How do I establish connection in RO?

[Zeiss Ikon]

Over the last few days, I've installed RSS/RO (clean install of 1.3.1, installed CKAN, then used CKAN to install RO and its dependencies and recommendations, along with most of its suggested mods).

I've got a couple questions.

First, I don't see the tech tree that I saw on YouTube; I presume that means I'm missing a mod.  The tree I saw on Grayduster's RP-1 (aka RO) video started with "post-War" airplanes and rockets, and had a very wide base after the "starter" parts; the one I have doesn't have that level of width, with only Basic Rocketry and Engineering 101 as options for research after the "starter" (only 5 science each, however).  What mod will give me that tech tree (or was it dropped from RO before it came out of the pre-release he used to make his videos)?

Second question: i've started a "trial" career in RO/RSS, and built a "captured" V-2/A-4 using the supplied parts -- nose section with ethanol tank, A-4 Guidance Unit (which claims to allow remote control with a 20 km range and support MechJeb), middle section with LOX tank, engine (with peroxide, which I presume both powers the turbopump and provides ignition), and four fins.  As far as I can see, I should be able to launch this -- but when I put it on the pad (before installing Kerbal Construction Time), I kept getting messages that "No connection to send command through" or something very like that.  Presuming this is from Commnet settings, shouldn't presence of a remote-capable Mechjeb module allow me to send a command when the rocket is on the launch pad?

[Xd the great]

1. Would you mind to check for compatability of your mods? Can you try manually installing mods? Make sure that they are of the correct versions for ksp 1.3.1

2. Do you have communicatrons and electric charge? Try adding an extra stock drone core.

Edited June 2, 2018 by Xd the great

[Zeiss Ikon]

There are four mods that Compatibility Checker reports as "possibly out of date" during game startup; all four (Kerbal Construction Time, Modular Flight Integrator, Stage Recovery, and Ven's Stock Revamp), when checked in CKAN, report either compatible with 1.3.1 or 1.2 through 1.3.99 (which I take to mean that they're not affected by the minor bug fixes from 1.3.0 to 1.3.1, but can't be certain about larger program changes for 1.4.x).

The A4 Guidance Unit has an internal battery with 540 kJ -- and consumes power even when waiting on the pad; I can see the charge dropping off (don't have a pad/launch clamp setup with ground power yet).

Adding another battery (with many times the capacity) makes no difference.  Setting MechJeb to "enabled" in the A4 Guidance Unit doesn't change anything.  Nor does adding the one other actual "probe core" I have, the Aerobee core (with MechJeb enabled), though I think the Aerobee core requires an explicit antenna.  Doesn't matter; adding an antenna has no effect, either.  I'm pretty sure I'm just missing a step somewhere.  I think I need to go back and watch Grayduster's first couple videos again, except he's got parts I don't (like a procedural probe core or telemetry unit), and the videos are 30-40 minutes each -- more of a "play through" style than a tutorial.

[Zeiss Ikon]

I found  the source of the control problem: Remote Tech.  I know Remote Tech requires different antennae from the regular game, but it doesn't seem to supply the required antennae -- all the antennae I have that are available in early game are stock-alike types, Communotron knock-offs.  In fact, I had to disable "requires signal for control" to be able to do so much as stage to launch -- why wouldn't I have control signal on the launch pad at Canaveral, White Sands, or Wallops Island?

However: I still don't have the tech tree Grayduster showed, and I lack a few of the procedural parts he routinely uses (he had a procedural probe core).  I also don't have whatever limits the size of the rocket a particular probe core can control (though I'm not sure how much sense that makes -- a controller sends signals to valves or servos that move surfaces, start and stop engines and RCS jets, etc., and those are what you have to scale up).  I found the online spreadsheet he points to in the description of his first RP-1 video, but it seems as though most of the "minor" mods there have to come from GitHub (which I don't really understand how to use) and/or have to be installed manually, which keeps CKAN from managing them.

What I'm after here is a career starting from realistic post-War technology -- X-1, captured V-2/A-4 rockets, and early sounding rockets, then building up to crewed rocket flights, orbital satellites, and so forth.

[AVaughan]

@Zeiss Ikon

RP-1 adds an entirely new tech tree, (and a whole lot of other stuff).  That is probably the tech tree you saw Grayduster using.  If you want to play career, then I recommended either installing RP-0 on a 1.2.2 install or using a dev build of RP-1 (make sure you use the dev branch version for the new tech tree).   I've never played with an RO install that didn't have RP-0 or RP-1 installed, but whilst remotetech adds new antennas, it also normally adds remotetech modules to the stock antennas so they should work.  

Regarding the "no signal for control", since I've never played a bare RO install I'm not sure whether RO implements any requirements with regard to vessels requiring avionics, but missing/inadequate avionics might explain your issue.  

