Space Program planet pack mods. It's one of the very few things in life that I feel gives me any kind of purpose. But alas, it's becoming increasingly hard to pay the bills (internet, power, medical, and food), so I need your help to be able to keep doing these things. So if you like what I do and want to support the production of updates and more mods, please consider making a donation.

2: On the subject of the next Whirligig World update.

The next update, 0.10.0, will probably be the final development version before 1.0.0. And since it is still in development there's still time to make an important set of major changes to the planet pack.

The trouble is, I never checked Principia compatibility for the last several versions of Whirligig World. And parts of the system fall apart. Now most people would probably just make a principia-specific patch to fix those problems and call it a day, but unfortunately I'm not most people. When I started work on Whirligig World, I thought it was uncharacteristically unrealistic for me, but over time I've polished it, made it more realistic, and found justifications for things that I thought were unrealistic. I've sunk a lot of thought and effort into making Whirligig World a realistic system, and I feel I would always regret pushing Whirligig World to 1.0 with an unstable system, too late to fix anything for fear of ruining people's games. The Principia patch therefore must apply to the stock physics as well (aside from the axial tilt.)

Here's a list of stability problems with Whirligig World in Principia:

  • Troymin, supposed trojan of Kerbmun, orbiting Mesbin, gets its eccentricity increased until it flies by Kerbmun.
    • Kerbmun's orbit does not seem to change as much as Troymin's does leading up to the flyby, which leads me to suspect it might be a problem with how the trojan is set up and not a problem with perturbations from Derbin, but I'm not sure. I would really like to preserve Troymin as a Kerbmun Trojan as best as possible, even if that means moving Kerbmun, but it's possible there's a better solution involving tweaking Kerbmun's orbit.
  • Ollym's orbit around Lowel is unstable.
    • Due to Lowel's inclined orbit around the nearby red dwarf Gememma, Ollym's inclination and eventually inclination gets significantly pumped up until Ollym crashes into Lowel. (And then it continues to evolve because principia doesn't collide planets) This appears to be a real instability, not an integration problem. I suspect the only solution is to reduce the inclination of Ollym with respect to Lowel's orbit, which will of course destroy the unique axial tilt and equatorial ice belt of Lowel.
  • Mandrake and Rutherford's minor moons, despite being a Pluto/Charon/Moons clone in mass ratios and orbit ratios, will fall apart quickly.
    • I suspect there is probably a way to fix the resonance since it should be identical to the one in real life.

I haven't decided exactly what I'm going to do about Kerbin and Troymin, but it will probably involve a pretty major change in their orbit.

As for Lowel and Ollym, I don't want to get rid of Lowel's ice belt and axial tilt, so instead I'm going to separate Lowel and Ollym into different orbits. I'm not sure if they'll stay together as trojans, if they remain nearby, or if I move Ollym further out to be more like a Mars analogue, but they're no longer going to be a binary.

Mandrake and Rutherford's satellites ought to be stable since they're based upon the stable Pluto/Charon system. I can tell that part of the instability seems to be a pumping up of the moons' inclinations, likely from tides from Gememma, so Mandrake's orbit will be made much less inclined. If that doesn't solve the problem, and I suspect it won't, there may be some way I can change the specifics of how the orbits are defined so that they remain in their resonance and aren't thrown out by Rutherford. If not, I'll have to break up the Pluto analogy and further separate the orbits.

In somewhat less user-affecting news, WW 0.10.0 will include a new prerequisite (which will come with the pack alongside Kopernicus-Expansions) called Scientific Revolution, which allows for a better way of defining science definitions. I'll also be tweaking the user experience of homeworld switching somewhat. I intend to separate the actual homeworld swap from the lore changes, and there will be three sets of lore (sci-defs, descriptions, science multipliers), Mesbin, Kerbmun, and Generic. Generic will be used for Interstellar Consortium, as well as rare cases when you're not sure if the player is from Mesbin, Kerbmun, or Kerbin.

Also maybe I'll revamp Kerbmun who knows.

The pre-releases of the update and development images will be made available to supporters on Patreon.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...
On 5/1/2019 at 1:37 PM, GregroxMun said:

I have a few announcements.

1: I have a Patreon now.

https://www.patreon.com/Gregrox

I enjoy creating the art, configuration, and writing that goes into my Kerbal Space Program planet pack mods. It's one of the very few things in life that I feel gives me any kind of purpose. But alas, it's becoming increasingly hard to pay the bills (internet, power, medical, and food), so I need your help to be able to keep doing these things. So if you like what I do and want to support the production of updates and more mods, please consider making a donation.

