Walking Kerbals on moving vessels

[Enceos]

This suggestion hasn't been thrown in for a while so I decided to remind that we still need it. Currently Kerbals become rag-dolls if a vessel they're standing on starts moving. Wouldn't it be nice to be able to walk you kerbals on the deck of an aircraft carrier while you're touring around a new continent; take a promenade on the catwalks of an enormous Duna rover while it's heading to the poles; take a first person tour around an air castle while it's flying over the highest Kerbin peaks. Simply roving, sailing or flying long distances is booring. Playing with Kerbals, doing experiments and probably assembling something with KIS while the vessel is on its course would really enhance the experience.

I know this requires some engine level coding skills, high logic and wits to make this work. KSP didn't have professional coders when it all began, this was an unsolvable problem for them, but I hope that now the dev team has someone who's up to the task.

[Lisias]

Brainstorming mode on. :-)

In order to accomplish that, we need inertia and friction being accounted on each kerbal "on the wild", and not only on the focused (being controlled) one. We would need, also, a better dragging model - so kerbals inside a hull would not be thrown into the vessel's tail even when the vessel's acceleration is zero.

Videos and some personal tests suggest that these requirements can not be fulfilled by the present engine.

So... We will need to try that "on the Kerbal way": brute force. :-)

One (possible?) solution would be a Part that, once attached to a vessel, would keep track of all Kerbals on the vessel and, once any of them does "EVA", would check them if they are inside a "walking zone" (distance from the nearest part? inside the collision meshes?), and automatically apply to them the same attitude and position changes that the vessel suffers. A focused Kerbal would have to apply his own changes on top of the automatic ones. This essentially would simulate a Local Frame of Reference for each Kerbal (being that frame the vessel itself).

Long shot, wild guess - I don't know enough to tell if that thing is viable or not.

[Dimas152]

followed this thred

also other crafts inside another craft (e.g rover and a cargo plane, etc) shouldn't affected by aero forces

[Guest]

Rated this one star because there are no pictures.

[Deddly]

On 5/19/2018 at 12:06 AM, dundun93 said:

Rated this one star because there are no pictures.

?

I think it's quite a simple idea to understand: Moving vessel, EVA = ragdoll (or just slide off the back of the craft). Try it on a rover =)

The suggestion is to fix that. Simple idea, maybe difficult to implement. But wow would that be nice to have!

[klgraham1013]

On 5/18/2018 at 5:06 PM, dundun93 said:

Rated this one star because there are no pictures.

I...just...what?

[The Aziz]

I'd go even further. Handrails implemented into stock parts. Yes I know, There is A Mod For That™, but aren't we all for reducing part count? This way, without adding more parts (be it handrails or ladders) to your overly complicated vessel, you could just grab that thin piece of metal extending from the hull and move here or there.

Ooor someone wise could make a mod that modifies stock parts, idk

[Mark Kerbin]

This would be cool, but as you said, “would probably need engine level coding” , ie probably a new engine. KSP could seriously use an update like that, but that would require a lot of work from the devs and basically one shot all of the mods.

Now if someone could find a resource light way to do this, sign me up. As for now, kerbals are just clumsy as all kraken.

[GKSP]

I also have a related idea.  If I parachute a kerbal from a flying plane, all should go well, right?  Well, no.  If you, even briefly, brush against another part, the parachute is disabled.  This really sucks when the cockpit is in the front of a plane and there is a wing or engine behind it.  Changing how kerbals interact with other parts may affect this.  

More on-topic, fixing this would let me finally make amphibious transports.  I once had a naval mod that let you open a cargo ramp.  My tankish vehicle I was loading on was able to roll on, but once it left contact with the terrain, only momentum kept it going forward.

I think this is something we all need, but I have very little experience with this kind of game editing.

[Lisias]

2 hours ago, GKSP said:

If you, even briefly, brush against another part, the parachute is disabled.  This really sucks when the cockpit is in the front of a plane and there is a wing or engine behind it. 

That would explain my difficulties on evac an aircraft while on Unplanned Uncontrolled Landing.

 

2 hours ago, GKSP said:

I once had a naval mod that let you open a cargo ramp.  My tankish vehicle I was loading on was able to roll on, but once it left contact with the terrain, only momentum kept it going forward.

At least on the Stock Cargo Bays, I'm able to drive wheeled crafts inside them. Heisenberg's huge hangar bays also allows this AFAIK (I didn't tried it myself yet, will do ASAP and come back here).

Perhaps it's some glitch on the parts you are using? Perhaps something on the collision meshes?

[mattinoz]

On 5/16/2018 at 6:03 AM, Lisias said:

Brainstorming mode on. :-)

In order to accomplish that, we need inertia and friction being accounted on each kerbal "on the wild", and not only on the focused (being controlled) one. We would need, also, a better dragging model - so kerbals inside a hull would not be thrown into the vessel's tail even when the vessel's acceleration is zero.

Videos and some personal tests suggest that these requirements can not be fulfilled by the present engine.

So... We will need to try that "on the Kerbal way": brute force. :-)

One (possible?) solution would be a Part that, once attached to a vessel, would keep track of all Kerbals on the vessel and, once any of them does "EVA", would check them if they are inside a "walking zone" (distance from the nearest part? inside the collision meshes?), and automatically apply to them the same attitude and position changes that the vessel suffers. A focused Kerbal would have to apply his own changes on top of the automatic ones. This essentially would simulate a Local Frame of Reference for each Kerbal (being that frame the vessel itself).

Long shot, wild guess - I don't know enough to tell if that thing is viable or not.

Or just cheat and say non-focus kerbals become surface attached parts. They can still fall off in the same way solar panels fall off. Then you just have to worry about the kerbal who's moving. Still need friction and inertia just not as much.

[Lisias]

12 hours ago, mattinoz said:

Or just cheat and say non-focus kerbals become surface attached parts. They can still fall off in the same way solar panels fall off. Then you just have to worry about the kerbal who's moving. Still need friction and inertia just not as much.

Kerbals are "parts"? I think they are "vessels".

If I'm right, you would need some king of "docking port" to "dock" the Kerbals. OTOH, if you are right, this would simplify a lot the solution.

I'm firing up KSP to check this. I'll be back! ^{(c) 1984 Terminator.}

--- POST EDIT---

Yeah, Kerbals on EVA are vessels. I created a new save, strap some random parts together, put three poor Kerbals on the thing and put the thing orbiting something.

Then I put one Kerbal on EVA, and tried to save the game with a Kerbal on a ladder. No joy - I think there's no prevision for persisting state when a Kerbal is not on EVA or is not inside a vessel.

               VESSEL
                {
                        pid = 93d2d5b2892c4619840bc70ade0e4434
                        persistentId = 2883649892
                        name = Sigsel Kerman
                        type = EVA
                        sit = ORBITING
                        landed = False
                        skipGroundPositioning = False
                        vesselSpawning = True
                        launchedFrom = Runway

And when landed:

                VESSEL
                {
                        pid = ee066b906145474eb3bcdd8266f906e4
                        persistentId = 2459143087
                        name = Jensted Kerman
                        type = EVA
                        sit = LANDED
                        landed = True
                        skipGroundPositioning = False
                        vesselSpawning = True
                        launchedFrom = Runway

So... "strapping" a Kerbal  as a part appears to demand some brute force solutions too.

What do not invalidate the idea - now we must find that kind of "brute force" would hurt a bit less.  

Edited June 14, 2018 by Lisias
new info added.