The latest instruction i can find for installing RP-1 are here.

 There are also a few updates mentioned later on in the RP-0 thread.  There is also a discord group at https://discord.gg/kFXa6pv .

Edit: that post also mentions a replacement remote tech dll. 

Edited June 3, 2018 by AVaughan

[Zeiss Ikon]

I found RP-0 buried down near the bottom of Grayduster's/Bornholio's spreadsheet, and installed it -- but now I'm getting "3 errors" during the nearly 35,000 patches process of starting the game.  I had thought it was another mod I installed in the same interval between game starts (Community Category Kit).  Grayduster's video series starts off calling his game "RP-1" and only brings in Realism Overhaul in the titles in the third or fourth video.  Unfortunately, I have no idea how to obtain or install "a dev build of RP-1."  I'm less interested in Remote Tech, though I wouldn't mind including it if I can make it work ("no connection" on the launch pad, within a couple blocks of the Sandbox Tracking Station, with integrated antenna in the probe core plus an external antenna is a bad start).

Now, it seems as though Grayduster was using KSP 1.3.1 -- so I need to find/learn-to-install RP-1?  Since RP-0 doesn't work in 1.3.1?

For the moment, I guess I'll have to install 1.2.2 and start over on the mod install process.  It doesn't seem very friendly for players to have to learn stuff normally reserved for developers, just to play a particularly nice version of the game.  It's like saying "Oh, we've got a car that looks like a car show prototype, will do 0-60 in 2.8 seconds, and take a city street corner at 48 mph without squealing the tires, but you can only drive it if you're capable (yourself, not some mechanic you know) of determining which upgraded fuel injectors, brake pads, clutch discs, tires, and hybrid motor and batteries you need and are compatible with your engine, engine computer and drive train, and installing them yourself."

That is to say, I appreciate the efforts of the mod developers in creating the interlocking series of mods that make up RO -- but it would be spiffy if they were a little more accessible.

[AVaughan]

It's been a while since I did this, so the following is what I think I did. 

From https://github.com/KSP-RO/RP-0 , select the Developmental banch, then download a .zip using the clone or download button on the right.  Remove your old gamedata/rp-0, then open the .zip and copy the gamedata/rp-0 into gamedata. 

You should be able to do a complete install on 1.2.2 using ckan.  This is the option I'd normally recommend for someone new to rp-0, however do note that the tech tree you said you wanted is new and is only available in the 1.3.1 development branch available via github.  (There is also lot of other new stuff in the development branch).  

Edited June 4, 2018 by AVaughan

[Zeiss Ikon]

20 hours ago, AVaughan said:

You should be able to do a complete install on 1.2.2 using ckan.  This is the option I'd normally recommend for someone new to rp-0, however do note that the tech tree you said you wanted is new and is only available in the 1.3.1 development branch available via github.  (There is also lot of other new stuff in the development branch).  

I actually tried a 1.2.2 install via CKAN -- there's no longer a supported version of Principia that works with 1.2.2 (because RO/RSS now support 1.3.1, they say -- despite RP-0, a core element of RO, not being released for 1.3.1 yet), though I could get Cramer and it ought to work.  Okay, I could live without realistic multi-body gravity, I suppose, or install it after I have everything else working -- installed without that.  Loaded the game, couldn't enter any building except the Astronaut Complex, and couldn't leave there once in (the Big Four had different names there, but were still Jebediah, Bill, Bob, and Valentina everywhere else).

I had 1.3.1 running with Principia, without RP-0 (and without Remote Tech, which I've just read is incompatible with some other required mod -- need to find the updated .dll or .so file), and haven't deleted that install, and I just grabbed the Developmental Branch RP-0 (can only download the zip from the top of Dev Branch, but I can pull the GameData out easily enough).  Time to see if that will work and then go hunt down the Remote Tech fix.

[Bornholio]

If you want the new tech tree you will have to install the Developmental branch of RP-0 (colloquially known as RP-1) comes with a whole wall of learning curve.

Remote tech and RO are perfectly compatible, also with RP-0.  my poor out of date guide/spreadsheet for 1.3.1 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1A7gQkIiQKi0VtRecE6p86KCKuoawZPdzk7NlaxssRJ4/edit#gid=523836116

between vens' and SXT you should have antenna to work with RO/RP-0 in either set up.  Most probe cores come with a small interna antenna, but most of the time a minimum is the sputnik style one for leo

[AVaughan]

Principia is still a optional.  Back when I did my 1.2.2 and 1.3.1 RP-1 installs it had known issues, so I just skipped it.  RO/RP-0/RP-1 will still give you a new level of challenge compared to stock.