2: On the subject of the next Whirligig World update.

The next update, 0.10.0, will probably be the final development version before 1.0.0. And since it is still in development there's still time to make an important set of major changes to the planet pack.

The trouble is, I never checked Principia compatibility for the last several versions of Whirligig World. And parts of the system fall apart. Now most people would probably just make a principia-specific patch to fix those problems and call it a day, but unfortunately I'm not most people. When I started work on Whirligig World, I thought it was uncharacteristically unrealistic for me, but over time I've polished it, made it more realistic, and found justifications for things that I thought were unrealistic. I've sunk a lot of thought and effort into making Whirligig World a realistic system, and I feel I would always regret pushing Whirligig World to 1.0 with an unstable system, too late to fix anything for fear of ruining people's games. The Principia patch therefore must apply to the stock physics as well (aside from the axial tilt.)

Here's a list of stability problems with Whirligig World in Principia:

  • Troymin, supposed trojan of Kerbmun, orbiting Mesbin, gets its eccentricity increased until it flies by Kerbmun.
    • Kerbmun's orbit does not seem to change as much as Troymin's does leading up to the flyby, which leads me to suspect it might be a problem with how the trojan is set up and not a problem with perturbations from Derbin, but I'm not sure. I would really like to preserve Troymin as a Kerbmun Trojan as best as possible, even if that means moving Kerbmun, but it's possible there's a better solution involving tweaking Kerbmun's orbit.
  • Ollym's orbit around Lowel is unstable.
    • Due to Lowel's inclined orbit around the nearby red dwarf Gememma, Ollym's inclination and eventually inclination gets significantly pumped up until Ollym crashes into Lowel. (And then it continues to evolve because principia doesn't collide planets) This appears to be a real instability, not an integration problem. I suspect the only solution is to reduce the inclination of Ollym with respect to Lowel's orbit, which will of course destroy the unique axial tilt and equatorial ice belt of Lowel.
  • Mandrake and Rutherford's minor moons, despite being a Pluto/Charon/Moons clone in mass ratios and orbit ratios, will fall apart quickly.
    • I suspect there is probably a way to fix the resonance since it should be identical to the one in real life.

I haven't decided exactly what I'm going to do about Kerbin and Troymin, but it will probably involve a pretty major change in their orbit.

As for Lowel and Ollym, I don't want to get rid of Lowel's ice belt and axial tilt, so instead I'm going to separate Lowel and Ollym into different orbits. I'm not sure if they'll stay together as trojans, if they remain nearby, or if I move Ollym further out to be more like a Mars analogue, but they're no longer going to be a binary.

Mandrake and Rutherford's satellites ought to be stable since they're based upon the stable Pluto/Charon system. I can tell that part of the instability seems to be a pumping up of the moons' inclinations, likely from tides from Gememma, so Mandrake's orbit will be made much less inclined. If that doesn't solve the problem, and I suspect it won't, there may be some way I can change the specifics of how the orbits are defined so that they remain in their resonance and aren't thrown out by Rutherford. If not, I'll have to break up the Pluto analogy and further separate the orbits.

In somewhat less user-affecting news, WW 0.10.0 will include a new prerequisite (which will come with the pack alongside Kopernicus-Expansions) called Scientific Revolution, which allows for a better way of defining science definitions. I'll also be tweaking the user experience of homeworld switching somewhat. I intend to separate the actual homeworld swap from the lore changes, and there will be three sets of lore (sci-defs, descriptions, science multipliers), Mesbin, Kerbmun, and Generic. Generic will be used for Interstellar Consortium, as well as rare cases when you're not sure if the player is from Mesbin, Kerbmun, or Kerbin.

Also maybe I'll revamp Kerbmun who knows.

The pre-releases of the update and development images will be made available to supporters on Patreon.

Will full Scatterer support be coming soon? Or at least a patch to delete the broken Mesbin Scatterer?(Scatterer thinks Mesbin is Kerbin so you see a weird blue ball inside of Mesbin while orbiting)

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Mangu said:

Will full Scatterer support be coming soon? Or at least a patch to delete the broken Mesbin Scatterer?(Scatterer thinks Mesbin is Kerbin so you see a weird blue ball inside of Mesbin while orbiting)

Please remove the full quote from your reply, it's unnecessary to quote the whole thing.

The current release actually should include configs to enable sun flares and disable kerbin atmosphere, but it is officially not supported by Scatterer. (After all, since there's no support for any of the planets, why have it installed anyway?)

As for whether there will be scatterer support... well... that kind of sensitive development info can only be bought with patreon. ;)

Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, GregroxMun said:

Please remove the full quote from your reply, it's unnecessary to quote the whole thing.

