[1.8.1-1.12.x] Modular Launch Pads v2.6.1: Launch clamps evolved: Real-style launch bases and towers [03 July 2023]

[infinite_monkey]

I used the shuttle FSS Tower Base with an Elevator Height of 62m, Deploy Limit was 69. I didn't try going down, as I wasn't able to go up  The speed seemed reasonable, I think there is something else going on. The Kerbals kept sinking into the elevator and then after a little while were lifted up again, but after some iterations they pushed each other from the elevator, or weren't pushed up high enough and the Kraken kicked in - spaghettified Kerbals flying through the air or getting stuck inside the tower until they exploded. When walking on the ground, I have similar problems when there's a slope - they always walk straight ahead inside the hill, and when the game notices they're below the ground, it pushes them up. When I run too fast, they can explode as well. Not sure if that has to do with JNSQ or some of the last updates, I think it worked fine in earlier versions of the game.

[infinite_monkey]

@AlphaMensae I gave it another try. For some reason, TE's Ghodorah Launcher Platform failed to let my Falcon 9 go, so there was another problem. I just reattached it, and noticed that the FSS was slightly below the base of the Launcher Platform. I adjusted that and tried launching again. Elevator worked just fine. So maybe it was just a glitch in the game, caused by that particular vehicle.

[AlphaMensae]

4 hours ago, infinite_monkey said:

@AlphaMensae I gave it another try. For some reason, TE's Ghodorah Launcher Platform failed to let my Falcon 9 go, so there was another problem. I just reattached it, and noticed that the FSS was slightly below the base of the Launcher Platform. I adjusted that and tried launching again. Elevator worked just fine. So maybe it was just a glitch in the game, caused by that particular vehicle.

Glad to see it was something else  

 

[nick1041]

I need help. The saturn v launchpad parts are very big compared to what I see in some YouTube videos. Anyone else experiencing the same problem. I am using the bdb saturn v.

[Cheesecake]

15 minutes ago, nick1041 said:

I need help. The saturn v launchpad parts are very big compared to what I see in some YouTube videos. Anyone else experiencing the same problem. I am using the bdb saturn v.

The Saturn V IS big so the launchpad parts are big too. They are in the right dimensions for BDB.

[nick1041]

1 minute ago, Cheesecake said:

The Saturn V IS big so the launchpad parts are big too. They are in the right dimensions for BDB.

It isn't for me. They are a bit bigger than the ones I see on YouTube even though they are the same version

[Cheesecake]

Then there is something wrong with you installation or you have changed something in your configs. Did you install the included RO-Patch in the Extras-folder? It is only for RO-users and not compatible to BDB.

[nick1041]

I have but it is also too big for the orbiter construction kit and all rockets in general.

[Cheesecake]

34 minutes ago, nick1041 said:

I have but it is also too big for the orbiter construction kit and all rockets in general.

What do you mean with "I have"? Do you have installed the RO-patch or do you use RO?
If you not use RO you don`t have to install this RO-Patch. It`s only for Users who play with realism Overhaul. If you use RO: BDB and Orbiter construction kits are not RO-ready.

[nick1041]

1 hour ago, Cheesecake said:

What do you mean with "I have"? Do you have installed the RO-patch or do you use RO?
If you not use RO you don`t have to install this RO-Patch. It`s only for Users who play with realism Overhaul. If you use RO: BDB and Orbiter construction kits are not RO-ready.

Welp, I guess it's just my ships cuz Installed RO and RSS 

 

It actually might be the update because yesterday, the launchpad for the shuttle fitted underneath the orbiter construction kit and the next day,  believe I updated it and it has grown a bit bigger.

[AlphaMensae]

2 minutes ago, nick1041 said:

Welp, I guess it's just my ships cuz Installed RO and RSS 

RO now has direct support for Modular Launch Pads, so that simple patch is no longer needed, and has already been removed from the v2.1 dev build.

