harrisjosh2711 Posted December 8, 2017 Share Posted December 8, 2017 5 hours ago, Canopus said: Oh you are allowed to have a different view, but if it goes that much against the mainstream you shouldn‘t wonder why no one agrees with you. :-) People do agree with him. Me being one. The crowd we are talking about wont be happy unless there are more females than males in the game. Also, Valentina would have to be like super kerbal and unable to die. Other wise someone is going to get upset. I feel like I'm on Yahoo or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corona688 Posted December 8, 2017 Share Posted December 8, 2017 Feel free to ignore those. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Peabody Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 2 hours ago, harrisjosh2711 said: People do agree with him. Me being one. The crowd we are talking about wont be happy unless there are more females than males in the game. Also, Valentina would have to be like super kerbal and unable to die. Other wise someone is going to get upset. I feel like I'm on Yahoo or something. Bang on my friend. It's ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Kerman Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 I personally feel that some selection mechanism that allows players to select their veterans, both male and female, would be more ideal. I have some experience with this. My 8 year old daughter hated KSP because it took me away from her favorite game "guess what animal I am" so one day I renamed Valentina to her name and she was immediately drawn in. "Can I plant a flag on the moon?" was the first thing she wanted to do and now she loves to be my co-pilot so long as "Sophie Kerman" is on the roster (she also likes to EVA her brothers mid flight and leave them behind - Kids!). Anything that engages more people to play KSP can only be a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 3 hours ago, Corona688 said: Once again, I think this heated argument is completely deflated just by pointing out that THIS GAME HAS NO CHARACTERS. None. Nada. Zilch. There is no plot to clumsily rewrite around a new female Kerbal. There is no lore to throw away and disrespect by adding a new female Kerbal. This, it really underlines the lack of any sense of story in the so-called career mode (whose career is it, anyway?). Many treat kerbals as expendable, and kill many, which I find nearly impossible to accomplish, even with life support mods <shrug>. As I have said, I'd rather see them have randomized skills---but I'd also like a career system where the skills, you know, mattered. For this to be the case, they'd have to function autonomously, so that the decision making of crew balance on a mission might actually matter... that would be if "career" was managing a space program, instead of whatever it is (a kooky side-quest generator?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superfluous J Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 4 hours ago, tater said: The roster could start empty, and you have to hire your first astronauts. Yeah but you'd have to start your career with $100,000,000 extra. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 1 minute ago, 5thHorseman said: Yeah but you'd have to start your career with $100,000,000 extra. Starting budget changes, as does starting hire costs. If skills cost you, and they are random (maybe the starting X (Jeb, Val, etc) have a random skill, but a min of 1 or 2), then you might hire one good astronaut, or a few low skill ones, instead. The funds is a trivial balance issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorDavinci Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 (edited) Just fantastic ... Lets bring identity politics into the game then What's next, different shades of green skin to make Kerbals more diverse? EDIT: Actually, to add to this ... If you're going to make female kerbals more prominent then, in the name of equality, shouldn't the LGBTQQIAAP community be represented as well? I would think that if we're trying to have a proper representation of the people of this planet that everyone should be represented, not just male and females ... At least that is the conclusion I come to if you want to travel down this rabbit hole Edited December 9, 2017 by DoctorDavinci Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheif Operations Director Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 (edited) Personnally I think that this should be improved upon where Kerbals can receive "intensive training" (which would cost credits and science) this so called "training" would take place in the astronaut complex it would display a video of a Kerbal doing so Kerbal things with a queue for intensive training only or something like that and then three Kerbals (Gene, Werner and Jeb) Hand the Kerbal a Orange Suit and then the Kerbal is like ahhh in the video he come out of the complex with the theme song and walking out to look a a rocket launch (a prerecoreded Launch) That Would be the plot of the video. This way we can have accurate Shuttle Launches with a full compliment of 7 orange jump suits or more. I do however however want to highlight that making a Kerbal go through intensive training wouldn't be a bad thing like maby a mandatory 10 Successful Recoveries and 100 Science Collected so orange jump suits can't be be bought with each new Kerbal so they still feel like special and like actual veterans, I don't want Jen Bob Bill and Valinitina (sorry for spelling) to lose their appeal for special launches or missions because of their veteran status. It should feel like a accomplishment to the player too (that they managed to keep their Kerbal alive for 10 missions and collect 100 science with that specific Kerbal) I think training should take 14 Kerbal Days and cost 25,000 credits with 25 science to train them. THIS SHOULD APPLY TO SANDBOX TO AND HERE IS WHY! ... The Reason the science and training times would apply to sandbox it it gives a purpose to playing sandbox... To better outfit your space program not just to build space stations but to better Kerbin it feels more accomplishing... Lastly I think Veteran Kerbals should be given a bigger EVA Suit similarly to the original and