The current release actually should include configs to enable sun flares and disable kerbin atmosphere, but it is officially not supported by Scatterer. (After all, since there's no support for any of the planets, why have it installed anyway?)

As for whether there will be scatterer support... well... that kind of sensitive development info can only be bought with patreon. ;)

Yeah I realize how HUGE that quote is now... and thanks for telling me about the functioning flares! 

Link to post
Share on other sites

I love this pack! (that's saying a lot, because I haven't even started it up yet!) 

 

But before I was playing with Before Kerbin and I still DLed just for the Kaputnik and the better asteroids. [snip]

Edited by Snark
Redacted by moderator
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...

The next version of Kopernicus, which will likely be" v1.7.1-1" assuming Squad doesn't release another patch any time soon, will probably not be compatible with Whirligig World, since the code for Kopernicus has been massively refactored, and all plugins that rely on Kopernicus will be broken. Many planet mods will be unaffected by this, since the configs will remain mostly unchanged. However, the Kopernicus Expansions plugin will need to be updated to work with the new Kopernicus, and Whirligig World absolutely relies on KopX. Thomas has said that he will finish the new Kopernicus version before doing Kopernicus Expansions, which may mean he releases Kopernicus before KopX is ready.

When WW is compatible with KSP 1.7.1, I'll change "[1.7.0]" in the thread title to "[1.7.1]." Otherwise it won't be compatible. Depending upon when that it, the version will either be 0.9.2 or 0.10.0. If it's 0.9.2 it will only be 0.9.1 but with updated plugins, and maybe the new flags I've been working on.

By the way, I've been working on some new flag designs! Here's four of my favorites that will be coming soon. Also note, I've added "aWW_" to the front of all flag names for sorting purposes, which will break the flags in existing save files. You can either fix that by editing your save file so that all the flag URLs are updated, or by editing the name of the flag in GameData/WhirligigWorld/Flags to be the original name. But hey, it's still in the development stage, I'm allowed to break save files sometimes.

9z43dS4.png kAf673R.png

NFN4RuE.png u9hmsac.png

Here's a simple version of the upper left flag.

In case you can't tell, I really like the Ottoman crescent and star iconography.

Edited by GregroxMun
Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok, trying to have a go at the Mesbin-Kerbmun homeworld swap, but the system's bugged out now... :/ What happens is Kerbmun is now in the center of Mesbin, which is in the center of Kaywell... so that's a problem. I'd really appreciate some help to get it working. No Idea what's causing it. Screenshots of Settings config and Gamedata folder (That's a LODDA parts packs) are available if anyone needs them...

Link to post
Share on other sites

hey gregroxmun!

 

I'm having a problem with kopernicus not loading properly, I don't know why. if you could give me a explaniation that would be greatly apreaciated! here's what it says. oh and by the way here's the imgur link for the gamedata folder screenshots and the log folders: https://imgur.com/a/z17c3za

 

kopernicus was not able to load the custom planetary system due to an exception in the loading process. loading your save game is NOT recommended, because the missing planets could corrupt it and delete your progress. please contact the planet pack author or the kopernicus team about the issue and send them a valid bug report.

thank's!

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/12/2019 at 2:17 PM, Nebulagoodies said:

hey gregroxmun!

 

I'm having a problem with kopernicus not loading properly, I don't know why. if you could give me a explaniation that would be greatly apreaciated! here's what it says. oh and by the way here's the imgur link for the gamedata folder screenshots and the log folders: https://imgur.com/a/z17c3za

 

kopernicus was not able to load the custom planetary system due to an exception in the loading process. loading your save game is NOT recommended, because the missing planets could corrupt it and delete your progress. please contact the planet pack author or the kopernicus team about the issue and send them a valid bug report.

thank's!

The problem is almost certainly that you have the wrong version of KSP, Kopernicus, and/or Kopernicus Expansions--Regional PQSMods.

By the way there's an important little line in that Kopernicus error message that says send them a valid bug report. I know what the Kopernicus error message is, I get it every time I mess something up in development. If you want a diagnosis than you're going to need to send the logs, which Kopernicus usually handily zips up into a file in KSP/Logs. (Never send logs in plain text. Either a link to a paste on pastebin or a download via dropbox or google drive or something is fine, but don't post logs in plain text on the forums, it clutters up the thread)

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Whirligig World 0.10.0 is fast approaching, and will probably be the final version before 1.0, which I would rather like to get out on October 15th 2019, two years after I first posted this thread.