All the youtube videos I've made were done at stock scale, with the regular BDB parts.  The Saturn V and Saturn IB though were rescaled up a bit with the patch included in BDB's Extras, it makes them properly-sized with the other BDB parts (eg. 6.4m wide S-IC and S-II).

[nick1041]

8 minutes ago, AlphaMensae said:

RO now has direct support for Modular Launch Pads, so that simple patch is no longer needed, and has already been removed from the v2.1 dev build.

All the youtube videos I've made were done at stock scale, with the regular BDB parts.  The Saturn V and Saturn IB though were rescaled up a bit with the patch included in BDB's Extras, it makes them properly-sized with the other BDB parts (eg. 6.4m wide S-IC and S-II).

How about the orbiter construction kit. It. Idk what happened to it's launch base but it has just got bigger. Sorry for all the questions, I am just a beginner.

[Cheesecake]

As AlphaMensae mentioned: RO has its own patch for Modular Launch Pad which rescales the launchpads while Orbiter Construction Kit isn`t supportet by RO so it isn`t rescaled. You must ask the RO-guys for supporting it. This has nothing to do with Modular Launchpad.

Edited September 26, 2020 by Cheesecake

[AlphaMensae]

1 hour ago, nick1041 said:

How about the orbiter construction kit. It. Idk what happened to it's launch base but it has just got bigger. Sorry for all the questions, I am just a beginner.

If you have the latest RO and that outdated basic RO patch from the Extras folders installed, then you would have two things trying to rescale the MLP parts and causing problems. BDB does have some RO configs for it now, but SOCK doesn't.

[TranceaddicT]

On 9/19/2020 at 9:29 AM, AlphaMensae said:

You need Animated Decouplers installed (included in the download) to be able to stage the animated parts like the hold-downs.  

Alpha, have you ever seen LGG's ModuleSequentialAnimateGeneric?

[AlphaMensae]

7 hours ago, TranceaddicT said:

Alpha, have you ever seen LGG's ModuleSequentialAnimateGeneric?

Yes, but that doesn't have any use for me, as I don't have any parts like the one specific case he made the module for. And doesn't allow animations to be staged, which is why I use Animated Decouplers.

[nick1041]

This is what I mean about the launchpad parts being too big

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Sn25TZ8I_Hnlg1Q8UHgJA0raAxliFQcL/view?usp=sharing

[AlphaMensae]

On 9/27/2020 at 12:14 AM, nick1041 said:

This is what I mean about the launchpad parts being too big

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Sn25TZ8I_Hnlg1Q8UHgJA0raAxliFQcL/view?usp=sharing

Yeah, you have either RO and/or that outdated basic patch of mine making the MLP parts bigger and BDB, but I don't think the BDB Saturn has RO support yet, which is why it's still the default BDB size.

Unless there are direct .cfgs for non-RO part mods, RO is best used with the official RO part mods.  This is outside my responsibility, as I only support stock scale. Using MLP with RO is "at your own risk" or "do it youtself".  

[AlphaMensae]

Ok, the re-re-revision of the General Modular Service Towers is done. This will break craft files, as some of the older parts have been removed. I went through several ideas, and this is the end result:

For all 4 tower sizes (Small, Medium, Large, Extra-Large), the old 10m Core section and Base section have been combined into a new Tower Core part. The base can be toggled off so additional 10m cores can be stacked. This new part retains the part name of the old base part for each tower.

For the Small, Medium and Large sizes, the old short section is now has 3 height variants (2.5m, 5.0m, 7.5m). This part still has the same part name. These sizes also got a different default color: Small Tower is Light Gray, Medium Tower is Medium Gray, and Large Tower is Gray-Green.

The Extra-Large Tower short section stays the same (it's just too detailed to have more than one copy in a .mu, makes the file really big). The side panels for both the core and section parts have been revised to match that of the Titan III/IV tower progression; now they are split front-and-back, so you can have side panels off, just the front-side ones on, or all on. Also added more options for the tower front panels.

The Top part for each tower stays the same, aside from the default color changes.