[Zeiss Ikon]

Principia seems to be working fine.  Whether I can get anywhere off Earth with real gravity (as opposed to patched conics and spheres of influence) is yet to be determined.  I got RP-0 (Dev Branch) installed and apparently working.  Had no contracts (not even the starting one that does nothing but unlock the "starter parts" in the tech tree), realized I needed Contract Configurator, installed that, and now I can launch rockets (and planes) with the RP-0 tech tree.  Now I need to put back Remote Tech and see if I need the patch for it (I've read it's incompatible with Contract Configurator?), then when everything else is working, Test Flight and Kerbal Construction Time.  Get everything back in, I should be over 50,000 patches... 

And what seems astonishing to me, given the performance issues I've had with vanilla KSP in the past, launching a V-2 in RO/RP-0/RSS/Principia didn't cause yellow clock, never mind frame lag.  So, yes, only eight parts, but I've seen yellow clock with eight parts when I had Kerbin/KSC visible in the background...

[Zeiss Ikon]

Following up on this, I'm either starting to understand Remote Tech, or removing it (and a couple other mods) and reinstalling it fixed something.  I can now launch an A-4 from Wallops, and apply pitch/yaw/roll controls until the (very short-lived) internal battery runs down.  If I knew exactly what azimuth and elevation I needed, I could start a war with UK by dropping a leftover V-2 on Bermuda.

I still can't make a Aerobee stage away the solid booster after launch, however (I get a message about locked controls as soon as the rocket clears the launch clamp).  The message says the onboard avionics are rated for 0.00 T -- which is silly.  An Aerobee hasn't got any controls other than the staging sequencer, and I'm pretty sure they used a simple mechanical timer for that in 1950.  I'm not asking the onboard to fly aerobatics, I'm asking it to throw a switch.  I used the RN RO Aerobee (don't recall which model, but not the one with a reduced diameter nose); I'll try replacing the avionics with a procedural unit and see if that solves the problem for me, but if it does, what is the Aerobee Core unit actually good for?

Edited June 6, 2018 by Zeiss Ikon

[AVaughan]

In RP-0/RP-1 you also need some sort of avionics to have any control, even stage/self destruct.  The part you need is a sounding rocket avionics package (or any part with a science core).  It provides just enough avionics to stage/run science experiments/self destruct, but no attitude control.  I'm going to suggest reading https://github.com/KSP-RO/RP-0/wiki/Tutorial:-Getting-Started (scroll down to My First Rocket).  It's not upto date with the changes in the dev branch, but pretty much everything still applies.  If teh ARrobee core you are using comes from a parts pack that isn't upto date with the latest dev branch, it's possible that that is what broke it).

Edited June 7, 2018 by AVaughan

[Zeiss Ikon]

I tried it with the Taerobee Avionics and the Procedural Avionics (set to 3 T for a rocket that masses less than 1 T at ignition), without the "controls locked" message, but still without decoupling the booster (which, in an Aerobee, will result in an engine shutdown due to the zero/negative G from coasting when the booster burns out).  The craft I started (RO RN Aerobee 100) with is labeled as being for RO; it's my understanding RO normally includes Remote Tech (for light speed lag, if nothing else).  I'll go look at that wiki article and see if I missed something.

[Zeiss Ikon]

Back again.  My rockets are more like the 2.0 rockets in that tutorial, and they work fine without Remote Tech.  I can launch an A-4 and have control for a while (until the battery runs down), that that seems to be in spite of Remote Tech -- the A-4 guidance unit is responding even though it reports "No Connection."  I don't understand this...

Here's my sounding rocket, roughly like a WAC Corporal.  I can send commands (such as firing the decoupler to drop the booster on the pad) for as long as it's connected to the launch clamps.  Disconnect, and it's like a kid's Estes model rocket -- no control at all, not even to stage.

Edit: I just found MechJeb's autostage, and got this rocket to stage with that (basically a simple timer) -- it went 159 km high (more like Aerobee 150 than WAC Corporal).  I had no ability to perform the science, other than (seemingly) "Analyze Telemetry", which I didn't attempt to transmit.

Notice that this rocket has no connection, either -- but I have full control, within the limits of aerodynamics.  Pitch, yaw, roll.  No Range Safety, however, and if there were science aboard, I couldn't operate it.

So, this makes two question.  First, why are my rockets failing to connect -- and second, why can I control the A-4 without an uplink?

Edited June 7, 2018 by Zeiss Ikon

[AVaughan]

Not sure but you would probably get more eyes from more experienced RO/RP-1 folks if you posted in the RP-0 thread. 

 

[Zeiss Ikon]

I suppose, though I don't know if this is an RO/RP-0 issue, or a Remote Tech problem -- I'm thinking the latter, because my rockets work fine without it, and don 't work with it (even if I have antenna and the Tracking Center is a block away).