There's still a few things I need to do, and a few things that need to be done which are outside of my control. Breaking Ground broke the SciRev plugin, so that needs to be fixed ideally before I can release. And of course Kopernicus 1.7.2 needs to come out first but I don't think we're close enough to release that that is a problem.

cGjVZpy.png

Kerbmun Space Program hype? note that the ksc is tilted 90 degrees in this shot, the orientation is fixed in the current development version.

 

 

 

 

grrr I don't want this post to be part of the above post >:( 

3 hours ago, Nebulagoodies said:

Did you check your KSP / Kopernicus / Kopernicus Expansions versions first?

Edited by GregroxMun
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/14/2019 at 12:28 PM, GregroxMun said:

Whirligig World 0.10.0 is fast approaching, and will probably be the final version before 1.0, which I would rather like to get out on October 15th 2019, two years after I first posted this thread.

There's still a few things I need to do, and a few things that need to be done which are outside of my control. Breaking Ground broke the SciRev plugin, so that needs to be fixed ideally before I can release. And of course Kopernicus 1.7.2 needs to come out first but I don't think we're close enough to release that that is a problem.

cGjVZpy.png

Kerbmun Space Program hype? note that the ksc is tilted 90 degrees in this shot, the orientation is fixed in the current development version.

 

 

 

 

grrr I don't want this post to be part of the above post >:( 

Did you check your KSP / Kopernicus / Kopernicus Expansions versions first?

Turns out that I had Kopernicus 1.7.1-4 instead of 1.7.1-5 sorry. Anyways love the planet pack! 

Btw will you add full scatter support instead of partial. Sorry I’m addicted to scatterer.

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Nebulagoodies said:

Btw will you add full scatter support instead of partial. Sorry I’m addicted to scatterer.

That remains to be seen, but almost certainly not in 0.10.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...
On 6/21/2019 at 1:36 AM, jpinard said:

Is this extrasolar or does it replace Kerbin and others?

You start on Mesbin (or Kerbmun if you enable an option in the settings.cfg) in the Kaywell system, and the Kerbol system is deleted. However, if you install the Interstellar Consortium (which is currently not supported by Kopernicus) plugin, you will be able to switch between playing on Kerbin or playing on Mesbin (or Kerbmun) and both systems will be visible.

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, GregroxMun said:

You start on Mesbin (or Kerbmun if you enable an option in the settings.cfg) in the Kaywell system, and the Kerbol system is deleted. However, if you install the Interstellar Consortium (which is currently not supported by Kopernicus) plugin, you will be able to switch between playing on Kerbin or playing on Mesbin (or Kerbmun) and both systems will be visible.

Cool!  I did look at the Interstellar Consortium and it looks super awesome but I couldn't figure out how to do an install.  If I made a fresh install of KSP, how would I make it work?  Based on what you're saying I would definately not install Kopernicus?

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, jpinard said:

Cool!  I did look at the Interstellar Consortium and it looks super awesome but I couldn't figure out how to do an install.  If I made a fresh install of KSP, how would I make it work?  Based on what you're saying I would definately not install Kopernicus?

Kopernicus is how planet packs work. You can't use planet packs without Kopernicus. The latest version of Kopernicus is not compatible with KSP 1.7.2, therefore no planet mods are compatible with 1.7.2. You will have to go back to KSP 1.7.1 and use Kopernicus version 1.7.1-5. HOWEVER. Kopernicus 1.7.1-1 and up are not compatible with plugins designed to work with Kopernicus 1.7.0-1 and earlier.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, GregroxMun said:

Kopernicus is how planet packs work. You can't use planet packs without Kopernicus. The latest version of Kopernicus is not compatible with KSP 1.7.2, therefore no planet mods are compatible with 1.7.2. You will have to go back to KSP 1.7.1 and use Kopernicus version 1.7.1-5. HOWEVER. Kopernicus 1.7.1-1 and up are not compatible with plugins designed to work with Kopernicus 1.7.0-1 and earlier.

Ahhh OK.  I thought you were saying it was incompatible period, not just for the latest version of 1.72.

 

Sop the installation is a bit vague for the  Interstellar Consortium.  Do I do the "clone or download" option, then when I open the zip find the gamedata directory and drop whatever is in that into my own game... then I'm good to go?

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, jpinard said:

Ahhh OK.  I thought you were saying it was incompatible period, not just for the latest version of 1.72.

 

Sop the installation is a bit vague for the  Interstellar Consortium.  Do I do the "clone or download" option, then when I open the zip find the gamedata directory and drop whatever is in that into my own game... then I'm good to go?

You have to go to releases on GitHub and download the release.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...