Air Superiority Fighter Competition Continued

[prgmTrouble]

Another fighter: X-15 Exoneratis Hirundo

[Dundun65C]

2 minutes ago, prgmTrouble said:

Another fighter: X-15 Exoneratis Hirundo

I think it needs more wings, particularly vertical wings to reduce sideslip.

[Guest]

16 hours ago, Mukita12 said:

NO!!!! I WANT TO DO A GAMBLE!!!!!!!!!

*Sigh*

@goduranus, your new airplane needs to beat the viper. Can it?

[Wolf5698]

3 hours ago, Box of Stardust said:

Could also use some AI tuning; even one very specific simple change could change its lethality by a decent margin.

@Box of Stardust What change would you recommend? If you don't mind sharing it would really help a noob out :).

A good name would also help if anyone can think of one

Edited March 5, 2018 by Wolf5698

[goduranus]

2 hours ago, dundun93 said:

*Sigh*

@goduranus, your new airplane needs to beat the viper. Can it?

I only ran a couple of tests, I think the newly tuned Squirrel beats Viper about two times out of three.

Edit: I started them off at KSC to 8 km, so behavior could be different.

Edited March 5, 2018 by goduranus

[Piatzin]

Got a familiar face for you guys

Not the Ripsaw, unfortunately, but.....

Spoiler

https://kerbalx.com/Earthlinger/Berzerker-20_2

I guess you could call it 3.0, but really all I did was add four sidewinder missiles....

[Box of Stardust]

4 hours ago, Wolf5698 said:

@Box of Stardust What change would you recommend? If you don't mind sharing it would really help a noob out :).

A good name would also help if anyone can think of one

I threw this together in about half an hour. It's a little better, some more steps in the right direction. You can study it and stuff for some pointers.

I tested it against a barely tuned lightweight compact drone of my own (inspired by the Micro Fighter when it was first submitted). Unfortunately for the MF, it seems like I made my 5 ton drone still too vicious for it... and my crudely-tuned Basilisks lol.

@goduranus KSC 8km starts allow the fighters to get to their set default altitude. Not sure how big of a difference that makes, but Viper never had a definitive superiority over the RS either. I usually do a 10km - 14km start if from KSC just for a bit more of fairness, since a lot of Sidewinders are set to be selected from 8km. Not sure how big of a difference that makes either.

Edited March 5, 2018 by Box of Stardust

[ZLM-Master]

Yop everyone !

I finally rebuild from a blank page , my Typhoon got the same issues , it's a Big aircraft & not easy to reach high perfs so i made something more competitif .

He sould be more difficult to shoot & he's a pure gunner . Let's see if he better or not

VG-D34-PG on KerbalX

I keep my typhoon for later ! There is more accurate gun craft & that turn a bit the competition , mention for the Tiger 1 who mastering missile lauch performer ^^

Nice day on Kerbin !

Edited March 5, 2018 by ZLM-Master
add pic

[exbyde]

10 hours ago, Dundun65C said:

@exbyde do you mind turning off external camera shake in options? So many parts exploding at once makes the camera go all over the place

Sure once i figure out where that is located

7 hours ago, prgmTrouble said:

Another fighter: X-15 Exoneratis Hirundo

*sigh* at least all the letters are on my keyboard this time

7 hours ago, Dundun65C said:

I think it needs more wings, particularly vertical wings to reduce sideslip.

I see a slightly overweight deathfighter here, the slip may be by design

4 hours ago, Earthlinger said:

Got a familiar face for you guys

Not the Ripsaw, unfortunately, but.....

  Reveal hidden contents

https://kerbalx.com/Earthlinger/Berzerker-20_2

I guess you could call it 3.0, but really all I did was add four sidewinder missiles....

noice, i'll give it a shot

2 hours ago, Box of Stardust said:

I threw this together in about half an hour. It's a little better, some more steps in the right direction. You can study it and stuff for some pointers.

I tested it against a barely tuned lightweight compact drone of my own (inspired by the Micro Fighter when it was first submitted). Unfortunately for the MF, it seems like I made my 5 ton drone still too vicious for it... and my crudely-tuned Basilisks lol.

@goduranus KSC 8km starts allow the fighters to get to their set default altitude. Not sure how big of a difference that makes, but Viper never had a definitive superiority over the RS either. I usually do a 10km - 14km start if from KSC just for a bit more of fairness, since a lot of Sidewinders are set to be selected from 8km. Not sure how big of a difference that makes either.

Thanks for the tips box.

51 minutes ago, ZLM-Master said:

Yop everyone !

I finally rebuild from a blank page , my Typhoon got the same issues , it's a Big aircraft & not easy to reach high perfs so i made something more competitif .

He sould be more difficult to shoot & he's a pure gunner . Let's see if he better or not

VG-D34-PG on KerbalX

I keep my typhoon for later ! There is more accurate gun craft & that turn a bit the competition , mention for the Tiger 1 who mastering missile lauch performer ^^

Nice day on Kerbin !

I'll give it a shot. Did you add Chaff or radar jammers on this one?

[prgmTrouble]

7 hours ago, Dundun65C said:

I think it needs more wings, particularly vertical wings to reduce sideslip.

I tried to make this as light and aerodynamic as possible, as the wings will probably be destroyed anyway.

2 minutes ago, exbyde said:

*sigh* at least all the letters are on my keyboard this time

There's a pun that I hidden in the name too. Look at my response to @Dundun65C for a hint.

[ZLM-Master]

@exbyde Yep , i put 2 ECM & 2 chaff

[Piatzin]

1 minute ago, ZLM-Master said:

 Yep , i put 2 ECM & 2 chaff

Das good

Some  people tend to put like twenty of each, per wing....

