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[NewtSoup]

I’m reasonably content for it to do everything except Laythe and Eve and just build a space plane for a those.  Unles bewing comes up with a cool tweak. 

[bewing]

13 hours ago, NewtSoup said:

I’m reasonably content for it to do everything except Laythe and Eve and just build a space plane for a those.  Unless bewing comes up with a cool tweak. 

Dunno if it's cool.  I don't think I changed the look of it much.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1FZunNmkE3CFg3D6PQ5C0wI9_5Z2y6ddB/view?usp=sharing

It should just be able to get to LKO, if flown perfectly. It follows prograde properly now. If you pump about 100 units of lf + ox into the bottom tanks, it reenters tail first, the way you seem to want. Note that you should disable roll/pitch/yaw on the tailfins before reentry -- SAS doesn't control the tailfins properly on a retrograde reentry. I was trying to make it steerable on reentry, but there's just not enough control authority for that. But basically, I think it does what you want now.

So, some pointers:

If you look at the CoM on your original, compared to the position of your control fins -- there is a problem. They are at exactly the same height on your rocket. This means they have no "lever arm", and can't steer your craft. I noticed you used very large tailfins to try to get some control. But if you move them to the very bottom of your rocket, then you need much smaller ones -- which has several benefits.

You accidentally had 4x symmetry set when you put on your ladders. A bit of extra weight and drag there. And Jeb, when he was standing on the ground, couldn't reach the first rung anyway. When he tried to jump it was so tight that he'd always bonk his head and fall down. So I replaced all the bar ladders with a pair of telescoping ladders. To do that, I had to take the rocket mostly apart -- so it's not quite how you had it.

I was trying to minimize weight to get to LKO. So I took out the monoprop. Also, the 16S antennas do not stack. One of them has exactly the same range as 3 of them. So I reduced the three to one and clipped it to the centerline of the rocket.

Again to reduce mass, I looked at your radiators. The Convertotron has a max cooling of 75kw, and the two small drills are 50kw each. So your medium TCS units were big overkill, and the mediums mass 5 times as much as the smalls. So 4 smalls should be enough, and mass less than one medium.

Additionally, those LT1 legs are pretty fragile for this rocket. The LT2's are much sturdier, and hold more than twice the weight for much less cost. So I'd recommend replacing each pair of LT1s with an LT2.

[NewtSoup]

4 hours ago, bewing said:

Dunno if it's cool.  I don't think I changed the look of it much.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1FZunNmkE3CFg3D6PQ5C0wI9_5Z2y6ddB/view?usp=sharing

It should just be able to get to LKO, if flown perfectly. It follows prograde properly now. If you pump about 100 units of lf + ox into the bottom tanks, it reenters tail first, the way you seem to want. Note that you should disable roll/pitch/yaw on the tailfins before reentry -- SAS doesn't control the tailfins properly on a retrograde reentry. I was trying to make it steerable on reentry, but there's just not enough control authority for that. But basically, I think it does what you want now.

So, some pointers:

If you look at the CoM on your original, compared to the position of your control fins -- there is a problem. They are at exactly the same height on your rocket. This means they have no "lever arm", and can't steer your craft. I noticed you used very large tailfins to try to get some control. But if you move them to the very bottom of your rocket, then you need much smaller ones -- which has several benefits.

You accidentally had 4x symmetry set when you put on your ladders. A bit of extra weight and drag there. And Jeb, when he was standing on the ground, couldn't reach the first rung anyway. When he tried to jump it was so tight that he'd always bonk his head and fall down. So I replaced all the bar ladders with a pair of telescoping ladders. To do that, I had to take the rocket mostly apart -- so it's not quite how you had it.

I was trying to minimize weight to get to LKO. So I took out the monoprop. Also, the 16S antennas do not stack. One of them has exactly the same range as 3 of them. So I reduced the three to one and clipped it to the centerline of the rocket.

Again to reduce mass, I looked at your radiators. The Convertotron has a max cooling of 75kw, and the two small drills are 50kw each. So your medium TCS units were big overkill, and the mediums mass 5 times as much as the smalls. So 4 smalls should be enough, and mass less than one medium.

Additionally, those LT1 legs are pretty fragile for this rocket. The LT2's are much sturdier, and hold more than twice the weight for much less cost. So I'd recommend replacing each pair of LT1s with an LT2.

Nice one  I found that Jeb could jump for the last ladder but that's ok :).    I'd not realised the center fins were on the CoM.   Yeah 4x Symetry has a habit of turning itself back on from no symmetry if you've used it on a part previously.

The reason I've gone with t he LT1 Struts is because the LT2s are Mahoossive and with them on the Drills can't touch the ground.

It does look a little different but that's becuase the tanks have been moved down a bit.  They were also moved outwards a tiny bit and were not touching the craft.  I've moved them back in a touch but left their vertical alignment the same.  Valentina can still climb down the ladder the whole way. 