[OrbitalManeuvers]

On 8/4/2020 at 1:03 PM, AlphaMensae said:

On 8/4/2020 at 11:38 AM, OrbitalManeuvers said:

Is it possible to make the elevator just a toggle that moves it to the other position? Or does it require to have two distinct states?

There is a single-button Toggle function in the PAW.

At the time I asked this question, it was because at least a couple of the elevators seemed to allow moving the car up or down on EVA, but not back the other direction. The PAW would say "up" and you'd move it up and the PAW would still say "up". Before grabbing your latest release, I just tested Mercury, Gemini, and Large again ... and they all work in both directions now, and the up/down button changes to the other state once the car has moved. This is awesome!

I've moved to 1.9.1, from 1.8.1 at that time.  Did you discover/change something, or was I just seeing something weird with my install?

Edit: Actually it seems like it depends on other parts of the build or something? Wow, I'm back to confused because I seem to be able to get it to work sometimes and not other times ... will track down more details...

Edited October 3, 2020 by OrbitalManeuvers

[OrbitalManeuvers]

OK ... I've tracked this down to exact steps. What you'll see in the attached video is:

- standing next to the elevator, you can toggle up/down repeatedly

- getting ON the elevator and going up removes all movement items from the PAW

What I didn't show ... if I jump back down off the elevator, the PAW menu items come back. I don't know how to explain this. Any ideas?

Spoiler

 

 

[AlphaMensae]

1 hour ago, OrbitalManeuvers said:

OK ... I've tracked this down to exact steps. What you'll see in the attached video is:

- standing next to the elevator, you can toggle up/down repeatedly

- getting ON the elevator and going up removes all movement items from the PAW

What I didn't show ... if I jump back down off the elevator, the PAW menu items come back. I don't know how to explain this. Any ideas?

The only thing I can think of now is if that a Kerbal on EVA is too far from a part's origin, then it can't activate an animation on that part.  The elevators are tall and the origin is at the very bottom, so after going up, the origin is far out of range.

[OrbitalManeuvers]

49 minutes ago, AlphaMensae said:

The only thing I can think of now is if that a Kerbal on EVA is too far from a part's origin, then it can't activate an animation on that part.  The elevators are tall and the origin is at the very bottom, so after going up, the origin is far out of range.

That was my thought when I saw the behavior, especially falling back to the ground and having the menu items appear again. It seems reasonable since it applies to all other parts, too. E.g. if you're too far from a materials bay you can't activate it, etc. OK, looks like an unfortunate KSP-ism. 

[AlphaMensae]

I had thought it was how far away from the part's collider(s) that determined whether a Kerbal could activate something, but now it looks like it's the part's origin that has to be within range. Yep, an unfortunate KDP-ism.

And speaking of the elevators, I have to rethink how they are set up. Having multiple elevator car height settings works fine in Sandbox, but they can create havoc in Career mode with the tier 1 and 2 launch pads. I then set up the cars so they all start at the bottom of the elevator tower, and use B9PS to move them (actually a parent gameobject that holds the car as a child, which is the thing that gets animated) up when turned on. That did work with the pad height limits....unless you moved the deploy limit slider down, which also moves the disabled cars down as well (being all in the same animation), and since those are still at the bottom, the got moved below the VAB floor and actually increased the tower's height.   There's no way to get around this.

Putting each car height into a different animation would be cumbersome and confusing to use ("uh, which elevator did I turn on again?").  So I'm going to make the Large, Small and Mini General Elevator tower bases in 2 separate versions (maybe 3 for the Large), each with only one car max height appropriate for the targeted launch pad tier, and identified as such in the part's title. The single-piece elevator towers will have just one height.  The single height setting will eliminate the variable car speeds thata happen with the multiple height settings.

[AlphaMensae]

Actually, I overthinked it again, and there isn't any need to have separate versions of the elevator base parts, just one is needed, with a single-height elevator car.  It can be moved down with the deploy limit slider to get within any launch pad height limits.  

I will add a separate Large Elevator Base though, with an optimized 120m (or maybe higher) high car, so the regular one (65m or so) isn't too fast or slow.