not the backup/emergency ones the astronauts use today. They should be able to hold 15 units of EVA Propellant instead of five. I know this may seem ridiculous over a suit but that being said their are some legitimate reasons for wanting to put Kerbals though this "training program" if this idea is taken into account. P.S. I'm going to start a new thread about improving Kerbals please help comment so Dev's can see it new topic is Edited December 9, 2017 by Cheif Operations Director Didn't get a chance to complete due too glitches Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 14 days? How about having things all take reasonable amounts of time so that KSP career doesn't go from "What's a rocket?" to leaving (crewed) for Eeloo after having discovered rocketry 3 months ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dman979 Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 Hey guys, it's a friendly neighborhood moderator checking back in for the third time. Stay away from: A. Personal attacks. Dispute the post, not the poster. B. Sexism. Even in joke form. As you all know, both of those things are against the rules, so some posts have been removed. Keep the discussion within appropriate limits, and we won't need to close the thread. But if we continue to see inappropriate behavior here, the thread will be locked. Consider this a final warning to play nice. Carry on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSK Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 8 hours ago, harrisjosh2711 said: People do agree with him. Me being one. The crowd we are talking about wont be happy unless there are more females than males in the game. Also, Valentina would have to be like super kerbal and unable to die. Other wise someone is going to get upset. I feel like I'm on Yahoo or something. Actually, if you look at this thread, it started off with a modest proposal, no super kerbals of either gender suggested or required. The first page of comments were variations on a theme of 'yeah, why not', with some discussion over details. Then Cassel steps in with his 'is this a game for kids or feminists' comment and things got a bit more disputational. 5 hours ago, DoctorDavinci said: Just fantastic ... Lets bring identity politics into the game then What's next, different shades of green skin to make Kerbals more diverse? EDIT: Actually, to add to this ... If you're going to make female kerbals more prominent then, in the name of equality, shouldn't the LGBTQQIAAP community be represented as well? I would think that if we're trying to have a proper representation of the people of this planet that everyone should be represented, not just male and females ... At least that is the conclusion I come to if you want to travel down this rabbit hole Why not - purely from a gameplay perspective, more variety in colour would make the legions of white-suits a bit more interesting. As for the your second point - probably yes if you could figure out a way of visually representing, for example, a gay kerbal, without descending into cliche. @Rocket In My Pocket - please accept my apologies. My reply to your post was more aggressive than it needed to be and your idea of having a 2x2 orange suit team to start with is a perfectly sensible one that solves the balance and bloat issues together. Sorry. @adsii1970 - with respect, there's quite a bit more difference than just hair and eyebrows. And yes, in hindsight it might have headed off a number of threads if Squad had chosen a more neutral design for the kerbals. A green version of the Grays perhaps, only less sinister. Then again, there's a definite sub-set of players that like to identify with their kerbals and then you get examples like @James Kerman's daughter where having a kerbal avatar she can relate to has drawn her into the game. Then you get the folks that like the parallels between KSP and real life space programs - and they're getting a whole expansion aimed at them, so presumably Squad thinks they're a big enough player demographic to matter. So I would argue that having gendered characters has helped drive KSP's popularity (leaving aside any arguments as to whether that was right or necessary). And as soon as you have gendered characters then the sorts of arguments you refer to are pretty much inevitable because some folks do see balance between those characters as important. But I've already said my piece on that topic and the OP has been kind enough to quote it in the first post, so I won't rehash it here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrChumley Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 I hereby declare the kerbals with mascara... Kerbals with mascara. Have I gone too far? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiffedStarfish Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 I’m kinda jumping between opinions, but seeing the things about identifying as kerbals in game, (which to some extent I do) I think pretty much all the tools to do that are either in game or just a cfg. file away. I’m really happy with how Squad handles kerbals, you’re free to just fill in the (many) gaps yourself. I’d be against visual diversity in kerbals for this. (And also for the nostalgia) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheif Operations Director Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 (edited) 7 hours ago, tater said: 14 days? How about having things all take reasonable amounts of time so that KSP career doesn't go from "What's a rocket?" to leaving (crewed) for Eeloo after having discovered rocketry 3 months ago. I said Kerbal days and that can be fast forwarded with time warp in a matter of minutes check my full post please The reason I suggest this is as stated so Veteran Kerbals are better on missions than your average joe Kerbal (statistically) also It's easily possible to get Veteran Kerbals but Requires time and detication, If it is instantaneous then what's so special about Jeb and all the other Veterans we have if it takes TIME and currency you need to Ration your vets across missions. They feel special also if you read my full post which that was just a except you would see that their can be Kerbonaut Classes to train MULTIPLE Kerbals at a time. Edited