Satellites w/ Remote Tech

[i_like_kerbals]

Hi I am pretty overwhelmed by all the info on Remote Tech and am stuck with wondering how to even build a satellite and set it up in a rocket. I have the part that allows me to carry a payload, the protective shell that I can shape.

So I want to do the career mode contracts where I put a satellite on Kerbin facing the moon and do the 3 satellite contract and then eventually the 4 satellite.

So here are my questions...

1. How far can the antennas and dishes reach. How far is an mm? It seems dishes are much farther but are directional cones. The cheap antenna I guess is good enough to communicate in orbit and anywhere on kerbin?

2. I need to have orbit that is equatorial, polar and another direction? Or all in the same orbit spaced out?

3. Can I build a satellite and save it as a craft and then just pull up copies to attach to rockets?

4. How do you point a dish at the mun? Would it need to be sitting on a pole?

Any tips to help with Remote Tech would be useful, Im not new to KSP but am a little overwhelmed by RT. Thanks!

Edited March 28, 2018 by i_like_kerbals

[Snark]

Moving to Add-on Discussions.

12 minutes ago, i_like_kerbals said:

How far can the antennas and dishes reach. How far is an mm? It seems dishes are much farther but are directional cones. The cheap antenna I guess is good enough to communicate in orbit and anywhere on kerbin?

There's an instructions web page somewhere, read that.  Broadly speaking, there are two kinds of antennas, directional and omni.  The omni antennas have shorter range but automatically connect to anything in range.  The directional antennas have longer range, but you have to tell them a target to point at.  You can either point them at a celestial body (in which case they can "see" anything in their cone), or at a specific target ship (in which case they can communicate only to that ship.

Note that I mean "point" in the sense of "assign it that target in the RemoteTech dialog", and not actually physically pointing in that direction.  RemoteTech antennas, like stock antennas, don't even slightly care what direction they're actually facing.  Targeting is entirely a matter of what's assigned via the "antenna target" dialog.

Note, if you have two antennas that are both directional, then they need to be targeted at each other in order to have a connection.

12 minutes ago, i_like_kerbals said:

I need to have orbit that is equatorial, polar and another direction? Or all in the same orbit spaced out?

You can have things set up any which way you like, as long as the necessary satellites are capable of communicating with each other.

12 minutes ago, i_like_kerbals said:

Can I build a satellite and save it as a craft and then just pull up copies to attach to rockets?

Sure, using the subassembly function in the vessel editor, but that's a general KSP thing, not something specific to RemoteTech.

12 minutes ago, i_like_kerbals said:

How do you point a dish at the mun? Would it need to be sitting on a pole?

Nope, like I said, it doesn't matter where it's actually physically facing.  You'd click on it, choose "assign target" or whatever the command is, and then pick the Mun as the target body in the dialog that pops up.

 

By the way-- if you're finding RemoteTech really difficult, you do have the option of using stock CommNet.  It's considerably simpler/easier than RemoteTech.  If you've never built communications networks, it may be worth considering trying out the simpler model in the stock game, and then moving on to the more advanced RemoteTech once you get used to that.

[i_like_kerbals]

Thanks for all the tips, yeah I suppose vanilla would be easier but I like the added realism I read about in Remote Tech and would like to just learn with that even though it will take me longer to grasp, I don't mind. So one contract says to point a dish at the Mun from Kerbin. So I was thinking to lad a rocket or plane at one of the poles assuming the mun would always be in the LOS. I would need to keep the Mun in constant LOS, no?

[DerekL1963]

2 hours ago, Snark said:

By the way-- if you're finding RemoteTech really difficult, you do have the option of using stock CommNet.  It's considerably simpler/easier than RemoteTech.  If you've never built communications networks, it may be worth considering trying out the simpler model in the stock game, and then moving on to the more advanced RemoteTech once you get used to that.

I second this notion - RT has a steep, counterintuitive, and unforgiving learning curve, and it's practically a mini-game in it's own right.

And really, it's no more realistic than the stock CommNet.  It's just unrealistic in a different way...  It's claims to added realism actually date from the era before CommNet existed.
 

2 hours ago, i_like_kerbals said:

So one contract says to point a dish at the Mun from Kerbin. So I was thinking to lad a rocket or plane at one of the poles assuming the mun would always be in the LOS. I would need to keep the Mun in constant LOS, no?

Honestly, I find that the best place to get help with specific mods (unless they're wildly popular and widespread, which RT isn't) is in the mods specific thread in the add-on releases forum.  That's where you'll generally find the real experts.

That being said, what does the fine print on the contract say?  You might just get away with pointing (via the dialog) from the launch pad.

[i_like_kerbals]

On 3/27/2018 at 10:48 PM, DerekL1963 said:

I second this notion - RT has a steep, counterintuitive, and unforgiving learning curve, and it's practically a mini-game in it's own right.

And really, it's no more realistic than the stock CommNet.  It's just unrealistic in a different way...  It's claims to added realism actually date from the era before CommNet existed.
 

Honestly, I find that the best place to get help with specific mods (unless they're wildly popular and widespread, which RT isn't) is in the mods specific thread in the add-on releases forum.  That's where you'll generally find the real experts.