I'm not perfect - tried a launch to LKO   - PE ..well not nearly sufficient.  I had not considered Kerbin in my definition of mostlyversal.  Flies lovely though

Edited June 7, 2018 by NewtSoup

[Draalo]

On 6/5/2018 at 9:25 PM, NewtSoup said:

And it's keep on checking Kerbnet with the highest level probe core you can use, so that would be the Mk2 Drone Core with anomaly detection at 48%

100% is possible:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/377869516505612291/454522307965091850/unknown.png

[NewtSoup]

7 hours ago, Draalo said:

100% is possible:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/377869516505612291/454522307965091850/unknown.png

Yes, that's what we were discussing.  The Rovemate is designed for rovers and only has a 10km range.  Which means if you put it on an orbiter you have to orbit at 10km for it to be able to see an anomaly.  However what you can do I - or maybe used to be able to do - was put it on a ship alongside one of the standard probe cores which only have to be in orbit.  Then the rovemate's 100% combines with the probe core's range and you discover anomalies every time.  That's the theory anyway.

[mystifeid]

4 hours ago, NewtSoup said:

That's the theory anyway.

Good luck with that.

What has me puzzled is where does the 10km range for the rovemate come from? The part description as well as the wiki mentions a 10 degree FOV but nothing that I can see about a range.

In the second screenshot above the rovemate is at 21346m above an anomaly sitting on ground at 4035m giving it a 17km+ range. Ah, but it had the HECS2 helping it surely.

So I equipped a rover with a rovemate as the only probe core and drove it away from an anomaly. Sure enough, at about the same distance (17km), contact became very sketchy. However this was with LOS (I think - maybe I'd lost it and greater range is possible). If a few hills blocked LOS, contact was lost much sooner.

Edit: So after launching a rovemate straight up from KSC and being able to see the KSC anomaly almost all the way out to Mun orbit, I'm starting to think that the rovemate range is only limited by the SOI. By the time I got to Mun orbit I could also see another eight anomalies and I realized I've been using the rovemate all wrong.

The things that make the rovemate difficult to use are the narrow FOV in a low orbit and when on the surface - loss of line of sight.

Edited June 8, 2018 by mystifeid

[NewtSoup]

@mystifeid - that's all really interesting!  I was given to understand that the rovemate had such a low range only from anecdote.  So with the Rovemate as the only probe core you got pretty much all anomalies on Kerbin at Mun distance out, likely down to the narrow field of view.  I'm betting though that once discovered with the rovemate the anomalies would be visible to a different core.. so perhaps a good combo would be to use the rovemate at far out.  Then a HECS2 or similar as you get closer in for the wider field. 

It is a shame though that the system doesnt work such that probes give a rough location from orbit and then the rovemate is used for pinpoint accuracy once you've landed and uses a forward "radar" with a range up to 10km.  That would be a little like finding resource nodes in Elite Dangerous I suppose.

[mystifeid]

3 hours ago, NewtSoup said:

I was given to understand that the rovemate had such a low range only from anecdote

It's anecdotal alright - I've seen it everywhere.

3 hours ago, NewtSoup said:

So with the Rovemate as the only probe core you got pretty much all anomalies on Kerbin

Don't know - there are ones not listed in the wiki like the commnet ground stations. I've been to one of these - it was like a giant radar dish on the top of a very inaccessible mountain. The easiest way I could see to get to it was to parachute down.

3 hours ago, NewtSoup said:

I'm betting though that once discovered with the rovemate the anomalies would be visible to a different core

Don't bet on it.

3 hours ago, NewtSoup said:

It is a shame though that the system doesnt work such that probes give a rough location from orbit and then the rovemate is used for pinpoint accuracy once you've landed and uses a forward "radar" with a range up to 10km. 

I think the probes only do give a rough location from orbit but the rovemate is the devil to use on the ground particularly sometimes if you have terrain scatters turned on. However the game does let you zoom out and scan quite a large area around you.

This is very easy to try yourself but here are a couple of screenshots. The kerbnet scans are all taken with a 10 degree FOV but bear in mind you can always drop back to 5 degree.

Here is a KSC anomaly at 200km. Note that the squarish shape of the KSC peninsula in clearly visible. I think I blew up the one in front of the VAB so if that is the monolith it seems to be showing some error in its position. (Also this anomaly does not come into view until above 6km.)

1000km and an anomaly is seen on the island airfield to the east (east is at the top of the kerbnet scan) and a monolith? (unvisited) to the west.

4000km and a couple more are just coming into view.

6300km and the whole planet is visible at 10 degree FOV. All up ten anomalies can be seen.

 

[putnamto]

Scan  for  resources, I  think , Im  still  planning  my  mission  to  put  one  near  the  mun

[mystifeid]

18 minutes ago, putnamto said:

Scan  for  resources, I  think , Im  still  planning  my  mission  to  put  one  near  the  mun

Well, if you want to quickly find all the anomalies (not resources) on the mun, put a rovemate in a 2000km orbit with a 180° inclination. Mark all the ones near the equator with waypoints then shift to a 90° inclination to accurately fix the locations of the ones near the poles. I was wondering how long it was going to take to find the one I was missing before this thread existed. Using this method, I found it straight away.