Slight exaggeration, but still

Hint hint

[Guest]

14 hours ago, Box of Stardust said:

I have to admit that I downloaded the Micro Fighter when it was first submitted because it really intrigued me. It comes in under 4 tons, and yet has most of the right pieces in place that would make a good fighter. Also came to the same conclusion that it was too sluggish too turn. Needs some control surface spam, could probably get away with replacing the front wing with a canard (or a few) completely. Could also use some AI tuning; even one very specific simple change could change its lethality by a decent margin.

I actually started messing around with the Micro Fighter because I was so curious about it, then tried to build a fighter like it. But it was just so ridiculously barebones that... I guess I couldn't handle not having decent aesthetics? Managed to get one under 5t though, but I need to see about that whole 'BD AI doesn't like reversed control surfaces' thing and figure out what that mod was that allows individual manipulation of pitch, roll, yaw authority.

 

On the next battles:

LOL I forgot what AMRAAM spam was like. That was definitely something.

The Du-5R weighs about 4.6t. The original goal was 3.5t, but... And, FAR allowed individual pitch/yaw/roll manipulation. 

[Box of Stardust]

3 minutes ago, dundun92 said:

The Du-5R weighs about 4.6t. The original goal was 3.5t, but... And, FAR allowed individual pitch/yaw/roll manipulation. 

Yeah, I just couldn't get that 4t limit building a small drone. Had to go up to 4.5-5t to get what I wanted  

Ah... so it's FAR. With my regular KSP install having a ton of mods installed, I wouldn't have remembered what did which things for everything.

Well, in any case, the BD AI seems to be flying fine with reverse-facing canards (with authority set to a negative value), so I guess they fixed the problem.

[goduranus]

23 minutes ago, Box of Stardust said:

Yeah, I just couldn't get that 4t limit building a small drone. Had to go up to 4.5-5t to get what I wanted  

Time to ditch the ECM to save 0.3 tons, none of the leaderboard has a radar missile. And if you can score above the number 4 spot, the ECM equipped crafts below you will keep radar missile entries at bay.

Edited March 5, 2018 by goduranus

[Box of Stardust]

6 minutes ago, goduranus said:

Time to ditch the ECM to save 0.35 tons, none of the leaderboard has a radar missile. And if you can score above the number 4 spot, the ECM equipped crafts below you will keep radar missile entries at bay.

That's probably true enough. And with the drone as small as it is, BD RCS tool says it's tracked/locked at 3km, and chaff could probably do the rest in case of AMRAAMs. 

[goduranus]

Since I can't keep a secret to myself, here's another innovation that could give you an advantage:

Build a dumb fire modular missile with parachute and launch it just outside your plane's IR missile lockon range, and use action groups to make it pump the sky full of flares. Your opponent wouldn't be able to use IR missiles during the initial merge, giving you a brief moment to get on his tail.

Edited March 5, 2018 by goduranus

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, goduranus said:

Since I can't keep a secret to myself, here's another innovation that could give you an advantage:

Build a dumb fire modular missile with parachute and launch it just outside your plane's IR missile lockon range, and use action groups to make it pump the sky full of flares. Your opponent wouldn't be able to use IR missiles during the initial merge, giving you a brief moment to get on his tail.

*gasp* great idea!

[exbyde]

32 minutes ago, goduranus said:

Time to ditch the ECM to save 0.3 tons, none of the leaderboard has a radar missile. And if you can score above the number 4 spot, the ECM equipped crafts below you will keep radar missile entries at bay.

you saw what happened to the rafale vs the f-1, right?

 

10 minutes ago, goduranus said:

Since I can't keep a secret to myself, here's another innovation that could give you an advantage:

Build a dumb fire modular missile with parachute and launch it just outside your plane's IR missile lockon range, and use action groups to make it pump the sky full of flares. Your opponent wouldn't be able to use IR missiles during the initial merge, giving you a brief moment to get on his tail.

do it, would love to see

[Piatzin]

3 minutes ago, exbyde said:

do it, would love to see

But, FPS

[Box of Stardust]

11 minutes ago, goduranus said:

Since I can't keep a secret to myself, here's another innovation that could give you an advantage:

Build a dumb fire modular missile with parachute and launch it just outside your plane's IR missile lockon range, and use action groups to make it pump the sky full of flares. Your opponent wouldn't be able to use IR missiles during the initial merge, giving you a brief moment to get on his tail.

That sounds hilarious. I'm just not sure how well it would work in practice. Sounds like to properly work, it would cloud both of your IR locks. Which brings us back to winning during the gunfight merge, which is the most un-fun meta ever.

I guess I could try integrating this with my goofy booster-launched aircraft idea (which is probably even less of a feasible idea).

[exbyde]

1 minute ago, Earthlinger said:

But, FPS

but i7-8700, it can take it.

[goduranus]

4 minutes ago, Box of Stardust said:

Sounds like to properly work, it would cloud both of your IR locks. Which brings us back to winning during the gunfight merge, which is the most un-fun meta ever.

Pump the flares behind you, only the enemy planes will see them.

[HeroBrian_333]

16 minutes ago, exbyde said:

but i7-8700, it can take it.

So, I am going to bring back the DCK issue again. My rig is about half as good as yours, runs 5 other mids, and DCK works fine.

[exbyde]

4 minutes ago, HeroBrian_333 said:

So, I am going to bring back the DCK issue again. My rig is about half as good as yours, runs 5 other mids, and DCK works fine.

Are you running 32 or 64-bit ksp?