That being said, what does the fine print on the contract say?  You might just get away with pointing (via the dialog) from the launch pad.

I thought I read somewhere, maybe I am mistaken, but the vanilla ComNet does not get interrupted by planetary bodies. I remember reading something that made me want to use RT over vanilla. How is RT not realistic?

I understand video games have to cut corners when it is not practical to be realistic in a game setting so I don't expect to be able to get hired by NASA after playing RT I just wanted a more realistic career mode. I am curious now how is RT unrealistic and how is CommNet unrealistic since I seem to forgot what I read?

Edited April 3, 2018 by i_like_kerbals

[DerekL1963]

3 hours ago, i_like_kerbals said:

I thought I read somewhere, maybe I am mistaken, but the vanilla ComNet does not get interrupted by planetary bodies. I remember reading something that made me want to use RT over vanilla. How is RT not realistic?

How is RT unrealistic?

1 - Larger antenna for longer range, almost impossibly large for Jool and beyond.
2 - One antenna site on the entire planet.
3 - The complex "pointing at a given satellite" mechanic.

How is CN unrealistic?

1 - The same stupid antenna size mechanic.
2 - The pointless dichotomy between direct and relay antenna.
3 - The vast increase in weight for relay antenna.

Vanilla CN's "not interrupted by planetary bodies" applies when, say, Duna is between your probe at Jool and the DSN on Kerbin.  It doesn't apply if you're on the backside of the Mun for example.

Neither one really makes for a "more realistic" career mode, though (IMO) CN comes closer than RT since it doesn't require you to set up a constellation of comsats.

[i_like_kerbals]

27 minutes ago, DerekL1963 said:

How is RT unrealistic?

1 - Larger antenna for longer range, almost impossibly large for Jool and beyond.
2 - One antenna site on the entire planet.
3 - The complex "pointing at a given satellite" mechanic.

How is CN unrealistic?

1 - The same stupid antenna size mechanic.
2 - The pointless dichotomy between direct and relay antenna.
3 - The vast increase in weight for relay antenna.

Vanilla CN's "not interrupted by planetary bodies" applies when, say, Duna is between your probe at Jool and the DSN on Kerbin.  It doesn't apply if you're on the backside of the Mun for example.

Neither one really makes for a "more realistic" career mode, though (IMO) CN comes closer than RT since it doesn't require you to set up a constellation of comsats.

What do you mean by #1? If the antenna doesnt go far enough then you just set up a network of satellites nearby, no? Isn't that what you would have to theoretically? You can fix having only one antenna site on the planet by landing probes to act as ground stations. I have see people drop probes on the poles to act as ground relays. I have not used the dishes much but I have seen the mechanic and it seemed straight forward. Would you rather have to program their angles and direction, etc?

 

Im not a comms expert but are you also saying a relay antenna and direct antenna are achieved by the same hardware so no point in distinguishing between the two items? And #3 is not something that bothers me, again not familiar with satellite design so I dont care they add difficulty by increasing weight for longer range satellite. Also I like having to set up satellite networks on nearby bodies to bounce signals to far off places, again, is that not theoretically accurate? I guess I don't get your criticisms. I didn't study satellites, these physics, etc... care to elaborate? Your criticisms are from someone who actually designs this stuff in real life. I'm not thinking about this stuff so it doesn't bother me. I'm aware I'm playing a game yet I wanted something more realistic and decided on RT. I like satellite constellations i guess. It seems realistic to me. Not to mention in the "Kerbal" universe, their physics are a little different than what we are used to so any criticism I just rationalize by it being in the Kerbal universe Like how days are 6 hours, etc

Edited April 3, 2018 by i_like_kerbals

[DerekL1963]

4 minutes ago, i_like_kerbals said:

What do you mean by #1?

Exactly what it says.  Longer range antennas are larger and heavier than shorter - when in reality most of the power is in the ground segment's amplifiers.  New Horizon's antenna is only 2m across for heaven's sake.
 

8 minutes ago, i_like_kerbals said:

If the antenna doesnt go far enough then you just set up a network of satellites nearby, no?

No.  If it doesn't go far enough, you need a larger heavier antenna - either onboard or as part of your nearby (same SOI basically) relay network.
 

9 minutes ago, i_like_kerbals said:

You can fix having only one antenna site on the planet by landing probes to act as ground stations.

That won't fix anything, because (in RT) you still need a satellite constellation to relay from those "ground stations" to KSC.

 

11 minutes ago, i_like_kerbals said:

Im not a comms expert but are you also saying a relay antenna and direct antenna are achieved by the same hardware so no point in distinguishing between the two items?

Close enough.

[i_like_kerbals]

OK thanks for clarifying, I just didn't know if you were complaining that larger antennas were required to go farther, from a laymen's perspective, it makes sense but yeah I get it. I just figure Kerbals have different tech hehe.

Maybe im weird but i makeup things to rationalize kerbal universe, like the reason there are no cities are kerbals live underground and they only have one ground station cause the KSC is literally the only planets above ground buildings so it is their civilizations only means of sending signals. They dont listen to radio or any of that. Only live music. They are advanced in some areas like space travel but still old fashioned. Now everything makes sense

[stubbonjeb]

do you know how to help me

?