Gordon Fecyk

[1.3.1-1.7.3] [Kopernicus] Alien Space Programs Re-Visited, v1.6.3 [03 FEB 2019]

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On 2/19/2019 at 3:27 PM, Gordon Fecyk said:

Where would you put the KSC if it were on the Mun?

I realize you're taking a break-- get better soon!-- just wanted to share a few thoughts I had on this, now that I've had a chance to play a fair bit with Laythe Space Program.  I think the following would apply to any tidally-locked body:

  1. Best place is on the leading "limb" of the body (as seen from the primary), ideally just a few degrees on the primary side of the visual terminator.  (i.e. look at where the body's "orbit line" emerges from it in map view; best place is just slightly on the primary side of that line)  As an example of this, KSC's placement in Laythe Space Program is absolutely perfect.
    • 1a. Nearly as good (differs only in aesthetics) is same deal, but on the trailing limb.
  2. Second-best place would be somewhere on the near side of the body.
  3. Worst place is on the far side of the body.

In short, my opinion as to the best place to put KSC on the Mun, if it were added, would be in the same (relative) location as where KSC is on Laythe, with Kerbin just slightly above KSC's eastern horizon.

Lengthy rationale in spoiler.

Spoiler

The reason I like #1 so much is both aesthetic and practical.  First, for aesthetics... it means that KSC has a nice view of the primary, just slightly above the horizon.  Looks great.  :)  For aesthetics, the leading limb is better than the trailing one, because in the latter case, the view from the launchpad wouldn't be as nice because the primary would be hidden behind the VAB.  The prettiest place for the primary to be in the sky is just a bit above KSC's eastern horizon.

The practical value of that location has to do with building communication networks.  A geosynchronous orbit is pretty much always impossible for tidally locked worlds (their rotation period is too slow, their SOI too small).  But a useful substitute is to put a satellite in orbit of the primary, synchronous with the KSC homeworld.  That works great!  ...except that satellites located along the homeworld's orbit won't be visible to a KSC that's on the far side of the body, which is why that's a bad place to put KSC.

Another reason why the far side would be a bad place is that it also won't be able to "see" the primary, or any other bodies or vessels that are in "inferior" (i.e. smaller) orbits.

"Well then, why does it need to be near the limb?" would be a reasonable question.  "What would be wrong with putting KSC bang in the middle so that the primary is directly overhead?"  Well, that's not terrible... but it's not quite as nice.  A KSC in such a position won't be able to directly look at anything in a superior (i.e. more outer) orbit-- to see something out there, it would have to look right across to the opposite side of the primary, boosting ranges and making it harder to communicate.  (For example, a KSC on the Mun with Kerbin straight overhead would not be in a good position for LOS to Minmus.)

 

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I'm working on the 1.7.0 release. If you have bugs or requests, please submit them to Issues. I'll incorporate fixes into 1.7.0.

I think you can use ASP 1.6.3 with Kopernicus 1.7.0-1, but be careful. Make a backup of your KSP installation and work from that. Also, Making History will break ASP, so remove it from your test install. I am purchasing it today to test.

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1.7.0 In Testing

If anyone is inclined, the 1.7.0 configurations are available in the GitHub repository. Primarily bug fixes to accommodate Kopernicus 1.7.0-1, but also introducing a new home world option. Please take a look and report bugs in the issue tracker. Thank you so much!

About the new option: The KSC scene is bugged, but you can still choose structures with their buttons on the bottom left. 

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Guess it's been a while. 1.7.3-1 In Testing.

I'm recovering from my injury and have had adequate time to review ASP finally. The master repository for ASP has corrections to sun luminosity, adds Realistic Atmospheres 1.3.1, adds a no-atmosphere toggle for appropriate home world settings for sandbox and science games, and has a working Mun homeworld.

That last one took so long because I needed to map and configure each Mun artifact so they were true to stock, while still having the KSC scene work properly. Both Minmus and Mun resist templating as a homeworld so I had to template Bop and build each world from Kittopia dumps.

I still need to localize all of the Homeworld Mun text, but the rest of it is ready for testing. Please try it out. You'll need a current Kopernicus edition for your version of KSP.

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Mun works fine so far, KSC scene is bugged though like you mentioned (dark and skybox doesnt move when timewarp).

 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Black034 said:

Mun works fine so far, KSC scene is bugged though like you mentioned

Really...? Must be using the previous attempt.

Make sure you're using the current master as templating the Mun doesn't work. I ended up having to template Bop again and rebuild the Mun from Kittopia dumps. That worked, but it also meant I had to search and replace all Mun easter eggs.

Also, the skybox won't move and neither will the sun. Re-parenting the home world around an object other than the sun causes strange things with the KSC scene. I just wanted to make sure the scene worked for upgrading buildings and recovering craft. You should find the tracking station and landed craft views should be fine, however. The same problem happens on Minmus, Laythe, and Tylo for the same reason.

Edited by Gordon Fecyk

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Posted (edited)

Bit confused here sorry, the issue shouldn't be occurring? (the darkness I mean) 

I've used the latest update provided by you above (Aug 19th), my Kopernicus should also be up to date. 

 

The KSC view bug is no problem for me though, having loads of fun as it is :)

 

For some reason it works now :0 ! Woo

 

No DLC Surface Features included right?

Edited by Black034
Forgot something AGAINNN

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On 8/26/2019 at 11:33 AM, Black034 said:

No DLC Surface Features included right?

I actually haven't tested that far. I'd need to see how other planet packs handle the Breaking Bad (sorry my brain keeps going that way) Breaking Ground surface objects and add them back. Most of the time I'm templating the actual world so its native objects could appear, but for the Mun and Minmus I'd have to add them back by hand. It'd be curious if Bop's objects appeared on those.

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Posted (edited)

No worries, lived without them long enough (wouldve been better if it had caves with blue crystals or something anyway lol).

 I've poked my nose around the Mun and Duna so far but only regular scatter to be found, oh btw the darkness bug only happens once after saveload but reloading the ksc scene by entering a building will fix it.

About the surface features, checking the Kopernicus thread it seems they got it working at some point though. Unless I'm misreading something but I cant find a lot of info on any problems etc so far.. 

Edited by Black034

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