December 9, 2017 by Cheif Operations Director Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Kadet Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 On 12/7/2017 at 9:24 PM, FoxtrotUniform said: *Snip* Would it be a good idea to add a Female default scientist and engineer to make the game slightly more sexually equal? no, not for equality, life isn't equal and people should get more use to that, there have been less female astronauts than men unfortunately, never mind in other positions, and calling Val the token female in an industry that in 95% male through history is a bit moch when of the 5 known kerbals (including von) women are 20% represented. However, i would like to see a male and female equivalents for each role just because of choice, some people roleplay having a choice for them is nice, and preferably named after inspiring astronauts like Valentina was is definitely a good thing. last food for thought, people are only truly equal in life when they are equal in death. When you talk about women that have died in space flight everyone remembers colombia and challenger, but very few could tell you half of the accidents that killed men... i think we should have more races too, i wanna see the blue and purple kerbals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoxtrotUniform Posted December 9, 2017 Author Share Posted December 9, 2017 Just now, Space Kadet said: no, not for equality, life isn't equal and people should get more use to that, there have been less female astronauts than men unfortunately, never mind in other positions, and calling Val the token female in an industry that in 95% male through history is a bit moch when of the 5 known kerbals (including von) women are 20% represented. However, i would like to see a male and female equivalents for each role just because of choice, some people roleplay having a choice for them is nice, and preferably named after inspiring astronauts like Valentina was is definitely a good thing. last food for thought, people are only truly equal in life when they are equal in death. When you talk about women that have died in space flight everyone remembers colombia and challenger, but very few could tell you half of the accidents that killed men... i think we should have more races too, i wanna see the blue and purple kerbals I agree totally about the New Races bit. Maybe not Blue and Purple but different shades of green. Maybe Kerbals can be procedurally generated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Kadet Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 2 minutes ago, FoxtrotUniform said: I agree totally about the New Races bit. Maybe not Blue and Purple but different shades of green. Maybe Kerbals can be procedurally generated! why is everyone racist against the purple and blue kerbals look how cool they could be (just the title screen , none in the video Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoxtrotUniform Posted December 9, 2017 Author Share Posted December 9, 2017 Just now, Space Kadet said: why is everyone racist against the purple and blue kerbals look how cool they could be (just the title screen , none in the video It just doesn't feel right. Kerbals are green. You don't see Blue or Green humans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Kadet Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 Just now, FoxtrotUniform said: It just doesn't feel right. Kerbals are green. You don't see Blue or Green humans. ummmm http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/man-turned-blue-silver-dies-article-1.1466905 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SG Aero Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 (edited) I feel like 4 is enough veterans. I mean I don’t have a problem with it, but 6 feels like it removes the specialness of the veterans. [snipped by moderator] Edited December 9, 2017 by Deddly Removed political content Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoxtrotUniform Posted December 9, 2017 Author Share Posted December 9, 2017 Just now, Space Kadet said: ummmm http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/man-turned-blue-silver-dies-article-1.1466905 Oh Wow. Good Answer. But it is an extremely rare condition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Kadet Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, FoxtrotUniform said: Oh Wow. Good Answer. But it is an extremely rare condition. [snip] you have blue pink and brown and lost of shades in between. plus my Mrs goes red when i leave a towl on the floor. I do like the shades idea, maybe shades and colours! Edited December 9, 2017 by Deddly Political content removed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheif Operations Director Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, ShadowGoat said: I feel like 4 is enough veterans. I mean I don’t have a problem with it, but 6 feels like it removes the specialness of the veterans. [snip] i Read my development thead on how to improve veteran classes 1 hour ago, Space Kadet said: [snip] [snip] Edited December 9, 2017 by Deddly Political content removed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corona688 Posted December 9, 2017 Share Posted December 9, 2017 (edited) 7 hours ago, Dman979 said: Hey guys, it's a friendly neighborhood moderator checking back in for the third time. Stay away from: A. Personal attacks. Dispute the post, not the poster. Did you disappear my post? I received no notification of it. I don't think it fit any of your criteria, but I'll try to be more careful. 12 hours ago, DoctorDavinci said: Just fantastic ... Lets bring identity politics into the game then Listen. The attack helicopter tumblr identity rainbow isn't real. Neither is the femipedant brigade. Neither are the "make-me-a-sandwich" trolls. Neither is the flat-earth movement. All of these movements attract the odd "true believer", but the vast majority have always been trolls poisoning conversation on more legitimate subjects. The slippery slope doesn't exist, this is all just conversation. Not a thing to be afraid of except trolls. Edited December 9, 2017 by Corona688 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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